Wet venting floor drain in garage through a utility sink NSPC

[Plumb-This-That]

I'm wet venting a floor drain in the utility room in the garage through the drain of the utility sink. The floor drain is a 2" drain with a 2" trap. The running length of the wet vent from the floor drain's trap arm to the long bend against the wall is about 11 feet. My initial install was to use 2" pipe but I ran out of 2" and I have a bunch of unused 1-1/2" pipe. PVC is 5 times the cost before fake covid so I thought I'd just use what I have...
I'm looking at the NSPC and based on 12.10.4 it's not looking good. Any thoughts?

 

[Plumb-This-That]

I found a solution and I'm still keeping the vent 1-1/2".
See if you can guess how I resolved this issue...

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Sylvan]

NYC requires a 3" line and 3" trap for a floor drain and NYC uses the IPC

 

[Sylvan]

I used to have signs posted on my trucks "WE FIX what your husband tried to repair"

 

[Plumb-This-That]

NYC requires a 3" line and 3" trap for a floor drain and NYC uses the IPC

NSPC (as stated in this post's title), this build is in NJ

 

[Plumb-This-That]

I used to have signs posted on my trucks "WE FIX what your husband tried to repair"

Cute but I don't consider myself at par with a husband who needs a wise-guy tradesman like yourself, no offense of course...

 

[Plumb-This-That]

I used to have signs posted on my trucks "WE FIX what your husband tried to repair"

Hecklers usually get schooled, even NYC wise-guys heckling while crotch grabbing and yelling eyyyyyyy. Again no offense of course...

 

[Jeff H Young]

So whats your solution ? we cant horizontal wet vent non bathroom fixtures jersy code allows it ?

 

[Plumb-This-That]

So whats your solution ? we cant horizontal wet vent non bathroom fixtures jersy code allows it ?

Hello Jeff,

OK here’s my solution, in the photo where the sledge hammer is visible there’s going to be a wall, this is where the utility room would end. Beyond that there’s going to be a utility sink in a vintage metal cabinet against the wall.

My solution is to cut the 1-1/2” pipe at the wall location, use the long sweep elbow that’s now against the wall (save a fitting) then use that run as a dry vent for the floor drain going up through the wall.
Now for the utility sink, I’ll remove the rest of the 1-1/2” pipe in the floor and use it for dry vent piping to meet up in the ceiling with the dry vent for the floor drain all the way up to the second floor 6” above flood level there.
Draining the utility sink I’ll run a new/separate 2” piping down to the main 3” pipe to the sewer.

No wet venting.

I’ll post a photo when I finish it.

 

[Jeff H Young]

IPC and UPC wont allow a vent horrizontal less than 6 inches above flood level in this case the floor. New Jersey code is one I never saw. between IPC and UPC usualy the other codes are kinda close so horrizontal dry vents have been real frowned on for decades everywhere Im familiar with

 

[Plumb-This-That]

IPC and UPC wont allow a vent horrizontal less than 6 inches above flood level in this case the floor. New Jersey code is one I never saw. between IPC and UPC usualy the other codes are kinda close so horrizontal dry vents have been real frowned on for decades everywhere Im familiar with

—“So whats your solution ? we cant horizontal wet vent non bathroom fixtures”—
If you can’t wet vent a non bathroom fixture and horizontal vents in your opinion are not allowed, then how would you vent a floor drain in this situation?

 

[Plumb-This-That]

IPC and UPC wont allow a vent horrizontal less than 6 inches above flood level in this case the floor. New Jersey code is one I never saw. between IPC and UPC usualy the other codes are kinda close so horrizontal dry vents have been real frowned on for decades everywhere Im familiar with

so horrizontal dry vents have been real frowned on for decades everywhere Im familiar with

That's not true, I'll give you an example, a kitchen island sink's foot vent is a dry horizontal vent and it's used in every kitchen with an island. How is that frowned upon? It's allowed in every code.

 

[Plumb-This-That]

IPC and UPC wont allow a vent horrizontal less than 6 inches above flood level in this case the floor. New Jersey code is one I never saw. between IPC and UPC usualy the other codes are kinda close so horrizontal dry vents have been real frowned on for decades everywhere Im familiar with

I think you're mixing up flat vents with horizontal vents; they're not the same... I never install flat vents.

