New bladder tank or CSV valve with small tank and Grundfos sq200

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quartermilecamel

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Ok then, I have the non Lever square d switch also. Its only 2 years old. same age as the failed well x troll tank. I will just throw on the non lever switch.
 

Reach4

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The purpose of the precharge being below the cut-in pressure is to let the tank supply water until the pump can deliver the requirements.

If your pump is slower to deliver water, the tank will have to supply more water during the delay. With a regular pressure switch, the pressure tank being exhausted of water will cause a momentary loss of pressure. The low-pressure-cutout pressure switch will trip in that case.
 

quartermilecamel

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so, taking a shower, it works with 50 psi hold pressure. turning on the heavy duty garden hose at the well, will make it drop momentarily then picks back up to the hold pressure. Bottom line is if I want no pressure drops no matter what I turn on within reason, this bladder tank is too small only because of the soft start pump delay. had pressure at 33 and still, with the garden hose it will drop pressure, maybe not to zero but dip low then pick back up. Low pressure cut out square D switch just became a yard ornament. pressure cut out and in is 42 and 62. Should just test at the 38 or so tank pressure and check shower then.
Currently in my analyze/debate mode as I usually dont settle for almost good enough.
 

Valveman

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Leave the tank at 30 psi. The pump will need 5 seconds to start even with a standard pressure switch and you don't want a short hesitation of water. Hose wide open is just letting out more water than pump can produce so pressure drops. With a nozzle or a few sprinklers on that hose the pressure will stay up.
 

Bannerman

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A larger pressure tank will not help.

In any size tank, if the tank precharge is 40 psi while using a 40/60 psi switch setting, the tank will contain 0 water when the pump is activated so you will likely experience a momentary loss of flow with any pump until it is up to speed. The 38 psi precharge will be typically sufficient to allow flow to continue until the pump rate is maximized.

Because your pump start is delayed for 5 seconds after power is supplied, a greater amount of water will need to remain in the PT to continue to provide flow during that 5 second delay. A 30 psi precharge will allow an increased amount of water to remain in the tank when the pressure switch supplies power at 40 psi. Regardless of the PT capacity, the pressure during the delayed start will be less than the cut in pressure, and less your desired expectations.

To compensate for the undesired low pressure, if your pump will support a 50/70 pressure switch setting, that should allow the tank precharge to be 40 psi instead of only 30 psi which you may find more acceptable.
 

Reach4

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pressure cut out and in is 42 and 62.
I would not go right to 30, but rather would try something higher, such as 38. Then if no trip, maybe reduce a little more for margin.

30 would strain the diaphragm more at 62 than 35 would. Also, the tank will lose precharge slowly-- maybe 1 or 2 psi every 5 years with your Well-X-Trol. Usually they recommend checking precharge annually. With your all butyl diaphragm, that is probably more often than you need.
 

quartermilecamel

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well they werent kidding when they said stainless leaks. all the fittings on the cyclestop valve leak a tiny bit. Just very slow drips forming. Not a constant drip, takes a while for the next drip to drop off. Used teflon tape liberally. Thinking IM going to leave it alone for a while. Its quite weird not to have fluctuating pressure.
 

Reach4

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well they werent kidding when they said stainless leaks. all the fittings on the cyclestop valve leak a tiny bit. Just very slow drips forming. Not a constant drip, takes a while for the next drip to drop off. Used teflon tape liberally. Thinking IM going to leave it alone for a while. Its quite weird not to have fluctuating pressure.
Can you give the threads another turn? You may need longer wrenches.
 
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Valveman

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Stainless to Stainless threads are difficult to seal. Stainless threads are so stiff they don't give any to seal against other threads. I use teflon tape with some pipe dope over the tape, and it seems to help.
 

quartermilecamel

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Well I was about to give it all another turn when I noticed the usuall water pipe condensation sweat. My tank is screwed into the bottom of the csv. So, with the water pipe being cold, it sweats, and drips on the tank. I need to make that tank is on top of everything to keep it from rusting. So options are relocate tank above it all, rotate the whole csv to sideways position, or the last of rotate everything 180 so csv is on the bottom and tank is on the top.
 

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It is not mandatory for the pressure tank to thread into the CSV. Mounting the pressure tank further downstream should then allow the tank to be mounted above the feed line so any condensation formed on the feed line and CSV will drop onto the floor, not onto the tank.
 

Reach4

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Well I was about to give it all another turn when I noticed the usuall water pipe condensation sweat. My tank is screwed into the bottom of the csv. So, with the water pipe being cold, it sweats, and drips on the tank. I need to make that tank is on top of everything to keep it from rusting.
Maybe bind a piece of plastic sheet around the neck to form a skirt over the tank?
 

Reach4

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It is not mandatory for the pressure tank to thread into the CSV. Mounting the pressure tank further downstream should then allow the tank to be mounted above the feed line so any condensation formed on the feed line and CSV will drop onto the floor, not onto the tank.
You want the pressure tank with the pressure switch ideally, tho that is much less critical with a CSV, which slows the flow as cut-off is approached.
 

quartermilecamel

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No, all metal fittings used from csv to main house line. When I teflon taped oil pipe threads into my oil pump on my vw bus 1/4 size pipe, the teflon tape since I wasnt used to it, caused me to overtighten the pipes into the pump and crack it due to the lubricating properties of the tape. Normally when you tighten a pipe, it gets tight rather quickly with out the teflon tape.
Anyway, Im pretty sure theres nothing that can be done about the pipe sweat on the outside of the pipe when waters used. If all is well with this setup, I need to secure all the pipes in place as I relocated the tank so its facing upward along with the cycle stop valve.
I really like this valve, I just hope well water doesnt stop it up or make it fail, but yes, no water pipes hammering or rattling.
 
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