Gerber toilet bowl level slowly decreases

[Frank R.]

New Gerber Avalanche toilet installed last week by plumbing company. Toilet is on 2nd floor. I noticed that the water level seemed to decrease. House is 34 years old. I performed the following:

• Flushed toilet and waited 10 minutes
• Marked the toilet bowl level with electrician tape
• Add red food coloring
• Took picture of bowl level after 12 hours (1st pic) and 24 hours (last pic)
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No "red food coloring" water leaks on floor. Checked the bathroom floor and toilet bowl with carpenter's level. Bubbles in level almost dead center. No water leak marks under toilet on 1st floor ceiling (at least not yet).

Called the owner of the plumbing company and he had it replaced with another new Gerber Avalanche toilet 2 days ago. The owner though maybe small hole in toilet. The plumber checked the drain and there was no blockage.

Same problem is now happening again.

What bothers me is that the plumber did not replace the 34 year old flange just the bolts. Was that a mistake? I never replaced a toilet but I have replaced sinks, dishwashers and faucets when I was younger.

I never noticed that the original 34 year old toilet had a problem like this. Although it did have a very large bowl.

I can't figure this out. Is this normal with the newer toilets. Hate to call the owner again - will probably thing I am nuts even though I have dealt with him for over 15 years.

Any advice would be appreciated...

Frank

 

[Terry]

Do you have a second toilet that is back to back to this one?

A 34 year old flange should be fine.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Frank R.]

Do you have a second toilet that is back to back to this one?

A 34 year old flange should be fine.

No Terry. No back to back toilets. Bathroom is small. Has sink and shower.

 

[Mark.MPC]

Don’t think that’s ever normal but water has to be going somewhere. Hmm

 

[Tuttles Revenge]

Is there a bathroom or toilet above this bathroom? Could a toilet draining down the vent stack siphon a toilet bowl?

A far fetched idea.. but could there be a bit of paper towel hung up on the trap weir that acts as a Wicking siphon?

 

[Reach4]

You could cover the rim with Saran Wrap to prevent evaporation, and exclude pets. Don't forget to tell people.

If you are motivated, I could describe making an open air manometer with some cheap clear tubing and a glass jar or glass glass. That would read the water pressure on the other side of the water seal. You might try to take a movie that includes the water spot and the glass both, perhaps involving a mirror.

But yes, the new toilet could be defective.

 

[Frank R.]

Is there a bathroom or toilet above this bathroom? Could a toilet draining down the vent stack siphon a toilet bowl?

A far fetched idea.. but could there be a bit of paper towel hung up on the trap weir that acts as a Wicking siphon?

No, there is nothing above this small bathroom on the 2nd floor. 2 story house.
3 hours ago, I poured 2 gallons of water into the toilet and the bowl drained immediately which is what I expected.

 

[Frank R.]

You could cover the rim with Saran Wrap to prevent evaporation, and exclude pets. Don't forget to tell people.

If you are motivated, I could describe making an open air manometer with some cheap clear tubing and a glass jar or glass glass. That would read the water pressure on the other side of the water seal. You might try to take a movie that includes the water spot and the glass both, perhaps involving a mirror.

But yes, the new toilet could be defective.

 

[Frank R.]

Reach4, I believe evaporation is not the issue. This is not happening to the toilet in the main bathroom which is also on the 2nd floor nor to the toilet on the 1st floor.

Curious about the open air manometer and how it would read water pressure on the other side of the seal? I presume the level would have to marked on the glass jar. Would this have to also measured against the pressure in the other toilets?

I hear what you are saying about new toilet being defective, but this is the 2nd new toilet installed within a week.

 

[Reach4]

Curious about the open air manometer and how it would read water pressure on the other side of the seal? I presume the level would have to marked on the glass jar. Would this have to also measured against the pressure in the other toilets?

You can measure the air pressure at the far end of the tube. The procedure would be to run some clear tubing through a trap into the trap arm or past the weir in a toilet. Blow to remove any water in the tube.

Take the near end, and put it into a glass of water. This glass could be elevated, maybe somehow taped into the soap dish. It could be low for better positioning for video. Tape the tubing to support that to keep the end of the tubing in place. If vented, the level of the water in the tubing should be about the same as the other water in the glass. If there is vacuum in the drain air, the water level in the tubing would drop relative to the level of the water in the jar. This is called an open air manometer.


Clear tubing is pretty inexpensive . If you know somebody on oxygen that person probably throws away suitable tubing every month.

You can thread the tube through a lavatory trap, if there is nothing blocking the way. You can shove the tubing through the trap of a toilet. Through the toilet would directly show what the toilet is faced with.

 

[Terry]

How many toilets are on the second floor?
If more than one, how close together are they? On a common wall? Other ends of the home?

 

[Frank R.]

How many toilets are on the second floor?
If more than one, how close together are they? On a common wall? Other ends of the home?

Terry, 2 toilets on second floor. Toilet that has the "issue" is located south west rear of the house. Main bathroom toilet is located due north more middle of the house.

No common wall. If there were no walls on the 2nd floor, the toilets are approximately 18 feet apart

Toilet with the "issue" has its own soil stack in the basement. The main bathroom toilet on 2nd floor and the toilet on 1st floor have a common soil stack.

 

[Jeff Knecht]

Terry, 2 toilets on second floor. Toilet that has the "issue" is located south west rear of the house. Main bathroom toilet is located due north more middle of the house.

No common wall. If there were no walls on the 2nd floor, the toilets are approximately 18 feet apart

Toilet with the "issue" has its own soil stack in the basement. The main bathroom toilet on 2nd floor and the toilet on 1st floor have a common soil stack

Terry, 2 toilets on second floor. Toilet that has the "issue" is located south west rear of the house. Main bathroom toilet is located due north more middle of the house.

No common wall. If there were no walls on the 2nd floor, the toilets are approximately 18 feet apart

Toilet with the "issue" has its own soil stack in the basement. The main bathroom toilet on 2nd floor and the toilet on 1st floor have a common soil stack.

Final Analysis?