Mechanical Shutoff before Pressure tank (with low pressure shutoff pressure switch)

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by Timothy Miller, Feb 3, 2021.

  1. Timothy Miller

    Timothy Miller Drip under Pressure =Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    NC
    Question:

    Per the diagram below, I was throwing around the idea of installing a mechanically actuating safety shutoff (that installs on a ball valve) that has an external water sensor that will shut off the ball valve when triggered.

    The pressure switch has a low pressure shutoff, (around 20PSI) that would shut off the well pump should this ball valve be closed in the event of a leak. and should I install a check valve before the "emergency shutoff" ball valve???

    My thought is that this sensor when detecting water on the floor around my well equipment in the basement, would trigger and close the actuating arm on the ball valve, cutting off the water to the house before the pressure tank and pressure switch, and when the pressure falls below the 20PSI mark, the low pressure safety feature on the pressure switch would shut off the submerged well pump***

    OR -should I just place the safety shutoff ball valve on the downstream side of the pressure tank and pressure switch?

    Any insight would be most appreciated.

    My scribbled diagram:
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    That. You should not have a shutoff valve between the well pump and the pressure switch.

    Your diagram did not show up for us. Try a different browser to see what we see if the picture is hosted outside of your house.
     
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  4. Timothy Miller

    Timothy Miller Drip under Pressure =Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    NC
    here it is uploaded a different way... hopefully it shows up
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Timothy Miller

    Timothy Miller Drip under Pressure =Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    NC
    the thought is, if any of my well equipment in the basement springs a leak, the water sensor would trigger the actuator and close the ball valve before the pressure tank and all other equipment. the loss of pressure at the pressure switch would kill the power to the pump then? - has anyone had any experience trying this setup? - thought it would more effectively protect from a leak.... than placing the sensor shutoff past the tank/pressure switch.
     
  6. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    I understand the desire.

    Your diagram shows a check valve. With a submersible pump and precharged pressure tank, you normally don't want a topside check valve. Instead the check valve(s) should be in, or just above, the submersible pump.

    If you do put a valve before the pressure switch, it is important to put a pressure relief valve before that. Have it output to a place where you will notice the water spraying.

    Does that system you are planning offer an auxiliary input that could be fed by a sensor that could detect water on the floor from a softener rupture?
     
  7. Timothy Miller

    Timothy Miller Drip under Pressure =Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    NC
    thanks for the reply and advice...

    there is a pressure relief valve existing just before the tank/pressure switch,..... I had thought to add the check valve so the pump wouldn't have to work to prime if the line from the well is de-pressurized, but I see the wisdom in no check valve topside as a failure of the check valve at the pump in the well would not be detected.

    if I put a check valve topside, I would leave the pressure relief valve before the check valve... (missed that in my diagram)*

    in the event that the low pressure shutoff feature on the pressure switch failed, then the pressure relief valve would save a burst in the line from the pump to the proposed shutoff valve in line before the tank/switch -if the safety valve closed and the pressure built up too much?

    (there is no softener)*
     
  8. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    That, and other reasons. If there is no check valve topside, the piping is pressurized. Thus a small leak cannot suck in contaminates.

    You can remove the innards of many check valves, if that makes things easier for you. While making plans, note that you want the pressure switch to have low flow resistance between it and the input of the pressure tank. A "tank tee" is one way to achieve that.

    Note that if you got a plumbing leak detected, and the valve shut off, you could still spill the contents of the pressure tank at that point. A relay that shut off power to the pump would work as well as a valve before the tank.

    Maybe there is an aux output, where you could turn off the pump with a relay, and have the valve after the pressure tank.

    Low-pressure cutoff switches, with a lever, can be a PITA if you have a power outage. Further, they may not trip off if the well runs dry. If it is not inconvenient, the switch with the lever could potentially be helpful in some situations.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2021
  9. Timothy Miller

    Timothy Miller Drip under Pressure =Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2021
    Location:
    NC
    Awesome insight. Thanks very much

    I will look into a relay controlled power interrupter to the Pressure switch instead.
    If anyone knows of a relay controlled switch for power to a 20amp pressure switch, that would be helpful * THANKS!
     
  10. fitter30

    fitter30 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2020
    Occupation:
    Retired service tech
    Location:
    Peace valley missouri
    Most well systems run 60 lbs of pressure. All piping and components are rated at a minimum of 125 lbs 100% overkill.
    leak detection should encompass a alarm ,kill power to the pump and and valve that would open to drain house/expansion tank.
     
  11. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2006
    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    I use the Samsung Smart Hub, Aeotec Heavy Duty switch. and Samsung leak detectors through out the house. You can have it close a ball valve if you are on city water, but I just have it turn the pump off using the Aeotec switch.
     
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