Toilet leaking for years... Try to fix and getting frustrated

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DOLBET

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I bought new house in 2008... There are two bathrooms located right next from each other so the toilets are 3 feet from each other back to back with wall in middle...

I caulked the toilet bases when I moved in... Toilet A's caulk changed color to gray and it disconnected from toilet base, not the floor. I replaced the caulk... Toilet B never have problem... I replaced toilet A caulk 3 times in 4 years...

After 4 years, I decided to replace both toilets with one piece toilet for easy cleaning.... After two years, toilet A's caulk is falling apart again... I replace and replace the caulk for next 5 years...

Getting frustrated, I removed the toilet A and noticed that wax ring was not set, loose.. Thought that was where the leak was from... I replaced the toilet with another toilet cuz wife didnt like one piece toilet... While replacing the toilet, I noticed that the water is coming from the pipe.

I figured out that when I flushed the Toilet B, the water from Toilet B goes down its drain and then comes up toilet A's drain before going to sewer...

A---B------Sewer..... The water goes down and then splash back to A then onward to sewer...

I called plumber and tell him about that, he says its normal...

I replaced the toilet and... Now, the caulk is falling apart again....

My questions is : Is it possible for wax ring to fail three times on three different toilets, all within short time?

IS the water from another toilet supposed to splashback to another toilet? (Suspect not enough angle so water go another way to toilet A before going to sewer)

Can water from another toilet push the wax ring in toilet A out of place, causing water to leak... Is that possible?

So, what is the solution?

I see two options... Capping toilet A's pipe and change the bathroom to storage :D .... or Dig out and replace the pipes, give it steeper angles ?

Toilet B and its replacement never have caulk problems in 14 years...

Note: Builders installed toilet A, plumbers installed second toilet A , I installed the third toilet A myself... All three different installers and all three had wax ring failed... Three different installers and three different toilets :D
 
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Jeff H Young

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toilets are back to back? wax ring loose , what's that mean? it sounds like its not tall enough use thicker wax or double up, don't caulk it right away or at most caulk partial leaving spots for water to come out rather than hide the leak
 

DOLBET

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Yeah, toilets are back to back.. Wall are in the middle o I o (Both bathrooms share same wall and it comes between two toilets.

Wax ring doesnt stick to the base of toilet... Wax unsticked... Three times ina row, the leaks are caused by loose wax or wax that comes off the toilet... The gap between toilet base and the flange is too small so one wax is more than plenty, the wax oozes out of bolt holes... Double would be too much... The plumber say that.

The wax failed after 2 to 3 years... It supposed to last 20 years, yes?
 

Weekend Handyman

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Yeah, toilets are back to back.. Wall are in the middle o I o (Both bathrooms share same wall and it comes between two toilets.

Wax ring doesnt stick to the base of toilet... Wax unsticked... Three times ina row, the leaks are caused by loose wax or wax that comes off the toilet... The gap between toilet base and the flange is too small so one wax is more than plenty, the wax oozes out of bolt holes... Double would be too much... The plumber say that.

The wax failed after 2 to 3 years... It supposed to last 20 years, yes?

I am not a plumber.

Does the toilet rock? If so, the movement could be breaking the wax seal.
 

Tuttles Revenge

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Caulking a toilet does not ever fix a leak. Letting a toilet leak for years just makes bigger more expensive problems.

The closet flange must be 100% dry and the bottom of the toilet must be 100% dry in order for the wax to stick to both surfaces. The closet flange must be solidly held in place or the toilet will move and the wax ring will fail. The closet flange needs to be flush with the finished floor or just on top of the finished floor. If the flange is deeper than flush then it needs to be fixed properly so that the sealing surface is flush with the floor or the wax will not make full contact and will not form a seal.
 

DOLBET

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Yeah, I know that caulking doesnt fix the leak but the condition of caulk let me know that there is a leak...

Yes, the flange and the bottom of toilet was dry for the second and third install. I didnt see builders instaleld the toilet but I am assuming that it was dry.

The toilets was attached firmly and there was no rocking of any kind.

First time and second time: the flange was flush to the floor. For the third install, I raised the floor 1/2 inch and use single but thicker wax.

Wax fail all three times... The water comes out of pipe when I flushed the toilet B.... The water from toilet B goes down its own pipe and then comes up toilet A's pipe.. Is that normal?

Toilet A ---- Toilet B ------------- Sewer

I have attached a drawing...

I think the water splashback "pushed" the wax and make a leak somehow...

Looking at the new houses currently, I dont see back to back toilets anymore... Is that because of this issue?

If so, what can I do?

(Ignore everything, I find the problem and my drawing is very wrong) The fittings was not double wye...

Toilets.png
 
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DOLBET

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Looking through this awesome forum.. I think I find my problem...

The pipes between both toilets are not double wye...

Following Terry's advice: You can pull one toilet, and then flush the other one. If you see water skipping across and coming up the other arm, then your fitting is allowing water across.

I did that and I see water skipping across and coming up so that means my fitting is allowing water across... A new house in 2008 and it doesn't have current fittings.. Oh well...

Now I understand why water is always low in Toilet A... Toilet B is used more often.

My question: Can the air that was displaced by water skipping across screw up the wax? Is it possible for the air movement to be that strong?
 

Tuttles Revenge

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No. The water that moves across will not have enough force to displace the wax in any way unless the wax were already waiting to fail. That water would have the same force as your breath against the wax.

If the wax is installed correctly and the closet flange is securely attached to the floor, then there must be some other issue that is happening to cause that toilet to leak.
 

Reach4

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Getting frustrated, I removed the toilet A and noticed that wax ring was not set, loose.. Thought that was where the leak was from... I replaced the toilet with another toilet cuz wife didnt like one piece toilet... While replacing the toilet, I noticed that the water is coming from the pipe.
Do you need to use a plunger on your toilet?

If there is a partial blockage in the piping, vigorous plunging can blow out the wax. If you look at this as inevitable, you might want a waxless seal instead of a wax seal.

Also, have your shims in place before dropping the toilet on the wax. So determine where the shims go with no wax. Be sure there will be no rocking. Then lift the toilet off of the shims, drop the wax, and drop the toilet.
 

Terry

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Toilet B should have had a wye fitting. A santee there allows water to go both ways, displacing water on toilet A.
The wax shouldn't be affected though. "A" will loss water in the bowl, but that should be it.
 
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