1. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Occupation:
    Plumber, self employed
    Location:
    Licensed Grump
    Installed a stove today, the customer has two adorable kids, both under the age of five.
    I made a concerted effort to make absolutely sure the no-tip bracket was in place and worked.
    It was a pain in the butt, a hotpoint..kinda like threading a needle without being able to see it if the cabinets aren't square, even the customer commented "It's no wonder there wasn't one on my last stove".
    There are two main types, the ones the grab the foot of the stove as it slides in, the ones that catch a small metal nub so the stove won't tip (I don't like these).
    If you have children, make sure your stove has one, if a kid were to open the stove and sit on the door...well you get the picture.
     
  2. Pewterpower

    Pewterpower New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2006
    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Tampa
    Grandchildren, too!!

    When I replaced the pergo floor with ceramic a few years ago, the wife asked why I would bother drilling into the tile, just to attach the no-tip. After all, we didn't have liitle ones anymore. ;)
     
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  4. Cookie

    Cookie .

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2005
    Location:
    Home
    What do I look for to see if mine has one? It is only about a year old, do the installers do that automatically? I always have the neighbors kid in here, plus my friends and their kids.
     
  5. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2004
    Occupation:
    Retired Systems engineer for defense industry.
    Location:
    New England
    If you can grab the back end of the thing and tip it, they didn't install the anti-tip safety feature. My guess is that they don't install it, which should be a crime.
     
  6. Cookie

    Cookie .

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2005
    Location:
    Home
    I can do that. :D

    Jad, they didn't. So, what do I do? Will they come out and do that?
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2007
  7. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

    Joined:
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    Plumber, self employed
    Location:
    Licensed Grump

    Cookie...you call them first thing tomorrow tell them to get their butts out there!
    It actually IS a crime!
    They charge you to put it in....you get what you payed for...UPC requires no-tips...PERIOD!
     
  8. Cookie

    Cookie .

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2005
    Location:
    Home
    Will do. Will let you know.
     
  9. Dunbar Plumbing

    Dunbar Plumbing Master Plumber

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Occupation:
    Service Plumber, Outdoor Temperature Relief Owner
    Location:
    Northern Kentucky/Greater Cincinnati Area
    100% of the time I am called to hook a gas line to these units, not install the stove itself.

    I believe that is what the delivery guys are responsible for? (Replace unit and hook back up to gas supply ONLY if proper/adequate connection is available. Please clarify that gray area. I can understand that the gas line will make the device operational instantly and therefore warrant the device useless beforehand.

    I don't do many of these anymore but if there's a possibility of liability relating to that clip back on the plumber for installing a gas line, I'll require the homeowner to have that task completed before I come out to hook the gas up.
     
  10. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Licensed Grump
    It's our responsibility.
    It's in the code.
    I know they're a pain in the butt...but I couldn't sleep knowing there were kids in the house
     
  11. Dunbar Plumbing

    Dunbar Plumbing Master Plumber

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Occupation:
    Service Plumber, Outdoor Temperature Relief Owner
    Location:
    Northern Kentucky/Greater Cincinnati Area
    Save the children is a given. Melodramatics don't count in my request for knowledge.


    You didn't answer my question.

    I assume you keep a box of various clips for all makes and models of stoves so that when you service the stove, upon discovery you notice there is no tip clip. Is that what you are implying? The same logic should apply whether you are replacing a gas line on an existing stove with a no-tip clip or a brand new one; both can cause harm to little wee ones. That's why I want to know. (Should plumbers be demanding tip clips be installed on all EXISTING stoves since we are the one moving that device around to repair)

    I'd like to see the code reference to your statement where it implies the licensed plumber is liable for setup/install of the stove when called out for a simple gas line hookup.

    It's early in the morning so take your time and enjoy your coffee.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2007
  12. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Occupation:
    disabled-retired industrial fabricator
    Location:
    200 miles south of Little Rock
    This is the first I have ever heard of "no-tips" ...

    How did we older folks ever survive this long?

    Seat belts, helmets, car seats and now "no-tips" ...

    ... now maybe even mindless people can make it from cradle to grave, eh?!

    Maybe we should all just go back to buggies and having stoves that take two strong men to move.
     
  13. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2004
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Wherever I park the motorhome.
    Dittos.

    Any parent grandparent or babysitter aunt uncle neighbor etc. that can not discipline children to make them stay off the stove needs to be charged with dereliction of duty and child abuse....

    Kids can not be watched 24/7 and adults that do not teach them right from wrong (the stove door is NOT a seat even when there is a "No Tip") is actually setting the kids up for future harm because they will lack common sense and problem solving ability.
     