 

[Jeff H Young]

Im not mixing up flat venting which is a term used commonly but confusing to some I wont get intro that right now.
What Im talking about is all dry vents must take off vertically and remain verticle untill 6 inches above flood level of fixture it serves. Im paraphrasing and not familiar with your code but every code Ive seen is very similar .
Please let me know where in New Jersey code it allows this Maybe I dont understand is this a wet vent or dry vent?. Some places have differances sure like to see what makes you think its legal

 

[Plumb-This-That]

Im not mixing up flat venting which is a term used commonly but confusing to some I wont get intro that right now.
What Im talking about is all dry vents must take off vertically and remain verticle untill 6 inches above flood level of fixture it serves. Im paraphrasing and not familiar with your code but every code Ive seen is very similar .
Please let me know where in New Jersey code it allows this Maybe I dont understand is this a wet vent or dry vent?. Some places have differances sure like to see what makes you think its legal

If you’re asking me to find you the code that allows a dry vent to run “horizontally”, I’m not going to waste my time on this even if it exists, because technically I’m not connecting “horizontally”, I know (and based on my photos you should notice) that a connection greater than 45 degrees from vertical (as in my photo of the floor drain piping) is within vertical territory. My vent connection for the floor drain is at 45 degrees and slopes up at 1/4” / foot about 3 feet then 90s up to the second floor where it connects to the vent more than 6” above the highest flood level fixture ( which is the lav in the master bath).



I’ve plumbed this way in Boston MA, in Alexandria VA, in NYC with the strictest goons approving the install.



Again, if you think you cannot wet vent a floor drain unless it’s within a bathroom group (as you said) and you think that the photo of my 45deg vent connection of the dry vent from the floor drain isn’t legal then how would you as a plumber be able to plumb a floor drain for instance in a laundry room or utility room as I’m plumbing?

 

[Jeff H Young]

Take a look at 12.6.2.1 2021 NSPC first time i looked at it your code allows the dry vent IPC dosent though and UPC is pretty iffy inspectors can and do fail them so your good in New Jersey . just use drainage fittings a Long sweep
if you had acess to the code dont know why you didnt check it.

 

[John Gayewski]

Response

 

[John Gayewski]

If you’re asking me to find you the code that allows a dry vent to run “horizontally”, I’m not going to waste my time on this even if it exists, because technically I’m not connecting “horizontally”, I know (and based on my photos you should notice) that a connection greater than 45 degrees from vertical (as in my photo of the floor drain piping) is within vertical territory. My vent connection for the floor drain is at 45 degrees and slopes up at 1/4” / foot about 3 feet then 90s up to the second floor where it connects to the vent more than 6” above the highest flood level fixture ( which is the lav in the master bath).



I’ve plumbed this way in Boston MA, in Alexandria VA, in NYC with the strictest goons approving the install.



Again, if you think you cannot wet vent a floor drain unless it’s within a bathroom group (as you said) and you think that the photo of my 45deg vent connection of the dry vent from the floor drain isn’t legal then how would you as a plumber be able to plumb a floor drain for instance in a laundry room or utility room as I’m plumbing?

You can run vents in floor drains without running vents horizontally under the floor. It's bad practice to run a dry vent horizontally under the floor, but it's allowed under your code. People do it all the time and I always say (as does your code) it needs a cleanout in the vent because if they see alot of use the do get clogged. Especially if you have cast iron piping in the ground which a lot of engineered projects require (although less and less these days).

You normally cannot wet vent fixture if they aren't within a bathroom group /groups depending on which code you look at.

Illinois doesn't require a vent on a floor drain there.

Normally you'd come up from the wall with a long sweep 90 then tee over for your floor drain. If you don't have enough depth for that then your plumbing plan left something out and you'd have to do something that isn't optimal, such as the homeowner or New Jersey apparently, vent under the floor with a cleanout.

 

[Plumb-This-That]

Take a look at 12.6.2.1 2021 NSPC first time i looked at it your code allows the dry vent IPC dosent though and UPC is pretty iffy inspectors can and do fail them so your good in New Jersey . just use drainage fittings a Long sweep
if you had acess to the code dont know why you didnt check it.

Hello Jeff and John,
Thank you Jeff for going out of your way to lookup NJ code.
I didn’t want to look it up because I know it would pass, I’ve done this type of install before as I said. My only concern was for drain pipe size that’s why I split the fixtures and ran a separate 2” for the Utility sink’s that’s going to be in the garage. I always look for the optimal solution that would work and my concern is usability above pleasing the government’s code.
This floor drain as with all the others I’ve installed are only to be used in an unintended and unusual scenario. I’ve installed at least 8 of these types of floor drains in the middle of the room for over 20 years and none of the floor drains had a drop of water in them except for the water from the primer.

I can install the drain against the wall and eliminate a horizontal run but that would cause issues because I have a purpose for every inch along the wall and having to access a drain from under an appliance would be just stupid regardless what the code says.

For this room I’m installing a large Viessmann Vitocrossal 300 boiler for the radiant heating/hot water in the house and a 42 gallons Viessmann Vitocell indirect water tank. The odds of the indirect tank rupturing are slim to none but I’m installing this floor drain in any case…

 

[Jeff H Young]

If you do much work in NJ look at those codes they are pretty forgiving on some stuff looks a lot differant than ipc and upc