Should I prefer PEX elbow fitting or that bend support for 90 degree angle

[Curiousv]

Please look at pic ..I have removed old valve as advised by many on this forum.
So now using PEX upward of pipes you see in pic ... I have to make 2 90 degree turns with PEX
so should I use those bend support or cut PEX and make elbow ..
I am going to use clamp type ring (not sharkbite type fitting)


Also if u see in pic ..on cold supply pipe - a wire is attached to that pipe ..and it was solution by previous owner to provide ground in 2 wire cable (old house no ground wire) and I checked it does work all the time..ie. it does provide ground.
Now when I a change to PEX (partial conversion) ..what should I do additionally to continue using that ground

 

[Jadnashua]

The fewer connections you need, the better IMHO. It's behind a wall, pretty isn't important. Every fitting means more dynamic pressure loss, too. You do need to brace the new valve body adequately, as the PEX cannot do it at all.

PEX is spelled PEX, not pex. But then everyone knows that so I don't know why I'm even mentioning it.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Reach4]

The fewer connections you need, the better IMHO. It's behind a wall, pretty isn't important. Every fitting means more dynamic pressure loss, too. You do need to brace the new valve body adequately, as the PEX cannot do it at all.

PEX is spelled PEX, not pex. But then everyone knows that so I don't know why I'm even mentioning it.

Not everyone. See https://scratchtap.com/when-acronyms-should-not-be-capitalized/ Things evolve. I expect we are in an evolutionary period. I think email is now more common than e-mail, but once upon a time the hyphen was considered to be the right way.

You really don't know why you are mentioning it?

 

[Terry]

I spend a lot of time editing replies for this. Spell check flags the misuse of the letters.
I guess I will continue to spell check Reach4, the rest of them are getting it.

PEX
CPVC
ABS
PVC

 

[Reach4]

I guess I will continue to spell check Reach4, the rest of them are getting it.

Did you understand that my reply was a defense? OK, a little counter-attack too. But I certainly was not complaining about writing PEX. I do think pex is also quite acceptable in a plumbing forum. In formal writing, PEX is still the norm. I do it both ways, so I can be inconsistent in my capitalization, lol.

 

[Bannerman]

To address the OP's question, 2- 90° PEX fittings (1 hot - 1 cold) to supply a shower valve, is not likely going to cause much if any noticable flow restriction. The flow rate to a shower head will be typically 2.5 GPM max which even one 1/2" PEX elbow should have no issue passing.

While I anticipate the ground path to earth is currently obtained through the cold piping, that can't be assured and so the ground path maybe presently obtained through the hot piping.

To reestablish the electrical grounding bond between both the hot and cold supply pipes, obtain 2 electrical ground bonding clamps for pipe, 1 per pipe so as to jumper a length of grounding wire from one metal pipe to the other. Suggest using a thickest grounding conductor that will fit into each bonding clamp.

Is there currently a bonding clamp and ground wire that is bonding the metal plumbing pipes to the home's electrical service panel ground bar?

 

[Tuttles Revenge]

I prefer to use bend supports in my PEX work wherever they make my life easier. They require less work and less time for installing PEX..

 

[McconnellPlumbing]

There is a difference between what is called PEX pipe. Uponor/Aquapex is different and superior, IMHO, to Vanpex, Zurnpex and a host of other PEX type water pipes and fittings. There have been some PEX tubing with an aluminum layer in the tubing.

 

[Jeff H Young]

Didn't know pex was spelled PEX . I guess its better to use the correct spelling I don't mind the Tip from Terry and Jadnashua, and I thank Terry for correcting never knew you did that and can't imagine how time consuming that is I know I've typed it out wrong every time.
I'm not seeing room for bend supports in the picture

 

[Jadnashua]

Acronyms are capitalized. PEX=PolyEthelene, cross-linked. Yes, people will know what you mean if you type it out as pex, but it shows disregard for proper English. We all mess up occasionally.

Where possible, it's best to avoid fittings with PEX. They increase dynamic pressure losses, and are a potential leak point, plus, if it's in an area that might freeze, are subject to failure whereas a simple run of PEX, usually is not.

There are three recognized versions of PEX, types -A, -B, and -C. They represent the method and completeness of the cross-linking. Type-A is the original, and still is the one with the most complete cross-linking, which is why it is the only one that can be restored after kinking, and has the smallest bend radius of the three types and uses compression fittings versus crimped ones that are more likely to be done incorrectly. It also tends to cost a bit more, which is one reason why types -B and -C were developed.

There are various ways to make O2 barrier PEX, and an aluminum layer is one of them. Those are needed when used in hydronic systems, as oxygen will cause corrosion on many typical components of a hydronic system. They can be used in potable water systems, but probably aren't the best choice as tubing without that feature tend to be cheaper.

 

[Reach4]

Will you pronounce it as P E X as you would F B I or C P V C or P V C or A A V or P R V???

 

[Jeff H Young]

Will you pronounce it as P E X as you would F B I or C P V C or P V C or A A V or P R V???

Darn I been pronouncing it wrong too!

 

[Jadnashua]

Will you pronounce it as P E X as you would F B I or C P V C or P V C or A A V or P R V???

Acronyms that can easily be pronounced like a word then tend to be spoken that way, like UNICEF, people don't say U N I C E F. It's much easier than to say United Nations International Children's Emergency Fund or U N I C E F. But, when talking about someone that works at the FBI, they're sometimes called a FIBBY rather than a Federal Bureau of Investigation employee. English is sloppy, and an amalgam of words from many languages from many roots. Sometimes, people get sloppy when using it. It shows...

 

[Reach4]

We have laser and radar, and I suspect eventually we will have pex, even for formal use.

