Cacher_Chick
Test, Don't Guess!
The drain must be routed in such a way that the vent riser will take off vertically, with no less than 45 degrees in pitch.
Moving Drain (& supply lines in the way) for shower
- Thread starter Hiperco
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Hiperco
Member
First, thanks to everyone for the input. This has turned out to be quite a discussion and learning experience. 
I'm confused by some of the advice in the most recent posts.
1). Flat vents are OK from what I've read. Since this is the only fixture on this branch I don't think there will be an issue. It is a puzzle to even get a flat vent to work though with the space I have. Need to go look at some more fittings
2). Why is everyone so against an AAV in this application? To be honest, this unvented branch has worked without issue for 30 years. I do want to improve the situation while I have the wall and floor open, bur also I need to finish this project some time this decade
3) I'd rather replace an AAV every few years for the rest of my life instead of cutting a hole in the roof and having it leak even once.
4). Why would the attic be a better place for the AAV? It's very dusty up there, and sucking dust can't be good for it. Plus climbing up there to inspect/replace is much harder than opening up an access panel in the closet.
All for now, appreciate the help
I'm confused by some of the advice in the most recent posts.
1). Flat vents are OK from what I've read. Since this is the only fixture on this branch I don't think there will be an issue. It is a puzzle to even get a flat vent to work though with the space I have. Need to go look at some more fittings
2). Why is everyone so against an AAV in this application? To be honest, this unvented branch has worked without issue for 30 years. I do want to improve the situation while I have the wall and floor open, bur also I need to finish this project some time this decade
3) I'd rather replace an AAV every few years for the rest of my life instead of cutting a hole in the roof and having it leak even once.
4). Why would the attic be a better place for the AAV? It's very dusty up there, and sucking dust can't be good for it. Plus climbing up there to inspect/replace is much harder than opening up an access panel in the closet.
All for now, appreciate the help
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Proper vents last the life of the system, AAVs do not.
I'm sure you have good intentions but most home-owners, even ones who are handy, wont replace an AAV every few years... they will bury it in a wall and forget all about it.
I'm sure you have good intentions but most home-owners, even ones who are handy, wont replace an AAV every few years... they will bury it in a wall and forget all about it.
Hiperco
Member
If you look at the roof now, you will see maybe ten things there and none of them leak.
It takes a plumber almost no time at all to flash in a new vent. I used to install up to eight a day without giving it much thought.
The parts to go through the roof are less then the AAV.
On this forum, you will tend to get advice as to the best way of doing things.
Yes, you can just leave it alone. You can also go outside. Heck, when I visit other countries their plumbing is horrible. But then you don't drink the water there and entires cities stink.
It's depressingly horrible when you visit. Many of the people living there don't have a way to cover an opening in the wall. We use windows. But it's always been that way for those people. They don't know any better, they don't have books, they don't have plumbers, they just get sick a lot. And they have gotten "used" to how their home or city smells.
When I lived in Redmond in the 70's, there were more cattle and horses. I was the connoisseur of manure. I knew I was home by the smell. Hey, it had always been like that anyway.
It takes a plumber almost no time at all to flash in a new vent. I used to install up to eight a day without giving it much thought.
The parts to go through the roof are less then the AAV.
On this forum, you will tend to get advice as to the best way of doing things.
Yes, you can just leave it alone. You can also go outside. Heck, when I visit other countries their plumbing is horrible. But then you don't drink the water there and entires cities stink.
It's depressingly horrible when you visit. Many of the people living there don't have a way to cover an opening in the wall. We use windows. But it's always been that way for those people. They don't know any better, they don't have books, they don't have plumbers, they just get sick a lot. And they have gotten "used" to how their home or city smells.
When I lived in Redmond in the 70's, there were more cattle and horses. I was the connoisseur of manure. I knew I was home by the smell. Hey, it had always been like that anyway.
But if the trap never siphons, then who cares
People who take pride in their work care...
I can't make you care, but if it were my house, or my name on the work, I would.
Hiperco
Member
Will this be found pleasing to the plumbing gods? (Not glued yet
)Any tips/tricks on getting the trap level so the drain stub is level?
