HB with S's drain

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JohnfrWhipple

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Recently I looked

Maybe I should rip off the Kerdi on the Line Drain and just bond Hydro Ban's Sheet membrane directly to the Kerdi Line drains flange.....

That might be the ticket.

Then there is no Kerdi what's so ever!
 
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jadnashua

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Imagine saying this. "Enjoy your steam shower sir. Just make sure you only use it a little bit!"

If your building a steam shower the only two clear choices are NobleSeal TS/CIS or Hydro Ban Sheet Membrane. Why would you not use a vapour proofing membrane suitable for high use. NobleSeal TS does. NobleSeal CIS does. Laticrete's Hydro Ban Sheet Membrane does.
The industry standards for a steam shower are a perm rating less than 1.0 for an occasional use (i.e., residential) steam shower and less than 0.50 perms for a commercial (continuous use) steam shower. If you know of a residential steam shower user that leaves it running all day (and maybe into the night), move them to the commercially rated material, but you can use it anywhere Kerdi might be used if you prefer. Using Kerdi in a residential steam shower where there's a typical family use, you will not run into issues IF you build things properly.

FWIW, KerdiDS (a thicker version of Kerdi) was introduced specifically to support a commercial steam shower, and passes all of the industry standards for that application.
 

Eurob

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Hey John , why you wouldn't remove the attached membrane from the Kerdi line and replace it with the one you want to use . I find the adhesive used to attach the membrane is doesn't bond too much to the fleece .

Full warranty from the same mfg ........... I hope they will not say now .....oh , the SS is not ours , we don't warranty it anymore due to modifications ......... well the Kerdi fix or the Noble 150 should work to attach the membrane to the SS .

A reminder ..... just don't use any polisher on it , it would remove the original oxidation coming with it ........ which will affect the mfg warranty LOL
 

Eurob

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First I would check the connection to the plumbing system -- your ass is on the line -- ......... I've seen ACO linear drain over the "S" foam tray ......it was leaking at the connection . If your drain is moving after installation , I would definitely worry of how well the rest is done .......... I thought you hate the foamy things LOL
 

Eurob

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If you are waterproofing the shower , you are responsible for the leaks , nowhere to hide after the tile is done .

Being a top builder of waterproofing systems , your reputation is on line ............ but don't listen to me ...... I am always to expensive for the job -- price -- , but once I start , the time frame and details are reflecting the exact price -- worth money paid -- ......... only if you want it ............. I always stick with what I know works for long term time frame. :)
 

Eurob

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You have quite a bit of work -- make it work with the outside of the shower area -- ....... don't think resetting and checking the connection of the drain in the same time will make it such a hole in the budget , which is already punctured by the previous install(er) ............. the great news , it was caught in early stages .

I would worry more how to make it work with the outside of the shower area without increasing substantially the transition of the floor levels -- no curb shower , bathroom to adjacent floor areas -- ............ your client will tell you more about the road he prefers to take .


If your shower is the only area of work , a redo it will solve lots of headaches -- testing -- and assumptions . Don't forget , you are there as an expert in the waterproofing and safe build , would you try to make it work -- work over it -- after you have doubts about the install ?
 

Eurob

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Yet -- curbless still possible -- , what I can see is , by increasing -- not more than 1/2inch -- the height of the outside area of the shower will give you sufficient height to make the high point of the slope in the shower area .

If the linear drain can be lowered -- after removing it decision -- , then the win win situation will be available .

Aren't leveling towers used in self leveling pours of big areas ?
 

ShowerDude

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What a crap job........like Roberto said your rep is on the line...... I wouldnt touch it unless you get to tear that drain out.

Then send half of it to cerobs lab for more testing.

This poor builder has me wondering how this kerdi specialist talked him into this job? Did he not know the right questions to ask?

The builder hired a kerdi sales specialist with no build skills? Poor guy. Bad for everyone involved. Stay away from foam and orange.

Excited to see our man John Whipple make this right.

So many new products and install methods out there everyone needs to be cautious of who they hire and the why of it. Id suspect the price was attractive and the salesman good with his tongue.?

Feel bad for the builder but now he's in good hands w/John.
 

jadnashua

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It doesn't matter what product you use...if you don't install it properly, you'll have problems. Seems to fall in line with the TCNA study that says 70-80% of tiled showers aren't installed properly. There are people that know how, then there are people that think they know how, and others that just don't care.