 

[Curiousv]

To address the OP's question, 2- 90° PEX fittings (1 hot - 1 cold) to supply a shower valve, is not likely going to cause much if any noticable flow restriction. The flow rate to a shower head will be typically 2.5 GPM max which even one 1/2" PEX elbow should have no issue passing.

While I anticipate the ground path to earth is currently obtained through the cold piping, that can't be assured and so the ground path maybe presently obtained through the hot piping.

To reestablish the electrical grounding bond between both the hot and cold supply pipes, obtain 2 electrical ground bonding clamps for pipe, 1 per pipe so as to jumper a length of grounding wire from one metal pipe to the other. Suggest using a thickest grounding conductor that will fit into each bonding clamp.

Is there currently a bonding clamp and ground wire that is bonding the metal plumbing pipes to the home's electrical service panel ground bar?

1. 1. I don't know if ground wire from metal pipe is bonding to the home's electrical service panel ground bar. I do know that when it was upgraded from fuse box to panel - a thick copper wire with clamp you showed in pic was attached to metal ground bar from panel. - how do check if this metal piping ground wire is connected to ground bar ?
2. Yes grounding wire is currently connected cold line - I guess you are suggesting that its not reliable so we should connect to hot water pipe?
3. Interesting there is a clam attached to hot water pipe that is connected to water heater hot line - so may be it serves the purpose that you are trying to achieve?
4. If I use PEX on top of these cold/hot supply lines - I guess it will break the ground path from where I make transition correct? so basically shower head faucet handle or tub spout will not have ground?

 

[Jadnashua]

Again, don't confuse bonding things to ground and a system ground. Ideally, your electrical system is grounded. To pass any current codes, it would be. Older homes may have used the incoming water pipes as their electrical ground, but often wired everything with an ungrounded cable. That often isn't allowed today, but may be in some places. But, because the pipes contain water, and go lots of places in the home, and COULD come in contact with a faulty electrical wire, and, they could become energized during a lightning storm, it's good to bond them to the system ground for additional safety. The hassle for relying on them for a ground elsewhere in the dwelling is that they may not be continuous, with some PEX, CPVC, or who knows what in between sections. Utilities may replace their supply lines with plastic pipe. When ground rods are specified, you generally need at least two, and in some soil conditions, you may need more or a different grounding system. Getting a good ground in a dry desert location can be really tough. When I was at Ft. Bliss in El Paso, TX, when the communications people went out on a field exercise to the desert, they'd have their cooks order lots of salt. When they were setting up an antenna and it needed a ground plane, they'd mix up a vat of salt water, and soak the ground, otherwise, their antennae had lousy range because there was no good ground.

A WH, especially an electric one, may last longer if it is properly bonded to ground. All modern ones would have a ground lead coming into their electrical box that should be connected. If there's even a small electrical current through a WH, it can eat it away, causing premature leaks and system failure.

 

[Terry]

Didn't know pex was spelled PEX . I guess its better to use the correct spelling I don't mind the Tip from Terry and Jadnashua, and I thank Terry for correcting never knew you did that and can't imagine how time consuming that is I know I've typed it out wrong every time.
I'm not seeing room for bend supports in the picture

I do spend a lot of time correcting things. I want others to see your ideas and advice, and not notice spelling.

This week I'm working on a 1907 home for my brother, a 2.5 hour drive from my home. The plan is to remove the toilet set on a lead bend at 14" and add a shower, so that he doesn't have to climb stairs. The shower, toilet and new vanity will change sides of the room. The old lead bend gets capped off, and new pipe will be ABS. I plan on installing a taller toilet, one with a Washlet.
My brother had a stroke last Fall, using a wheel chair now.
Going with HansGrohe in the shower, with a hand spray on a rail and the standard high shower head, switched by the i-Box valve with built-in diverter.
There is no TV here, at least I don't know how to work them. I spent the day trying to clear some clutter, and then I will need to do a dump run, and then the plumbing begins The heater in the bathroom that has to come out is not marked on the box,, I wound up flipping twenty plus breakers until I hit the right one.
The existing plumbing looks horrible.
The floor is totally out of level, by a bunch.
I'm tired, slept on a, well it's not a bed. I had Covid two weeks ago, maybe last week. I don't feel like eating, and I dropped 20 pounds without wanting to.
There is something wrong, but I don't know what it is. And then in a few weeks, surgery on my left hand, and that will put me in recovery mode for that.

 

[Jeff H Young]

Wow Terry ,
Busy you are! I had Covid , Day after. had a high fever . wasent fun, but I think it was mild case.
I had a Major health issue last year and hoping to be through it . I thought it might kill me but it didnt as yet and my recovery went great but will have to see . Much to be grateful Im very lucky so far, as is nearly all my family only lost one brother and it seems a fluke he was just short of age 55 but really did harmful things to his health.
You do a lot of good here Terry and Im sure its more appreciated than what is shown . Take care of yourself sounds like you do a lot of healthy things like cycling etc. but your racking up miles on the odometor none the less LOL...

 

[Jadnashua]

Self-leveling concrete can solve some problems with a floor, but over a wooden subfloor may need to be higher than you want, creating an access problem. With a wheelchair, an ADA, walk/roll-in shower may be useful. Those are best done with a surface membrane. On an older house, the floors may be planks, and sometimes, it's easier to cut them out to lower things, then you can deal with trying to get the tops of the joists even by either planing them, or sistering on some cleats. That might allow you to lower the shower pan to make a curbless entry easier. You can lower that by putting cleats on the sides of the joists there, such that a layer of ply can fit in and be level with the tops, then a 1/2" ply across the tops of the joists or a mud bed or foam shower pan could be used.