Hopefully everything goes together as you have it cut up to fit there, the solvent actually acts as a lubricant for the fittings and the pipe will push into them further when you go to glue this up... This type of piping is not meant to be "dry-fitted".
Hiperco
Member
Thanks for the reminder, I did remember that and will check the last pipe (at the trap) before gluing and make it longer if needed.
Any comments on the design?
Any comments on the design?
Cacher_Chick
Test, Don't Guess!
I am not familiar with the details of your plumbing code, but a flat vent installed in that manner is strictly prohibited here.
Hiperco
Member
According to NY State Code,
905.3 Vent connection to drainage system. Every dry vent connecting to a horizontal drain shall connect above the centerline of the horizontal drain pipe.
I believe I have achieved this. I don't see anything else that would indicate that a flat vent is not allowed.
905.3 Vent connection to drainage system. Every dry vent connecting to a horizontal drain shall connect above the centerline of the horizontal drain pipe.
I believe I have achieved this. I don't see anything else that would indicate that a flat vent is not allowed.
Jadziedzic
Active Member
OT, but related to your job: Just for kicks, look up "bundling" in the National Electrical Code.
You're going to make him lose his mind, lol.
Cacher_Chick
Test, Don't Guess!
905.4 Vertical rise of vent. Every dry vent shall rise vertically to a minimum of 6 inches (152 mm) above the flood level rim of the highest trap or trapped fixture being vented.
905.5 Height above fixtures. A connection between a vent pipe and a vent stack or stack vent shall be made at least 6 inches (152 mm) above the flood level rim of the highest fixture served by the vent. Horizontal vent pipes forming branch vents, relief vents or loop vents shall be at least 6 inches (152 mm) above the flood level rim of the highest fixture served.
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Hiperco
Member
No problem, its going to the attic before termination to an AAV
This isn't going to terminate to anything except an AAV and it is alone, so I don't think its a branch, relief, or loop. (But I could be wrong
)
Cacher_Chick
Test, Don't Guess!
I'm sorry to drag this out but you are ignoring the key words "SHALL RISE VERTICALLY".
This means it is not allowed to run horizontally until it is higher than 6" above the flood rim of the highest trapped fixture on the vent.
I understand that you are fighting with this idea, but it is common and proper plumbing.
This means it is not allowed to run horizontally until it is higher than 6" above the flood rim of the highest trapped fixture on the vent.
I understand that you are fighting with this idea, but it is common and proper plumbing.
Hiperco
Member
I disagree, "SHALL RISE VERTICALLY to a minimum of 6 inches above the flood rim" describes the termination point.
Anyone else care to weigh in?
Anyone else care to weigh in?
You disagree with what?
We have been stating this fact over and over since you started this thread, the vent must be vertical and cannot go flat/horizontal until it is above the flood level rim of the highest fixture.
A flat vent under the floor doesn't meet this code requirement.
We have been stating this fact over and over since you started this thread, the vent must be vertical and cannot go flat/horizontal until it is above the flood level rim of the highest fixture.
A flat vent under the floor doesn't meet this code requirement.
Hiperco
Member
- I don't see anything in the NY code that's been quoted as prohibiting a flat vent. (This vent pipe is not connecting to a stack vent, but if it ever did it will be well above the flood rim since it will terminate in the attic.)
- I have seen posts by others suggesting that the UPC allows flat venting in some situations. If someone has the UPC and can share what it says regarding flat venting I'd appreciate it
- I don't see a practical way of solving this challenge with a vent that is purely vertical, given my existing construction. And code aside for a moment, what bad thing(s) could happen with the vent running horizontal for <2 feet as I'm proposing?
- I have seen posts by others suggesting that the UPC allows flat venting in some situations. If someone has the UPC and can share what it says regarding flat venting I'd appreciate it
- I don't see a practical way of solving this challenge with a vent that is purely vertical, given my existing construction. And code aside for a moment, what bad thing(s) could happen with the vent running horizontal for <2 feet as I'm proposing?
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