Help!! New Water Heater Gas and Water Pipes not aligned

[stalion529]

Hi,
I am replaced a 22-year old 75 Gallon AO Smith Water Heater. The Gas black iron pipe currently would end up coming too low and the hot and cold copper pipes are too narrow.

1) For the Gas pipe, my union is on the horizontal after the elbow with sediment trap, if i want to continue with black pipe can i add some elbows on the horizontal run to adjust the height higher? or should i just turn off main outdoor gas valve and replace the verticle 3/4 pipe before the appliance valve and union to adjust the height.

2) The new water heater has narrower openings for the cold/hot on top of the tank. It would be easier to just re-align the pipes near the top of the tank with some elbows etc.. or do i need to keep as many straight lines as possible and extend current lines (some which are against wall and would be hard to cut/solder.

Please see picture attached.

 

[Phog]

In some places, but not all, flex lines are allowed for water heater gas connections, which would be the easiest bet if code allows. If the black pipe needs rejiggering, the drip leg (aka sediment trap) should be as close to the appliance as possible. It's not good to have a bunch of fittings downstream of the drip leg.

For the water, whatever works. You can also use flex lines there in some, but not all, jurisdictions. For a rigid connection, the more fittings added in, the greater the pressure drop through the system. Something to think about if your water pressure is already marginal, but not a concern if you have good pressure.

Soldering copper too close to the WH top connections can melt the plastic dielectric union that comes in most WH hookup nipples these days. A wet rag wrapped around the nipple can help but better yet just solder on the bench & install after things cool down.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[stalion529]

Thanks, Yes my water pressure is good, comes from town and is strong. I'd like to stick to rigid connections. For the gas line am afraid given the layout, there would be no easy way to re-jigger to get the sediment trap closer due to the sewage piping in the way.

Do you guys think its okay to just un-do union, go back downstream a bit to adjust height of verticle 3/4 pipe with new one that will match height and then just re-use the horizontal fittings/connections and sediment trap part.

 

[Jadnashua]

That should work as long as your shutoff actually works. Last time my gas was shut off at the meter, I found that it still leaked though into the supply lines to the house. If that's the case, you need to have good ventilation and get the new piece in there quickly. A call to the gas company probably would have been called for in my case.

 

[stalion529]

thanks for the advice.. yes would look to do it quickly... i believe I will attempt to do that. Swap out that vertical 64" tall 3/4 Black Pipe for a shorter 61" to match the new water heater's thermostat height, and then re-use the horizontal valve/nipples/union.

and then for the water pipes on top, will just need to add some fittings (2 new 90 degree elbows) on both hot and cold to match the new narrower connections.

and then i will re-construct new exhaust with new 3" pvc.


Final question.. there is no drain in the basement, I was just going to put an alarm in the tray. That suffice?

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

You would be wise to just install the flex connectors on both the gas and on the water lines...
many parts of the USA demand them due to movement in the soil and stress on the
gas lines and water lines.....

their is about a 90% chance that you are gonna screw something up on the gas lines from what I
can read between the lines here , it dont sound like you are comfortable with it
..... I suggest just installing the flex line and secure the gas line
to the side of the heater with strapping and metal screws.......


you ought to install the unit in a washing machine pan and put the water alarm in the pan
put the heater up on bricks.....


also it does not look like that thermal expansion tank is secured properly ...I would be more worried
about that versus the solidity of the gas and water lines......



good luck

.

 

[stalion529]

You would be wise to just install the flex connectors on both the gas and on the water lines...
many parts of the USA demand them due to movement in the soil and stress on the
gas lines and water lines.....

their is about a 90% chance that you are gonna screw something up on the gas lines from what I
can read between the lines here , it dont sound like you are comfortable with it
..... I suggest just installing the flex line and secure the gas line
to the side of the heater with strapping and metal screws.......


you ought to install the unit in a washing machine pan and put the water alarm in the pan
put the heater up on bricks.....


also it does not look like that thermal expansion tank is secured properly ...I would be more worried
about that versus the solidity of the gas and water lines......

good luck

Thanks for suggestions. The water expansion is secured and i did all the copper sweating for fitting which some professionals told me looks good. If I was to do flex for gas, where is correct place to connect, right after shut off valve, right? or dimple after union?

