Water Filtration help, please!

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mainemud

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New House, New Well...

The well has been in use for 2-1/2 years. I had an intitial test for E. Coli, Arsenic and Radon after 3 months of the well being in use (all three tests were well below the max).

Recently had a comprehensive water test done:

PH 6.8
Calcium 17.1
Copper 0.0049
Hardness(calc) 59.8 mg CaCO3/L
Iron 1.00
Magnesium 4.16
Manganese 0.254
Sodium 13.2

Somewhat confusing to me as I have SOFT water and PH that is barely below the minimum. Here are my thoughts...

Install a 10"x4.5" Big Blue Aries Calcite and Corosex inline filter cartridge and housing.
Install a water softner (small?) post the Calcite/ Corosex inline filter.

Then call it good. The iron is low and is definetly Ferrous. But in combination with the high manganese I am getting some orange staining in toilet tanks, humidifiers, and so on.

I will also note that I installed a standard size 5 ppm inline sediment filter post the expansion tank and I am having to change it out about every 3 weeks (very orange in color - like rust) and has some sediment trapped.

Looking for input. Thank you in advance,
 

Reach4

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Was the water for the test sampled after your water treatment, including the calcite?

If that was your raw water, yes, you don't need a calcite tank or other pH adjustment method. You need a backwashing filter that will treat the iron, and capture fine sediment.

Does your cartridge filter catch any bigger pieces?
 

mainemud

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Was the water for the test sampled after your water treatment, including the calcite?

If that was your raw water, yes, you don't need a calcite tank or other pH adjustment method. You need a backwashing filter that will treat the iron, and capture fine sediment.

Does your cartridge filter catch any bigger pieces?
Reach4, Sorry if I mislead you - I currently onlty have a sediment filter installed. I do not have a calcite filter. So, Yes, this was a "raw water test.

The Current 5ppm sediment cartridge filter does not capture any "bigger pieces" but it does clog up in a short amount of time with what appears to be a rust color sediment.

I understand that I need a backwashing iron filter, but what about the low ppm (soft water)??

Thank you

Greg
 

Reach4

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Your water is closer to 3 than 4 grains per gallon (GPG). Few people with that water would feel a need for a softener. Actually, most people with 7 GPG would not feel a need for a softener, but some would. A softener would be able to deal with the iron in addition to softening, with a little help. The softener only needs about 2.4 GPM to regenerate.

So in thinking about a potential backwashing iron filter, how many gallons per minute (GPM) can your pump deliver. 8 would be a good number, I think, for a 10x54 tank with Katalox Light.

Also, does your water have an H2S smell? A softener will not help that.
 

mainemud

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My deep well submersible pump puts out 10.8 GPM. There is a slight smell (at times) coming from the water.

G
 

Gsmith22

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Run an LSI calculation. slightly low pH and soft water could mean very negative LSI which will eat copper and other metalic substances that are part of the plumbing system. With only 2.5 years in, its probably too early to show any visible problems. if you have pex, probably not a plumbing problem although most fixtures, hot water heater, etc. have metal in contact with water so you could get parts going bad early
 

Reach4

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I am not a pro. I don't sell anything. I would be considering a Katalox Light backwashing filter, BUT with a softener piston. The valve might be a Fleck The brine draw line would actually suck from what would be the brine port out of a solution tank. Yet unless some dealer kits that all, it might be a problem to figure it out.

Also, the KL with AIO has some proponents with an air bubble to help with the oxidation of the ferrous iron.

My iron+H2S filter is something like that, using Centaur Carbon. They have gone to a valve that I would tend to avoid.

You should be able to get some improvement in the H2S for a while (not sure how long) with a good sanitizing come spring. https://terrylove.com/forums/index....izing-extra-attention-to-4-inch-casing.65845/ is my sanitizing write-up.

For preventing H2S generation in the water heater, I like replacing the anode with a powered anode, but not with a stubby electrode. That would do nothing to help your iron problem.
 

mainemud

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Run an LSI calculation. slightly low pH and soft water could mean very negative LSI which will eat copper and other metalic substances that are part of the plumbing system. With only 2.5 years in, its probably too early to show any visible problems. if you have pex, probably not a plumbing problem although most fixtures, hot water heater, etc. have metal in contact with water so you could get parts going bad early
Gsmith22, you brought up my exact concern with the water being so soft! I do have Pex (99% anyways), but yes there is the concern with the Propane furnace / hw heater exchangers.

