Softener, No idea what it all does....

[SparkySteve73]

The Hach 5B is the recommended test kit to test your raw water's hardness as well as the hardness of the water exiting the softener, to ensure the softener is working. It will not test for bacteria.

I had suggested getting the filter and softener online immediately, so that their functions can be tested and if working, they can commence treating the water.

Once assured the filter and softener are working, you could worry about sanitizing the filter and house plumbing afterwards.

I appreciate the advice - I am more than willing to go down there right now and do what your previous post suggested, with the only concern you mentioned about bacteria. I don't want to make anyone sick! Perhaps I should go stock up on bottled water

I have already purchased the unscented clorox. I am literally ready to try the advice - I just want to hold off a few minutes in case you want to warn me about the bacteria again ^_^

Call me a worry wort - I'm ok with that

 

[Bannerman]

Your control valve is a Fleck 5600 SE which is a very good valve.

Softeners are typically comprised of various off the shelf components which are chosen and assembled by various companies such as Zeropoint, and sold as their system.

I had suggested not drinking the water as a precaution until everything has been sanitized to ensure there is no harmfull bacteria.

If the water had been permitted to only sit for a week or so, that would be one thing. Since your unchlorinated well water had been sitting for possibly 18 months within the tanks, it would be wiser to take extra precautions.

As the units will need to be returned online, the water within the tanks will need to be released which is why I had specified initiating a backwash and regeneration right away as the water within will be flushed to drain. Don't let anyone run water downstream until both units have been backwashed. If there is any residual bacteria, that can be addressed later through sanitization, if everything is working properly.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[SparkySteve73]

An update (I dislike threads of requesting advice that suddenly die out! What happened? Did they all survive? LOL)

Great advice in this thread; I have located a company to test my water once I've put the filter & softener back into service - I plan to do this on Monday, as I have the whole day off.

In the meantime, continued research tells me that I could benefit from installing a whirlpool whole-house filtration system (WHKF-DWHBB) and use the WHKF-WHPLBB filter. It seems many many people have successfully and massively reduced their iron content using this basic, and indeed cheap* system.

I would intend to fit this after the well tank, and before the other filters that I already have.

*The filters are not particularly cheap, and depending on their levels of iron, people have said they change it as often as 6 weeks, to as much as 6 months.

I've nothing to lose, right?

If I go ahead, I would pipe it with valves either side, and furthermore put in a bypass pipe (with a valve, of course) so I could bypass it for filter changes or just plain-old-bad-luck-failure.

Whilst I do not wish to divert from the original topic, I would welcome thoughts on this possible addition.

Thanks everyone!

Links to the parts mentioned (1, I apologize if links to box-stores is forbidden, and 2, I am in no way affiliated with the company in the links - this is purely for reference).

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Whirlpool-10-in-Whole-House-Complete-Filtration-System/50412472

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Whirlpool-10-in-Whole-House-Replacement-Filter/1137163

 

[ditttohead]

I would not waste my money on these items, just my humble opinion.

 

[SparkySteve73]

I would not waste my money on these items, just my humble opinion.

Is there any particular reason? My idea was based on what I've read, but I am very happy to listen to why it wont help...

 

[Reach4]

The sediment filter you pointed to would not help with the iron, but it would help with sediment. If somebody thinks it would help with the iron like you have on your report, they are mistaken.


That iron that the report number is on (ferrous) goes right through a cartridge filter. You should start looking for that nice backwashing filter to handle the iron and more.

I have filters between my backwashing iron+H2S filter and my softener, but I only needed one. I ordered my filters before deciding to get the backwashing filter. Anyway, I do catch some stuff in the filter, so I believe in that. If I caught nothing, I would see still value in the info that I caught nothing.

 

[ditttohead]

"I read it online so it must be true..." Unfortunately the internet has allowed everyone to be a professional in everything. When I read articles n water treatment, I find more wrong information that right information. Since most of the information is put out by marketing people, the agenda is to generate more sales, not to give accurate information.