Also I bought a round aluminum pan and was planning on resting tank on top of a some Tiles inside the pan instead of bricks

 

[Jadnashua]

If there are things that could be damaged if the WH failed and started to leak, look into a WAGS valve. It shuts the water supply off if water leaks into the pan. https://www.wagsvalve.com/

 

[stalion529]

Thanks for suggestions. The water expansion is secured and i did all the copper sweating for fitting which some professionals told me looks good. If I was to do flex for gas, where is correct place to connect, right after shut off valve, right? or dimple after union?

Also I bought a round aluminum pan and was planning on resting tank on top of a some Tiles inside the pan instead of bricks

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

you dont need the union any longer...
you can eliminate all the gas fittings back past the Union to the gas stop.... ...
the flex connector is basically a union in itself and works great for these
pesky little situations .... I suggest a little pipe dope on all the fittings and you are good

 

[stalion529]

appreciate your help. Am leaning towards shutting off main house gas outside, getting a new Gas pipe for that vertical line which would match my new thermostat height, cut and threaded at HD or Lowes.. then will put back together same fittings on that final horizontal gas run. Then for water lines will cut appropriately and use a 45 degree elbow on each side before they drop vertical to the top of the tank to redirect the pipes to the narrower inlets. (this would avoid 2 -90 degree elbows) In my alum pan will place some tiles for the tank to sit on just to elevate it the slightest bit. There is just something about flex i do not like and think its not what any of the good professionals would use in my area.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

appreciate your help. Am leaning towards shutting off main house gas outside, getting a new Gas pipe for that vertical line which would match my new thermostat height, cut and threaded at HD or Lowes.. then will put back together same fittings on that final horizontal gas run. Then for water lines will cut appropriately and use a 45 degree elbow on each side before they drop vertical to the top of the tank to redirect the pipes to the narrower inlets. (this would avoid 2 -90 degree elbows) In my alum pan will place some tiles for the tank to sit on just to elevate it the slightest bit. There is just something about flex i do not like and think its not what any of the good professionals would use in my area.

Knock yourself out.... we used to attempt to do this but went to the flex gas lines cause
you cannot be precise down to perfect on this stuff and if you are only off a 1/2 you might as well be off a mile... and you will work your ass off in frustration......

try to remember this is not going on the next space shuttle....lol..

good luck and have fun....

please post pictures when you have accomplished your mission ......

 

[Phog]

If you're intent on doing everything in black pipe, you might be able to get done what you want without having to get the 5ft piece cut down shorter. Instead, just change out that nipple between the reducing coupling & the tee for a shorter one. They sell nipples like that at the big box stores in 1/2" increments. Or if that doesn't get you enough vertical room, you could get a 3/4 - 1/2 - 1/2 tee & take out the reducing coupling altogether.

But I do agree with master plumber mark -- seems like it's making things more complicated than necessary.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

If you're intent on doing everything in black pipe, you might be able to get done what you want without having to get the 5ft piece cut down shorter. Instead, just change out that nipple between the reducing coupling & the tee for a shorter one. They sell nipples like that at the big box stores in 1/2" increments. Or if that doesn't get you enough vertical room, you could get a 3/4 - 1/2 - 1/2 tee & take out the reducing coupling altogether.

But I do agree with master plumber mark -- seems like it's making things more complicated than necessary.

I carry around about a whole bucket of gas nipples in my truck... on occasion I
get lucky and the thing just falls in..... most of the time you never have that extra special
sized nipple you need to make it all fall together perfectly.... my dad used to pull the pipe
over or down into place and simply torque down the union ....this I never cared for at all having everything depending on that union holding up ......

we have used the flex connectors for 35 years and I dont care what other pros think cause
they simply are a safer way to connect gas lines with no stress on the pipes.........

 

[stalion529]

thank you both. yes will consider using reducing tee to gain some vertical room (that would give me the 3-4 inches i need) or just the flex line. am going to tackle in next week or so.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

thank you both. yes will consider using reducing tee to gain some vertical room (that would give me the 3-4 inches i need) or just the flex line. am going to tackle in next week or so.

And tackle it you will.......

good luck...merry xmas

 

[stalion529]

Finally got around doing it. Took about 3-4 hours with my pops. Probably hardest part was getting heater into pan and then the dialectic union had a drip or two and we had to re rape and tighten. Only issue now is that gas valve is not perfectly aligned to face you in front.