14" Rough-In Toilet Choices

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by cgskiking, Sep 30, 2009.

  1. calvin

    calvin New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Amherst, MA
    From my visits to the low-humidity NW, I suspect that New England summers are closer to Alaskan ones than to those in WA or OR.
  2. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

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    14,819
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    Well I haven't had anyone posting from the East Coast saying that they are having sweating issues with new toilets either. The old five gallon tanks were the worst.

    When you're only pulling 1.5 gallons from the pipes in the home, it would be rare that you would even have cold water.
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2011
  3. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,834
    Location:
    New England
    If the toilet is flushed repeatedly, even with insulation, the tank can get cold enough to sweat. If you have a deep well, the incoming water may be cold enough, but it gets tempered by sitting in the bladder pressure tank. I don't have sweating, but then I run my central a/c throughout the summer, which helps by lowering the humidity levels. But, if you don't run the a/c, the standing water in the tank will be hotter, so even when you mix cold water with it on a refill, it may not drop to the dew point. If you're remodeling, consider running hot to the toilet and then using a tempering valve so it stays above the dew point...then, your choice of toilet expands considerably.
  4. calvin

    calvin New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Amherst, MA
    Thanks for those suggestions.

    Unfortunately, we don't have central A/C nor are we planning a remodel per se. We started off just trying to fix the rotten subfloor, and it's turned out to be much more complicated and potentially expensive than we expected.

    We did add a tempering valve last month (that's the same as a mixing valve, right?), which solved the problem until the serious humidity hit last week. I think it would work more effectively if the hot water heater were closer to the bathroom, but that's something we're interested in changing.
  5. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

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    Location:
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    Yeah, the last week or so the heat and humidity were really nasty! One nice thing that may resolve the long distance to the WH is a retrofit hot water recirculation system. There are a bunch of them out there, fairly easy to install, and should solve that problem and make hot to the shower and sinks faster, too.
  6. calvin

    calvin New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Amherst, MA
    That's something to consider--thanks!
  7. crcurtis

    crcurtis New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    Hi Terry,

    I was posting my problem in another thread - http://www.terrylove.com/forums/sho...s.-Aquia-II-vs.-Aquia-III&p=317765#post317765 (obviously the wrong thread), however upon checking your comments in this thread it appears that you are dealing with my situation.

    For that Aquia II Toilet to be over 3 3/4" from the wall, I must assume the rough in is at least 14" away from the wall, which means I need to use one of the above or something similar that uses the Unifit 14" adapter. I will have the plumber pull the toilet and measure.

    So:
    1. Am I likely to correct that the rough-in is out this far?

    2. Which toilet should I go with. I have Carlyle II's in my other units BUT they are more costly. BTW, in Vancouver we need to use either Dual Flush or the High Performance 1.2GPF. I only ever use Toto as I find for the $ nobody comes close to quality; though I do not want to start a discussion on this subject :) If I have to upgrade to the Carlyle II I guess I will have to charge the plumber for the screw up & the upcharge??
  8. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,819
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    That's pretty far out. I would say at least 14"

    Seattle pricing on the Vespin II is $399.99 plus $49.99 for the 14" Unifit.
    That gets you into Watersense with the 1.28, skirted bowl that allows moving the bowl back closer to the wall, Sanagloss and double cyclone. It also has the taller height like the Aquia III.
    It sounds like a win to me.
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2011
  9. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,311
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    Take it from someone who knows, you can't beat Terry's delivery service! You don't need to pull the toilet to measure your rough-in. Just measure from the finished wall to the flange bolts.
  10. consumerac

    consumerac New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    ca
    if measure from wall to flange bolt and it is 14" do I need a 12" or 14" rough in toilet? The person that came to auger from plumbing company said toilet needs to be replaced probably and to get a 12" rough in toilet. Insight would be appreciated.
  11. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,819
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    If you have 14" from the bolts to the wall, then you can use either the 12, which sticks out from the wall a ways, or a 14" rough.
  12. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,834
    Location:
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    Most toilets are designed with some gap behind them to the wall when they are on the 'design' rough-in. SO, if you take a 12" rough-in toilet and move it out 2", the gap will be at LEAST 2", and could be nearly double that as some 12" rough toilets can have anywhere from 1/4" to 1-3/4" gap behind them. If the extra space behind and the sticking out an extra 2" isn't a problem, then a 12" toilet rough-in will work just as well as that same toilet on a 14" rough-in. Not all toilets are created equal. Toto tends to be very consistent with good design and easily found parts, if they ever need it.
  13. JLCREMODELING

    JLCREMODELING New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Duluth, MN
    Looking for 14" Rough In Shallow Depth Toilet - HELP!!!!

    Old existing toilet was a American Standard 4049 circa 1970's - From what I can find its depth was 26" (Unsure if that was from the wall or the size of the toilet).

