My brand new toilet keeps leaking

Users who are viewing this thread

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
A garden hose for several minutes would check for a blockage. Its not like dropping 2 gallons in 2 seconds, but it can make up for that with time.


So maybe it started like this: https://www.hardwareandtools.com/ch...h-adjustable-metal-ring-spigot-udgb-4995.html

A problem with that idea is that I think Ohio typically uses PVC drain lines rather than ABS. So it seems unlikely that somebody glued an ABS closet flange into PVC.

s-l225.jpg


In your photos, the top of the black seems to be at about the same level as the red ring. Then it seems to be about the same level as the top of the white spacer. Is that just the angle of the photos, or what?
I believe that is exactly the flange I have. My drain pipes are all ABS (with the same company name on them, Charlotte Pipe Company).
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
In your photos, the top of the black seems to be at about the same level as the red ring. Then it seems to be about the same level as the top of the white spacer. Is that just the angle of the photos, or what?
That is just angle of photo...when I add the spacer, the middle black portion is now below the spacer.
 

Reach4

Well-Known Member
Messages
38,892
Reaction score
4,436
Points
113
Location
IL
That part makes sense now. When you go to a store that sells drain pipes in your area, is it stocked with white PVC or black ABS? I would think PVC for Ohio. That is not relevant, but I am curious. If you have ABS drain pipes, you have ABS, regardless of what is common in your area.

I would try the hose through the window for several minutes. That will take two people that are in communication.
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
That part makes sense now. When you go to a store that sells drain pipes in your area, is it stocked with white PVC or black ABS? I would think PVC for Ohio. That is not relevant, but I am curious. If you have ABS drain pipes, you have ABS, regardless of what is common in your area.

I would try the hose through the window for several minutes. That will take two people that are in communication.
The box stores here sell both ABS and PVC
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Man I could just kick myself. Check these out:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/qzMVAgWrdhANeUvk1

Didn't discover until just before bed last night. I had been looking around the outlet on bottom of toilet. I haven't tested yet, but I would put money on that being my issue. If it is, that makes me mad at Kohler. It makes sense given where I have seen the water after pulling the toilet both times.
 

WJcandee

Wise One
Messages
3,181
Reaction score
170
Points
63
Location
New York, NY
Let's hope it's that simple! Congratulations on your successful sleuthing!

Maybe time to buy a Toto! (Just kidding -- Terry likes Kohler stuff, too. But there's something special about Toto's QC.)
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Let's hope it's that simple! Congratulations on your successful sleuthing!

Maybe time to buy a Toto! (Just kidding -- Terry likes Kohler stuff, too. But there's something special about Toto's QC.)
I was looking at those given all the pub they get on here. Appears I can only get them from plumbing supply stores and wondering if they only sell to contractors/plumbers? Although I am guessing HD won't give me my money back, just an exchange. But we shall see.

I am guessing Kohler won't reimburse me for all the supplies and time I have put into this mess
 

WJcandee

Wise One
Messages
3,181
Reaction score
170
Points
63
Location
New York, NY
You can get Toto a lot of places, at significant discounts off the MSRP that shows on their web site. We just recommend plumbing supply places (which DO sell to the general public, and often at prices better than or as good as online, although some are pricks). We recommend them because once they get the product, you can inspect it there and not take it if it's messed up, which is harder to do with an online supplier. And they pay sales tax, benefit the local community, blah blah. You can look at the Toto web site or other online places to see what the fixtures look like, then look at Terry's web site (this one) to see what his prices are, which you can use as a guide to what's fair.

Home Depot sells a variety of Toto, which you can order in the store and sometimes on their web site. Their prices are a little weird, though. In other words, one toilet may be a very good price compared to the market, while another may be wildly-expensive compared to the market; doesn't seem like they have a standard markup/markdown. So check at least against Terry's prices if you go that route. The Aprons at Home Depot, if you haven't figured it out, aren't a reliable source of information about plumbing, just so you know, so don't expect reliable information from them about toilet brands (or anything else).
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
The Aprons at Home Depot, if you haven't figured it out, aren't a reliable source of information about plumbing, just so you know, so don't expect reliable information from them about toilet brands (or anything else).
I figured this out long ago....
 

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,770
Reaction score
1,190
Points
113
Location
New England
IMHO, Kohler stuff tends to look nice, but are not always the best choice out there for several reasons. They've long been infected with the NIH (not invented here) disease, and often decide to go it alone to try to differentiate themselves from everyone else. Different does not always mean better! And, they tend to keep changing things, which makes finding repair parts sometimes nearly impossible as the only place that is likely to stock them is the factory, if they do at all. Make sure to keep the installation/user manual stuff, as that may be the only way to be able to identify the proper part number, should it ever become required. Then, some of their stuff is not very easy to install - I'm not sure they ever discuss anything with an actual professional plumber to see what works and is reliable. An example on some of their body sprays...when setting them, the tolerance is in the order of 1/16"...try to get your stackup of cement board, maybe waterproofing, thinset and tile to come out to that close tolerance some time...possible, but tedious! Don't even think about changing your mind on the tile involved after the rough-in is done. Then, not all of their stuff actually works well, but that is not usually a problem. As a result, I tend to avoid their stuff.
 

