Pay for Subdrive 150 - or?

[newmexmike]

Franklin Subdrive 150 failed (probably lightning transient) with short circuit - fault 6. Disconnected motor and same fault at startup every time. Removed drive and inspected - but no evidence of damage (like Fault 5 code). TS guide says 'replace drive'. Drives a 1.5 hp pump-3/4 hp Franklin motor (or so I'm told until driller gets back with details). Replace Subdrive with another more reasonable VFD or phase convertor? Driller seems to think not - Terry's forum is about the only discourse that delves into this. What's so special about Subdrive - that there's no affordable replacement system - without dealing with 3-phase sub pump/motor setup in casing? Sorta seems like a insidious scheme when well is installed - to save bucks on parts (pump/motor sizing and cabling) - to charge in labor. Could be I'm just inna funk because another 2 grand Subdrive is galling me at the moment. Seems this has been a previous topic - but without resolution - that I've been able to find. Sure would appreciate more insight. Well system just fills 15-20% of slightly uphill 2500 gal tank - every few days - which gravity flows to Grunfos booster inside of house (~100 ft away) - which provides water on demand. Onna bummer. Thanks much for any replies - or a referral to any other solution!!

 

[Valveman]

Things like this make me ashamed to be a pump man. All you needed in the well was a regular 5 GPM, 1/2HP pump, which cost maybe 400-500 bucks. There is absolutely no reason to have a Subdrive VFD on a well pump that feeds a cistern storage tank. Subdrive VFD's are made to vary the pump flow to match the usage, and with a cistern there is no varying of flow. Call driveswarehouse.com. They have a $300 VFD you can use to convert single phase to three phase that will replace the Subdrive. You don't even need a transducer or PID loop. The only reason you need the VFD at all is to convert single phase house power to the three phase to run the three phase motor you got stuck with on a Subdrive setup. You might be better off switching to a regular single phase pump/motor now, because I don't know how much longer the motor will last. VFD's are also very hard on motors. VFD's take regular 230 volts and send over 1000 volt spikes to the motor, which is just how they work.

Also the Grundfos "on demand" pump you have in the cistern is another mortgage maker for a pump man. That MQ pump is designed to fail in a short time, so you have to buy another one of those as well. If you have put in a 5GS05 regular well pump and a J10S regular jet pump, you would not have been out of water and it would not have cost you another dime for 30 years. That is why the pump man pushes Subdrives and MQ pumps.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[newmexmike]

Things like this make me ashamed to be a pump man. All you needed in the well was a regular 5 GPM, 1/2HP pump, which cost maybe 400-500 bucks. There is absolutely no reason to have a Subdrive VFD on a well pump that feeds a cistern storage tank. Subdrive VFD's are made to vary the pump flow to match the usage, and with a cistern there is no varying of flow. Call driveswarehouse.com. They have a $300 VFD you can use to convert single phase to three phase that will replace the Subdrive. You don't even need a transducer or PID loop. The only reason you need the VFD at all is to convert single phase house power to the three phase to run the three phase motor you got stuck with on a Subdrive setup. You might be better off switching to a regular single phase pump/motor now, because I don't know how much longer the motor will last. VFD's are also very hard on motors. VFD's take regular 230 volts and send over 1000 volt spikes to the motor, which is just how they work.

Also the Grundfos "on demand" pump you have in the cistern is another mortgage maker for a pump man. That MQ pump is designed to fail in a short time, so you have to buy another one of those as well. If you have put in a 5GS05 regular well pump and a J10S regular jet pump, you would not have been out of water and it would not have cost you another dime for 30 years. That is why the pump man pushes Subdrives and MQ pumps.

ValveMan/Cary-

You've restored my faith in pump men - and I appreciate your comments to the MAX. Think the only important thing I didn't mention - is that it is a deep well - around 740 ft to static level and I believe hole was drilled to 840 ft. This might make a single phase pump/motor wiring quite a bit more expensive due to gauge and run? But since this setup has mostly worked over the last 12 years minus (2) Subdrives and a motor - believe I'll leave it as is til the bottom end goes bad again - pump/motor sizing seems to have served well enough. When next major no H2O event happens, I'll be insisting on single phase motor/pump combo - maybe larger with adequate wire gauge - standard control box with CSV if necessary. Not sure about CSV because not really using constant pressure design. I'm a bit out the way from Lubbock - or you'd be my only go-to well specialists. Ever going to the White Mts in AZ through Springerville - my house is your house. Thanks much for your time and informed opinion!!

 

[Valveman]

Larger wire for a regular single phase motor would have cost much less than two Subdrives and a motor over 12 years. And no you don't need a CSV on the well pump anymore than you need that VFD. But a CSV on a regular jet pump would have been much better than the "on demand" MQ Grundfos pump. If that one has lasted twelve years consider yourself very lucky.

 

[NMBuilder505]

NewMexMike, I'm also from NM and had a similar issue with my Franklin Electric SubDrive 150, except we didn't have a lightening strike. It just failed for no apparent reason. I suspect the fan burnt out or it overheated for some reason.

Nonetheless, I’m super upset to know that my only option is to purchase another unit for close to $2,500. Ours lasted 4 years, which some might think is worthwhile, however, I simply do not. That is $750 a year, which is too much to have to account for on an annual basis.

Does anyone have any insights on repair options?

I checked with Franklin and they won't repair these units since they use a circuit board. I just can't understand why they wouldn't offer some sort of repair or replacement service where it can be sent in for a fee? I am even more surprised that with as many that seem to be failing, Franklin hasn’t resolved the issues that are causing the failure, such as a circuit interrupter or temperature fail-safe? I have no idea what the issue was, but even my cell phone has better fail-safes in place!

 

[Reach4]

Nonetheless, I’m super upset to know that my only option is to purchase another unit for close to $2,500. Ours lasted 4 years, which some might think is worthwhile, however, I simply do not. That is $750 a year, which is too much to have to account for on an annual basis.

Re-read the first paragraph of #2 on this thread.

 

[Boycedrilling]

Sometimes it is just the fan that goes bad on a sub drive. In fact, we have to check and see if the fan has gone bad for warranty purposes. The fan can be checked with a 9volt battery. If the fan is bad, that’s all that the distributor will warranty to the dealer. If the fan is still good, then the distributor will warranty the entire sub drive. Of course the warranty is only 3 years on electronics now.

 

[Valveman]

The cooling fan has always been one of the big problems with VFD's. A VFD makes a lot of heat, which means it is wasting a lot of energy, but also means it needs lots of cooling. The fan either quits, gets clogged with lint, dirt, bugs, etc., and fails to cool the VFD. In hot climates many times just a fan is not adequate to keep the VFD cool. I have a VFD on my plastic injection machine. It is running a positive displacement hydraulic pump, which is a good application for a VFD. However, I had to cut a hole in the cabinet, and duct in a window unit refrigerated air conditioner to keep the VFD working. I have a customer in Mexico who says the air conditioners he uses to keep the VFD room cool use more energy than the pump system they control.