Iron in the ferrous state will pass right through a filter. The iron needs to be oxidized with an oxidant or catalyzing media to convert it to a ferric (rust particle) state where it is easily filtered out by physical filtration methods. Ferrous iron is removed with cation exchange but this is inefficient and requires a little extra attention to the maintenance of the cation exchange media (typically a water softener). it is much more complex than this but this will get you started with a basic understanding of how iron reduction works.

Sediment filtration can be an effective means of reducing larger items in the water and even ferric iron but the sediment filters tend to have a very limited capacity and they can require considerable maintenance on operating costs will be high. A simple iron reduction filtration system can be an effective means of reducing both iron and sediment from the water. Since it is self cleaning it requires very little maintenance.

 

[SparkySteve73]

Reach, Ditto, I truly appreciate the feedback.

From what you've seen of my original post, and assuming once I put them back into service, do either of you (or indeed anyone else) think this will take care of the current iron issue, either in whole or in part?

"I read it online so it must be true..."

I appreciate the sentiment as a generalization; but for me, personally, I very much do not subscribe to that. I question everything And that probably explains why I'm on so many forums about so many topics; I love social feedback/ideas/contributions.

I'm cautiously optimistic on putting them back into service either Sunday or Monday.

 

[Reach4]

From what you've seen of my original post, and assuming once I put them back into service, do either of you (or indeed anyone else) think this will take care of the current iron issue, either in whole or in part?

We still don't know what your current iron filter is. You have not said what the DLFC in the iron filter is. Did you say what the tank sizes are? I forget.

 

[SparkySteve73]

We still don't know what your current iron filter is. You have not said what the DLFC in the iron filter is. Did you say what the tank sizes are? I forget.

You are quite correct; I do not know what the DLFC is, or even what it means; I took the foil off of one of the tanks to see if there any markings, and there was not; under the foil is a plastic cover, which spins freely; I have not determined if that cover is removable yet - there is a seam, so it's possible.

 

[Bannerman]

My earlier recommendations did not address settings or sizes, but were first intended to restore and confirm the operation of the devices already installed. Once confirming the equipment is functional, the sizes, drain flow rate (DLFC), brine refill rate (BLFC), salt dose and various other settings can all be reviewed to confirm the appropriate and most efficient operation.

Once the filter is online and backwashed, a water sample can be obtained directly before and after the filter to determine what if any iron removal has occurred through the filter. A similar test for hardness can be performed with the softener.

Since you have already removed the foil insulation, proceed to measure the circumference and height of that tank's outer jacket so that we can calculate the volume of media contained. Both the filter and softener tanks appear to be identical in size.

If you have located any labels which identify the supplier/installer of the equipment, you could attempt to contact them to see if they have records of the media installed within the filter, and even prior water conditions. Since the equipment was probably installed prior to the current well, they were likely sized and configured for the prior water conditions, which may have been vastly different than current water conditions.

 

[Reach4]

The easy thing to do is to buy a new tank with Katalox Light media, and controller. To try reusing what you have for the iron filter will take significantly more effort. It will be easier to reuse the softener probably. I suggest that you search old posts that refer to "iron out" for discusions on cleaning resin and softeners that have been exposed to iron. You will need to clean anyway, but you may decide to replace the resin.

You are quite correct; I do not know what the DLFC is, or even what it means;

To measure the tank, measure from the floor to the top of the tank For the diameter, you can measure around the tank and divide by pi.

DLFC stands for Drain Line Flow Control, and that is what limits the backwash rate as long as the controller is capable.

You have the controller manual. The DLFC is just inside the drain line connection.

This is a picture of a 2.4 GPM button. I think a 5 GPM button would say 500.

 

[SparkySteve73]

The process of bringing them back into service is underway - the filter took about 16 minutes as Bannerman suggested it would. The softener is regenerating right now.

Suggest mixing 1/4 cup of unscented bleach to 1 or 2 gallons water (not critical) and adding this to the brine tank (the tank with salt).