Terry

The Plumbing Wizard
Staff member
Messages
29,942
Reaction score
3,459
Points
113
Location
Bothell, Washington
Website
terrylove.com
IMHO, Kohler stuff tends to look nice, but are not always the best choice out there for several reasons. They've long been infected with the NIH (not invented here) disease, and often decide to go it alone to try to differentiate themselves from everyone else.

I've talked to the head engineer at Kohler and he works pretty hard at coming up with ideas. Like any idea or thought, there will be others out there too. It looks like the bowl on this thread had a bad bowl. That can happen with any brand. That's one reason I like the caulking that goes on white and dries clear. If there is moisture under the bowl, the clear turns back to white and I catch it. Maybe the next day when the homeowners wonders why it's white there, but we do catch it.

k3-056-crop.jpg


Their engineer is in the black shirt. and I'm in the gray looking hard so see if the camera shakes when the press the shutter. At least I wasn't blinking this time.
 
Last edited:

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
IMHO, Kohler stuff tends to look nice, but are not always the best choice out there for several reasons. They've long been infected with the NIH (not invented here) disease, and often decide to go it alone to try to differentiate themselves from everyone else. Different does not always mean better! And, they tend to keep changing things, which makes finding repair parts sometimes nearly impossible as the only place that is likely to stock them is the factory, if they do at all. Make sure to keep the installation/user manual stuff, as that may be the only way to be able to identify the proper part number, should it ever become required. Then, some of their stuff is not very easy to install - I'm not sure they ever discuss anything with an actual professional plumber to see what works and is reliable. An example on some of their body sprays...when setting them, the tolerance is in the order of 1/16"...try to get your stackup of cement board, maybe waterproofing, thinset and tile to come out to that close tolerance some time...possible, but tedious! Don't even think about changing your mind on the tile involved after the rough-in is done. Then, not all of their stuff actually works well, but that is not usually a problem. As a result, I tend to avoid their stuff.
This is a bit off topic, but Samsung is exactly what you describe. They should have stuck with electronics only. Remodeled the kitchen 5 years ago and chose all Samsung appliances. Only the microwave (knock on wood) has not had issues. All the others were worked on (luckily we purchased extended warranty). We have already replaced dishwasher....fridge is next.
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
I've talked to the head engineer at Kohler and he works pretty hard at coming up with ideas. Like any idea or thought, there will be others out there too. It looks like the bowl on this thread had a bad bowl. That can happen with any brand. That's one reason I like the caulking that goes on white and dries clear. If there is moisture under the bowl, the clear turns back to white and I catch it. Maybe the next day when the homeowners wonders why it's white there, but we do catch it.

k3-056-crop.jpg


Their engineer is in the black shirt. and I'm in the gray looking hard so see if the camera shakes when the press the shutter. At least I wasn't blinking this time.
With all the times I have had to pull this toilet, I enjoy the fact the bolts holding the tank onto the bowl are NOT inside the tank....great feature.
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
CONFIRMED, toilet leaks from under bowl from that crack. It seems to leak more when toilet refills vs. during the actual flush process. It is not a huge leak...but it drips drips drips, so that is why it took a couple days each time for it to show up.

Thanks to everyone that replied....in the end it was the simplest of things, one I should have spotted before initial installation. Out of curiosity, has anyone had a toilet leak from a spot that was not so obvious? Wondering if I should do a leak test on new toilet even if I don't see any obvious defects? Would be a PITA...but I don't want to go through this again.
 

dankoos

Member
Messages
71
Reaction score
2
Points
8
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Replacement toilet installed...used two wax rings, one with horn. No immediate leaks. Crossing fingers. I did inspect it and it had no visible issues.
 

hj

Master Plumber
Messages
33,603
Reaction score
1,042
Points
113
Location
Cave Creek, Arizona
Website
www.terrylove.com
The black thing IS the drain fitting. The orange flange was originally snapped on to it and was flush the the top of the "black thing". Something pushed on it and snapped it off the fitting. There are "two piece bolt together" rings that will replace the red one and attach to the black thing properly, although they will be above the floor because the black thing appears to be "too high' but might be okay once the flange is properly attached.
 
Top
Hey, wait a minute.

This is awkward, but...

It looks like you're using an ad blocker. We get it, but (1) terrylove.com can't live without ads, and (2) ad blockers can cause issues with videos and comments. If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads.

If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. We might be able to do something about it. Thanks.
I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks