5600SXT BR issue

[Bannerman]

With 20,000 grains capacity set, then 2 gallons BF is the appropriate volume. With a 0.25 gpm BLFC, that would be 8 minutes fill time.

Either way it's proof to me that directed settings are just wasteful.

Not sure who directed the 15 lb salt setting for 20K grains usable capacity.

15 lbs of salt is the appropriate amount to regenerate 30,000 grains capacity in a 1 cuft unit. Those settings however are not salt efficient as it equates to only 2,000 grains per lb. The 6 lb / 20K setting equates to a much more efficient 3,333 grains per pound.

 

[JRC3]

Bannerman, It's a 1.0 cuft/"32k" (finger quote signs in the air) with the valve programmed to a capacity set 20K. I see some set 1.o cuft at either 20 or 24k, I chose 20k because that's the most I will ever use in 14 days. I will more than likely go down to 6lbs, I just felt more comfortable with 7.5 until I did more research. To a newb it's a little confusing but it sets in pretty quick once you figure it out.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Reach4]

Bannerman, It's a 1.0 cuft/"32k" (finger quote signs in the air) with the valve programmed to a capacity set 20K. I see some set 1.o cuft at either 20 or 24k, I chose 20k because that's the most I will ever use in 14 days. I will more than likely go down to 6lbs, I just felt more comfortable with 7.5 until I did more research. To a newb it's a little confusing but it sets in pretty quick once you figure it out.

If you are on city water, you can bump the DO up to 28 days.

 

[JRC3]

If you are on city water, you can bump the DO up to 28 days.

Well Waterand Fleck only allows a 14 DO.
Hardness : 300 ppm/17-18 gpg
Iron : 3 ppm
pH : 7-7.5
Alkalinity : 200 ppm
No Iron Bacteria/nitrate/nitrite/copper/coliform bacteria

Setup:
Softener: Fleck 7000SXT metered, 32000 grain capacity / 1.0 Cu Ft
Iron Filter: Fleck 7000SXT 1.o cu ft Pyrolox, 9x48 tank


Need be we can move this over to my thread, I hate to derail someone else's thread. Like I said, I was just trying to show what 2.5 gallons looked like since my salt was so low. I do like the answers you guys are asking and giving me but I rather clog my thread if it's hurting this one. https://terrylove.com/forums/index....er-and-softener-identification-other-s.67217/

 

[kingrocks]

According to your initial post in October 2015, your water source is municipal and the water's hardness is 11 gpg. Do you have a Hach 5b test kit or how was the actual amount of hardness established?

Your post also indicated that the softener's BLFC is 0.5 gpm for your 1.25 cuft softener. As such, BF = 5 minutes X 0.5 gpm = 2.5 gallons of water that should enter the brine tank which will dissolve 7.5 lbs of salt each regeneration cycle. That 7.5 pounds is the appropriate amount to regenerate 25,000 grains of capacity, so the softener's 'C' setting should be 25.

Your initial post indicates 5000 gallons is usual consumption per billing cycle (ie: monthly) for 4 persons. With a 25,000 grain capacity setting, at 11 gpg hardness, your softener would then deliver approx 2,270 gallons max per regeneration cycle, so more than 2 regens to deliver 5000 gallons. At 7.5 lbs salt per regen cycle, you should be using no more than 22.5 lbs per month in normal operation. As you stated the brine tank had been recently overfilled, that would consume considerably more salt. Each gallon entering the brine tank will dissolve 3 lbs of salt.

If there is a quantity of salt in the brine tank, the 2.5 gallons will not be visible until the salt level drops fairly low. As long as that water is making contact with the lower salt, salt will be dissolved to create the amount of brine programmed . You should be able to verify water is in the tank by looking down inside the riser tube within the brine tank.

To verify if your softener is properly working or not, it is best to test your home's water with a Hach 5b test. If you don't have one, buy one.

I got all my test results from a water softener guy who came to demo the system. He gave me all the results thinking that I will install one from him. Mine is a city water(Not municipal) Mine is

Fleck 5600XT Meter Valve 40,000 grains
3/4" stainless steel bypass valve
10x44 Mineral Tank
18x33 round brine tank
1.25 Cu Ft Hi-Capacity Resin, 8% Crosslink
Valve-to-Brine Tank Tubing, 6 Ft. x 3/8"
Brine Tank 2310 Safety Overflow Assembly
Water hardness: 11GPG

Drain flow equals 2.0 gpm
BLFC 0.5GPM

 

[Reach4]

Do get that Hach 5-b test. You can use it to confirm the hardness number better, and you can check the hardness of your softened water.

10x44 Mineral Tank
18x33 round brine tank
1.25 Cu Ft Hi-Capacity Resin, 8% Crosslink
Drain flow equals 2.0 gpm

Drain line flow countrol (DLFC) of 2.4 GPM would be more normal with a 10 inch diameter tank.

What are your remaining symptoms?

 

[Bannerman]

The cross posting in this thread makes it somewhat confusing as to what was said to whom and what the issues are.

City water is equivalent to municipal - ie: disinfected with chlorine or chloramine and not from a private well.

As Reach4 implied, 2.4 gpm backwash is appropriate for a 10" diameter tank, 2.0 gpm for a 9" tank

 

[kingrocks]

Do get that Hach 5-b test. You can use it to confirm the hardness number better, and you can check the hardness of your softened water.


Drain line flow countrol (DLFC) of 2.4 GPM would be more normal with a 10 inch diameter tank.

What are your remaining symptoms?

reach4, no symptoms. I am worried about complete dry in the brine tank and heavy salt usage. So I poured some 3 gallons of water 2 days back.

 

[Bannerman]

I am worried about complete dry in the brine tank and heavy salt usage.

If there actually is no quantity of water at the bottom of the brine tank in-between regeneration cycles, is it possible you somehow changed the programming so that BF occurs at the beginning?

Edit to add: Re-reading your initial post, you didn't actually say when BF was occurring so perhaps nothing actually changed except it appears the brine draw issue was resolved.

Creating brine at the start of the regeneration cycle is typical for when Potassium Chloride is utilized whereas when more common and less expensive Sodium Chloride is used, making brine normally is at the end of the cycle in preparation for the next cycle.

Suggest initiating a manual regeneration cycle and observe the function of the valve. If water is added at the start followed by a ~1.5 hour delay to allow salt to be dissolved, then the BF action is programmed to occur at the beginning.

Assuming the correct salt dose was programmed, manually adding more water will result in further salt consumption.

 

[Reach4]

reach4, no symptoms. I am worried about complete dry in the brine tank and heavy salt usage. So I poured some 3 gallons of water 2 days back.

With no symptoms, declare victory.

If you are using enough salt, don't be worried that you are not refilling the brine tank with enough water. There is no way the hardness stays low if you are not refilling enough water. If you are experimentally minded, what you could do is to check the softening with your Hach 5-b kit. If the hardness is higher than 1 as you approach time to regen, you would raise BF to use more salt. Otherwise you could try reducing salt BF by a minute. If the hardness does not stay down, put the BF back up. If it stays down, keep the reduced level.

I looked into what would be a good backwash rate for a 10 inch softener tank. Purolite C100E is the resin that others like to compare their resin to to say they are as good as....

http://www.purolite.com/Customized/...oliteProductsManagement/Resources/rid_631.pdf figure 2 has a graph. The GPM labels at the top are not the exact equivalent to the meters/hour scale labels at the bottom. 50 l/m would correspond to 20.45 gal per sqft , so they are close. I chose to use the bottom label for calculations. After careful interpolations from the graph, I added green and brown lines for the GPM that you would use with a 10 inch tank to get the various expansion amounts.

I am not sure what bed expansion you should shoot for, but I think 40% is about ideal, with 30% to 50% being OK. 50% would put the expansion to about the top of the tank if you have the usual 50% "freeboard". If you were doing commercial use, you may have more freeboard. 40% expansion with 68F looks like about 2.4 GPM -- a common DLFC for a 10 inch softener.

I am only posting this graph because I made it anyway and because it might be interesting or useful to somebody. Note that there is margin in the settings, and I am carrying calculations beyond the precision of the data. This is not an action item for Kingrocks. I chopped off the bottom and top of the graphs to bring it in under 800 pixels without reducing the resolution.
For an 8 inch tank, you could multiply the GPM by 0.64; for 9 inch, multiply by 0.81; for 12 inch, multiply by 1.44.

 

[Svend]

I hope someone can help me with my Brinetank problem. After the regeneration process and refilling of the the tank, the Water keeps flowing into the tank nonstop. Is it the Brinevalve I have to replace?

 

[Reach4]

That sounds reasonable diagnosis.

Brine Valve Assembly
60032 ...........................Brine Valve

It could be an O-ring. It could be debris in the valve, and cleaning would fix it.

shows the non-SXT valve, but I think the brine valve is the same in the 5600SXT.

I have no experience with this.

 

[ditttohead]

Likely the brine valve and/or the o-ring under the brine valve. Replace both. If your valve is 5-10 years old or older, it may be a good time to replace the seals/spacers/piston/brine valve/o-ring... A simple rebuild that can make the valve like new.

 

[Svend]

Thanks to both of You. I'm now quiet sure I have to replace the Valve, since there a no debris at all.
The two models looks quiet the same. The only differens as I can see is the "saltmeter"