I misread, and put a half cup of bleach in. What are the repercussions, and what can I do to fix it?

Thank you

 

[ditttohead]

Just regenerate it, a one time overdosing is unlikely to cause any real damage. You may want to add a gallon of water to the brine tank just to dilute it a little more. Chlorine damage tends to be cumulative to resin so theoretically you will have taken a month off the life of the resin which could have a life span of decades.

 

[SparkySteve73]

The easy thing to do is to buy a new tank with Katalox Light media, and controller.

I don't disagree, Reach. Unfortunately due to a recent serious family illness, I do not have the cash to invest at this time; I am willing to put time into it, and if it turns out to be wasted, so be it. Unless someone tells me to the contrary, regardless of which I do or do not achieve, I will not end up in a worse position than I am in now, correct?

The 2 units are regenerating right now.

The tanks are 34" diameter (tape measure around the unit), and 54" tall;

I'll look into the DLFC later once the units have finished doing their respective regenerations....

 

[Reach4]

The tanks are 34" diameter (tape measure around the unit), and 54" tall;

That is a 10x54 tank. It would have 1.5 cubic ft of media.

If you could measure the drain line flow on the filter during backwash, that could hint at the current media, although for now I think the plan is to go with what is there for now. That is quite reasonable.

 

[SparkySteve73]

Regeneration has completed - and so far, to a layman - it doesn't seem to have worked out well at all...

When the 2 cycles of backwash happened, I checked outside, and it was indeed flowing very well, so I know the backwash was doing something.

I added a half cup of non-scented bleach and 2 gallons of (well) water to the brine tank.

During the softener regen process, the tank was emptied as was my understanding that it should be.

Once the regens were both complete, I ran a tap in the bathroom and kitchen, and the water was bright orange; They've both been running for about 20 minutes now, and whilst it is better, it's much worse than before I put the tanks back into service;

I took a water sample before putting them back into service - that was approx 3 hrs ago, and that water is still clear; The water coming out of the taps right now is visibly murky, and if you take a clear glass of it, it looks pretty uninviting.

I assume that I can put both tanks back into bypass and be back where I was, but I'm going to wait another 30 minutes for the pipes/tanks to flush out (I hope), and possibly await any responses here.

If I do end up putting both tanks back into bypass, I'm going to assume that the water is not necessarily safe to drink, given that whatever is wrong with the water right now has been flowing through the pipes.

 

[SparkySteve73]

Hi Reach4,

If you could measure the drain line flow on the filter during backwash, that could hint at the current media, although for now I think the plan is to go with what is there for now.

Do you mean physical flow rate, for example, it took xx seconds to fill a 1 gallon bucket??

 

[Reach4]

Do you mean physical flow rate, for example, it took xx seconds to fill a 1 gallon bucket??

Yes.

I would try taking everything apart and clean using my favorite iron remover. I might use Iron Out, but I would like to do that outdoors. Citric acid is not as active, but it smells better.

I suggest you search in this forum for older references to "iron out" with the quotes. Put it in the brine tank, and add water per the instructions you find. The iron filter does not have a brine tank, so do what you can to clean it out. I would look at what it takes to rebuild a controller, even if I were going to put it back with the same parts. I would use a light amount of silicone grease on rubber seals as I reassemble.

Do more backwashes. If the backwash is orange, backwash some more.

 

[ditttohead]

Citric acid is nice since if you buy the right stuff (food grade) you can experiment with the leftovers. Try dipping Red Vines into it and make your own super sour red vines...

I do recommend putting a good amount of citric acid into the brine tank, and then regenerating the system. As soon as the water is empty from the brine tank, bypass the unit and unplug the power. Let the acidic water sit in the mineral tank for an hour. Then simply plug the unit back in and power it up. it should finish it's regeneration like nothing ever happened. This may need to be repeated a couple times depending on how bad the fouling is. other acids can be used, just use caution when handling them please.