    The owners have an in swinging door into the bathroom. I noticed that the old door had been notched out just a 1/2" on the interior side of the bathroom so the door would miss the bowl/seat.

    Rough in is 14"
    Floor is tile over a thick mortar bed so an offset flange is not an option plumbing wise.
    Owners do not want to change the swing of the door. They would like to find a toilet that fits this area.
    The owners had pulled the old toilet and put it by the trash cans and it was hauled away so fixing the old toilet is not an option.
    A 12" Rough in is not an option as the homeowners would not like to see the gap behind the toilet to the wall.

    I have spent hours searching around to find a toilet that will fit here but am running out of options for a 14" Rough In.

    Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!!

    Thanks for your time.
    Last edited: May 6, 2012
  14. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,834
    Location:
    New England
    You need to know the distance from the finished wall (not baseboard) to the door edge, then view lots of spec sheets. Most 14" toilets are just 12" ones with thicker tanks to fill in the gap. Some Totos that use the UniFit adapter, use the same toilet and use a different adapter to move the toilet, so their length remains the same, regardless of the rough-in. But most of those are likely too long (they're all elongated) to fit.

    A 12" rough toilet would just stick out 2" more than normal, it won't be shorter.
  15. rbaldwi

    rbaldwi New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    Shortest possible length on a 14" rough in.

    I just discovered this website and it seems to be an awsome resource. I'm remodeling a 120 year old Victorian with a very tight bathroom. I need a toilet with a 14" rough in with a maximum 26.5" length to conform to code clearance. Obviously a round bowl. Finding one is the issue and price is secondary. Any ideas? Thanks a lot.
  16. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,311
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    I'd suggest you go to "Toilet Review" at the top of this page. Then "Shopping" and finally "Toto Toilets". Toto has several toilets that use their Unifit Adapter that will fit these select toilets to 10", 12" and 14" rough-in just by changing the adapter. These adapters are exclusive to Toto and only the select models. No other manufacture has anything like these. Just scroll through the numerous models listed and find the ones that use the Unifit adapter.
  17. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,776
    Location:
    New York, NY
    The unifit might give you enough room for an elongated bowl, because it moves the whole toilet back.

    Edit: You know, I didn't read the dimensions carefully enough. I'm wondering what would work in the Toto line even if the rough-in was 12". The Drake round bowl is 26 3/8" just for the unit, and another 1/2" or more behind it, when placed on a 12" rough-in. On a 14", forget making 26 1/2" (you're saying that's from finished wall to front of toilet, right?). As Jim notes below, most of the Unifit-using Totos are at least 28" just for the unit.
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2012
  18. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,834
    Location:
    New England
    I haven't checked, but am doubing any of the Totos that use the Unifit (which are all elongated bowls) is meets your projection dimensions. You may have a very difficult task of finding one that does...most manufactuers 14" rough-ins are 12" rough-ins with thicker tanks to fill the voild by the wall. The only one I've seen that makes a toilet that is exactly the samp projection from the wall with a 10, 12, or 14" rough-in is Toto, and those use their Unifit adapter.
  19. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,819
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    That sounds nearly impossible. Normally the shortest "new" toilet I've been able to find is 28-3/4" on a 14" rough, and that's using a TOTO with a 14" Unifit.

    Many of the older 1920 homes used a tank on the wall and a small round bowl connected by a chrome tube.
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2012
  20. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,776
    Location:
    New York, NY
    Interesting. I'm actually kind of confused by the poster's measurements, because, as we all know, the length of the toilet itself doesn't tell you anything about how much clearance it is going to have between itself and the wall in front of it. What he really should be telling us is how much room he has forward of the center of the closet flange, because obviously he has plenty of room behind if it's a 14" rough-in.

    If he doesn't care about the gap between the toilet and the finished wall behind it, then one option that may fit [let's not talk about whether it will flush well, just whether it will fit] is the Kohler Rialto.

    I did a little research after seeing this post, and I'm pretty sure that Rialto is the most compact commercially-available [i.e. non-custom] unit, measuring 25 1/4" from back of tank to front of bowl. More importantly, perhaps, for this gentleman's installation, is the measurement forward of the closet flange. From the center of the closet flange forward (i.e. into the dimension that he is concerned about), the Rialto is about 14 1/8". Maybe that will do it for him.

    The thing's a lowboy. And it's a Kohler. As the renter of an old AS lowboy (the Galleria), I can't say I have too much hope for the flush... But you guys probably know better...

    [edit: got math wrong and fixed it]
    http://www.us.kohler.com/webassets/kpna/catalog/pdf/en/114504_4.pdf
    28-1/8" on a 14" rough
    Back of tank 2-7/8" to wall.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 4, 2012
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