FWIW, the Kerdi foam trays are rated at 500psi after the tile is installed (not before!).
 

ShowerDude

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John,

I have been eying that 36 quick in your bone yard. I like the vintage flashing !!!! Trying to fit it into a forthcoming project and just sent a link to my client yesterday!!! Very fair price...

Roberto, John,

Whats the concensus on the best "tile in" point drain? considering airlock and such? is the Kohler one any good my client is specifying the abs kohler version???? of course it will be another noble weep divot pan that it has to work with....and some linear marmara mosaic so maybe a bigger grate would be cool.... ?

any advice ? thx
 

Eurob

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I would stay away from the tile in grates . With the linear mosaic , a linear drain will work great .......... is it the PLD 36 you've been eying ?

is the shower getting multiple sources of water -- jets, rain shower , etc. -- ? I think the air lock will be present only for the square small grates .
 

ShowerDude

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John,

I have been eying that 36 quick in your bone yard. Trying to fit it into a forthcoming project and just sent a link to it yesterday!!! Very fair price...

Roberto, John,

Whats the concensus on the best "tile in" point drain? considering airlock and such? is the Kohler one any good my client is specifying the abs kohler version???? of course it will be another noble weep divot pan that it has to work with....and some linear marmara mosaic so maybe a bigger grate would be cool.... ?

any advice ? thx
I would stay away from the tile in grates . With the linear mosaic , a linear drain will work great .......... is it the PLD 36 you've been eying ?

is the shower getting multiple sources of water -- jets, rain shower , etc. -- ? I think the air lock will be present only for the square small grates .


This client wants her kohler point drain w tile in grate. The 36" linear pld is on johns site for $350 free shipping great deal.

Cant fit it into this build anyways ...need a 32".

This shower will have grohe ibox single diverter 2 heads and tile in point drain.

Ill have to go cowboy on the drain strainer for flow rate , best i can do is educate the homeowner on the concerns of airlock and then install the drain she wants.

Such a neat client she will get what she wants!


Whipple, i like your new tagline.
 

ShowerDude

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I would look for info :)

to be clear I was talking about A POINT drain! not linear simply whats the best tile in point drain. I just havent used the Kohler tile in point and my client wants it.

I am coming around to ACO drains. cant doubt that they are the best.
 

Eurob

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It was only an example -- not found yet a pdf or technical specification for a Kohler point drain -- of what to look for as a technical document . The tile in grate from ACO with the technical specifications -- drawings --

ACO point drain -- tile grate --

If she wants the Kohler version of it , then she should have the technical specs ready for you -- flow rate , air chamber space , drawings -- . Does the Kohler point drain have all the plumbing standards approvals ?
 
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ShowerDude

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Well yes the kohler is spec'd on their site and is fine ....... Just cheap abs............ if they all have airlock issues then ill try to buy the aco and adaptor and use that with an souix chief riser.

I just looked for the aco point drain on the usa aco site and dindt see it. ? Maybe john has one for me.

Now im on my phone away from my laptop and dont get the same search results. You linked to the australia aco site?

Thx Roberto
http://m.us.kohler.com/mt/www.us.ko...productDetail/Showering-Components/426354.htm

Update: i am misinformed and didnt look deep enough. Tile in, does not equate to Tiletop drain and the kohler drain is not a tiletop. thx roberto for waking me up... Just the reason I'm here on terrys site. For smart advice from real tile/plumbing pros. And vegas too!!!
 
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Eurob

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RSCB said:
This client wants her kohler point drain w tile in grate.

I didn't see the specs for the Kohler on their site ........ of a tile in grate . Just a regular one as per your link .


I didn't check before , but now that you've mentioned the link from Australia -- yes it is -- ...... the link provided with the linear grate from ACO is actually the link of the tile in grate -- listed from the http://www.quartzbyaco.com/technical-specifications --

from the USA site. It looks like they don't list a tile in grate for the point drains .
 
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ShowerDude

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Maybe not yet available in usa the aco tile in point drain......

I have my local aco reps number ill check into it....

No hurry just wanna price it for my budgeting concerns and want to give this client the best...i like the souix chief riser better than kohler. And the nice stainless body of aco... Quality. Its sunday and all i do is research shower shit!!!!!!!

All day every day shower this shower that .... Ive lost my marbles!!!!!! Too passionate about this crap just like you!!!!!
 
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