  14. Pewterpower

    Pewterpower New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2006
    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Tampa
    That logic (which I tend to agree with more than this post is about to imply) can be applied to alot of things. i.e, Helmet laws, Seat belt laws, Child car seats, fences around pools, etc.......
    But those laws are enacted because of idiots who do not know any better, and most importantly, even under the most watchful eye, accidents will happen.
    Every new stove comes with one of those No-Tips. They have been for years now. It's just a clip that secures to the floor and grabs one of the legs as the stove is slid back into place.
    Every time some bozo hurts himself doing something stupid, some other dork says, "There oughtta be law......." Like the warning label on a pack of ciggs.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2007
  15. Cookie

    Cookie .

    Joined:
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    Location:
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    When I first read this here about the no tip I figured it would be the responsiblity of the installer. In my case, when I replaced the stove I found out there was no shut off there so I got the old stove out, the plumber came did his work, then the installer came with the new stove.

    I got to tell you I that I had never heard of this but boy does it make sense to me. Reason being when my youngest was small he had pulled the dishwasher over on himself. My husband and just bought it, uncrated it and sat it in the kitchen. It was not yet connected. Well, as fate would have it, along comes young son does exactly as was described here and the thing fell over onto him and his chest. Well, he was miraculously unhurt other than the square shaped marking on his chest but, it had taken years off of our lives getting him to the hospital. I don't think my husband ever felt so badly about anything in his life.

    It got connected immediately.
     
  16. geniescience

    geniescience Homeowner

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2005
    Occupation:
    ditto
    Location:
    humid summers hot, humid winters cold
    a large chest of drawers, full of clothes (a "bureau" in the north of New England) -- have you ever seen one of those fall onto a child pulling on the handles of one of the drawers? Happens when one of the drawers is left slightly open. Attracts kids' attention, gets pulled.

    I noticed that IKEA furniture always comes with tags at the top that are to be screwed into the wall. IKEA furniture is slim so it is more prone to falling over like that.

    David
     
  17. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Occupation:
    Plumber, self employed
    Location:
    Licensed Grump
    It IS in the code.
    Stating it's overkill is like stating lead paint removal is overkill.
    As far as keeping an eye on your kids...anyone have a 3 yr old, able to actually keep them in one place while your changing the laundry, doing dishes?
    Try this...
    Open the door of your stove (a 3 year old can) put something that weighs about 50 lbs on it.
    The stove topples and the 50 lb object is trapped ...imagine a child jumping on that door while the oven is on preheat @ 350. while you run to get the phone, answer the door, check the mail.
    I install them, I sleep.
     
  18. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Occupation:
    disabled-retired industrial fabricator
    Location:
    200 miles south of Little Rock
    I do not recall the name of the city, but just yesterday I heard about some new law somewhere saying people may not jump/dive into the water from bridges and such.

    It is simply not possible to make enough laws to make common sense and good judgment unnecessary.

    Grumpy: I certainly have no objection to people having anything and/or even everything attached to walls -- all of my phones are attached there -- but I cannot abide the idea that some new law is now the greatest thing to come along since sliced bread.

    A few years ago, a woman near here where I happen to live turned on her oven to preheat it ... forgetting she had stashed her handgun in there so a grandchild who was too small to open the door would not be able to get to it ... then a bullet went off and came through the glass and killed the grandchild ... I truly grieve for both of them ... and now maybe ovens also need metal-detecting interlocks?
     
  19. Cookie

    Cookie .

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2005
    Location:
    Home
    I am just curious, I hope you don't mind, but, were you trying to be funny? Or are you serious?
     
  20. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Occupation:
    Plumber, self employed
    Location:
    Licensed Grump
    Seatbelts, child safety seats...anyone who's about to hit another car should know enough to grab their children and brace them first.
     
  21. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Occupation:
    disabled-retired industrial fabricator
    Location:
    200 miles south of Little Rock
    My mention of metal-detecting interlocks was sarcastic rhetoric intended to sober people to the idea of personal responsibility rather than to mindlessly believe the gub'ment will ultimately protect and provide for everyone.

    One of my brothers taught me how to ride a motorcycle, and he told me the same staying-alive policy his own mentor had first told him:

    "If you ever get hurt ... it is your own fault, and there are no exceptions."

    I rode for 40 years and yet live, thereby proving that old man right ... and my worst injury ever happened while I was sitting completely still in the doorway of a barn and trying to put on that insufferable helmet.
     

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