I ran a LSI caculation and attached it here. The negative LSI of -2.5 is ALARMING.

I will have to research what to do about the soft water and I assume that I should Install a 10"x4.5" Big Blue Aries Calcite and Corosex inline filter cartridge and housing and then an Iron FIlter with recharge capabilities????

Thank you



Screenshot 2023-02-09 13.46.10.png
Screenshot 2023-02-09 13.40.13.png
 

Gsmith22

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-2.5 is crazy low for LSI. assuming the calculation was done correctly, I would look into soda ash injection to correct the pH, not calcite. you already have soft water, no need to screw that up with calcite and then need a softener to reduce hardness after correcting the pH. ferrous iron and manganeese are not typically treated with a softener (and calcite wouldn't do anything for that). look to reach's suggestions on iron but the basic premise is to turn ferrous iron (dissolved) to ferric iron (filterable like sediment) and then filter the ferric iron. not sure how katalox light works but I see it mentioned alot with respect to iron removal. i don't recall at the moment but you might want to do iron removal before pH adjustment as a lot of processes work better at lower pH than higher pH
 

mainemud

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-2.5 is crazy low for LSI. assuming the calculation was done correctly, I would look into soda ash injection to correct the pH, not calcite. you already have soft water, no need to screw that up with calcite and then need a softener to reduce hardness after correcting the pH. ferrous iron and manganeese are not typically treated with a softener (and calcite wouldn't do anything for that). look to reach's suggestions on iron but the basic premise is to turn ferrous iron (dissolved) to ferric iron (filterable like sediment) and then filter the ferric iron. not sure how katalox light works but I see it mentioned alot with respect to iron removal. i don't recall at the moment but you might want to do iron removal before pH adjustment as a lot of processes work better at lower pH than higher pH
Thanks Gsmith22...

I understand in regards to the Iron Removal (as suggested by reach) and turning ferrous iron into ferric iron *may need air injection.

What I don't understand is your suggestion of using soda ash injection correct the pH. My pH is already at 6.8 and soda ash is for when you don’t want to make your water hard and if you have a very low pH. Definitely less than 6 and for sure less than 5. If it’s between 5.8 and 6.9 you can get away using calcite neutralizer. *I am concerned with bringing the hardness of the water up - and then needing a water softenener, so I understand that.

My take:

1 -The iron and manganese treatement with a backflushing iron removal filter (media to be determined).
2 -Somehow lower the hardness of the water without messing with the pH, although there is room for the pH to come up some! Perhaps a calcite neutralizer filter with a custom calcite media?
 
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Gsmith22

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Thanks Gsmith22...

I understand in regards to the Iron Removal (as suggested by reach) and turning ferrous iron into ferric iron *may need air injection.

What I don't understand is your suggestion of using soda ash injection correct the pH. My pH is already at 6.8 and soda ash is for when you don’t want to make your water hard and if you have a very low pH. Definitely less than 6 and for sure less than 5. If it’s between 5.8 and 6.9 you can get away using calcite neutralizer. *I am concerned with bringing the hardness of the water up - and then needing a water softenener, so I understand that.

My take:

1 -The iron and manganese treatement with a backflushing iron removal filter (media to be determined).
2 -Somehow lower the hardness of the water without messing with the pH, although there is room for the pH to come up some! Perhaps a calcite neutralizer filter with a custom calcite media?
ferrous (dissolved) to ferric (not dissolved) iron can happen with a variety of processes. you basically oxidize the ferrous iron so you can physically filter out the ferric iron. oxidation can happen with the addition of air, chloine, h2o2, and probably something else Im not remembering. depending on concentraiton of iron and likely other water constiutents determines which process you choose. very low levels of iron can be removed with a softener but its not best practice.

you have soda ash injection and calcite processes mixed up. soda ash raises pH without changing hardness and can be used for any amount of pH raise you are looking for because you determine the strength of the soda ash solution you inject. calcite raises pH and hardness and generally only works for 6 and above. you have to start to mix corosex in with the calcite for lower pH correction but its my understanding that corosex is difficult to control so usually you use a mix of calcite and corosex
 

Bannerman

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1 -The iron and manganese treatement with a backflushing iron removal filter (media to be determined).
2 -Somehow lower the hardness of the water without messing with the pH, although there is room for the pH to come up some! Perhaps a calcite neutralizer filter with a custom calcite media?
You have the order of treatment reversed. Iron removal will be most effective when pH is 7.0 or above.
 
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