Why I like Thermostatically controlled Shower Valves

[Andy]

This is interesting. I didn't even know thermostatically controlled valves existed.

 

[Jadnashua]

Look at the differences between a thermostatically controlled valve and all others:
- a thermostatically controlled valve is controlling the outlet temperature, regardless of the pressure changes or inlet water temperatures of both the hot and cold both momentary and long-term (as when the season changes or the WH starts to cool off)
- all others, you manually adjust the proportion of hot/cold...a pressure balanced valve will try to retain that balance, but has no real effect if the inlet temperatures change, only a pressure change.

So, essentially constant outlet temperature through pressure and supply changes with a thermostatically controlled valve, or a relatively constant proportion of the hot/cold supplies mix.

My vote is the thermostatically controlled valve.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Keith Frank]

Thanks for sharing, this is good stuff

 

[DIYorBust]

I picked up two delta tempassure valves, with rough trim and cartridge, for about 200 each. Thought that was pretty good for a thermostatic. Any other good options that don't cost an arm and a leg?

I also noticed a nice byproduct from this upgrade. The shower is far from the water heater, so normally there is a period of waiting for the hot water temperature to stabilize. With the thermostatic, you can just hope in as soon as the water is comfortable, and it will ramp up to the desired temperature without further adjustment. Saves some time and wasted hot water every day, it wouldn't surprise me if this one mostly pays for itself before the next renovation. I suppose that depends on how long the cartridges last, but I'm hopeful it will be at least 10 years.

 

[Jadnashua]

I have a Grohe thermostatically controlled valve. THe volume control started to leak after 15-years and was easily replaced. The thermostatic cartridge is still going fine. 10-years should be an easy goal to reach.

 

[FDNY/RETIRED]

More TRUTH is said in jest

About your remark

"Yeah it's dangerous, and that's why by next year in NYC, it will be required that a licensed plumber be present to turn on the water and adjust the temperature each time a tenant showers"

Your not too far off mark as part of my contract is to go back TWICE a year to re adjust the setting for the summer and winter to 106- 108 deg F

This is for a 27 story co op that has over 768 shower body's I will be replacing

Think about it twice a year 768+ shower body's being adjusted @$80 each to allow for temperature fluctuations during the summer and winter .

Five (5) of the board members are lawyers and they are the ones who decided it is cheaper to hire a LMP then have one lawsuit because of personal injury ... here are many children and elderly living there

If the handymen touches the shower valves all warranties are void and they have the liability of any legal action


Sewer cleaning actually NETS more but when your older you can appreciate being an expert as it requires no physical work other then driving to the site.

The more lax the building owners are and the more non licensed idiots do the installations, master plumbers can reap amazing compensation especially if they charge knowing what they are worth

I was told when I was given the case where two toddlers died I could expect over $250,000 for my appearance at depositions and going to court court not counting the funding I already received .

https://video.search.yahoo.com/sear...=d6181e025dff4ca3145b8cd93530649a&action=view

As long unscrupulous landlords and DIY people are out there along with non formally educated plumbers who screw up there is a gold mine for those who are qualified to be an expert

Not all cases involve someone getting hurt or killed some are just testifying against non licensed people dabbling in a licensed profession for example boiler installations or lack of qualified inspections of heating , plumbing , fire suppression systems

One of my bigger accounts was the postal service where I did all the low pressure boiler and unfired pressure vessel inspections even as far as Hicksville LI main post office

$350 per boiler twice a year internal and external Hicksville was a lot more because of traveling time and it failed the first external inspection on one boiler so I had to go back and reinspect them

The reason I gave up the post offices

I had 138 boilers just in the Bronx ,and had Manhattan, Brooklyn, Staten Island and LI and I did not trust my employees to do a proper inspection and it was physically impossible to do a bi yearly inspections of all these boilers and pressure vessels hydrostatic pressure testing and safety valve testing twice a year

The town of Lawrence LI I took a master plumbers test (took almost 20 minutes to pass) and was able to go there for one day at a small shopping center to inspect 7 roof drains that someone installed .

The owner of the property paid me $7,000 to send in a 4 page report as to why the installation was faulty .. A computer store was flooded out and the landlord was looking for to get out from being suit

The reason I took the took test was to show credibility of being locally licensed so if I had to appear in court I would show I knew their local code as NYC codes were to much more stringent for the town

With more lawsuits coming down the pike stricter codes will be required to protect people from themselves as the invaders from 4th world countries never heard about hot water it would seem

I am now working for 3 nursing homes redoing the domestic hot water supply on a T&M basis and I have people working 7 days a week and at night for shutdowns

A lot people do not realize what plumbing encoumpases .

Also being an ex stationary engineer helps with knowing the inner workings of commercial buildings as I was a certified stationary engineer at 90 Church street so I know for personal experience how moons are lawsuits looking to happen this was one of the deciding factors that convinced me to work as an expert

We live in a society where everyone is a victim and expects someone else to take care of them from birth until death with the give me I am entitled mentality and personal responsibility is unheard of for people under 40

Free food (stamps) free housing (section 8) free medical ,free college , stay home and get paid to breed etc.

Interesting you bring this up small world. I have been retired since 911. But my partner who just retired was on that job was Hunts Point don't even have to look at the link. He told me about it and still does. I am telling you that you have no idea how it affected him. I can't tell you how many 911 calls I have been to for burns to children from scalding. I can also tell you how the parent is tried to be blamed for child abuse. Yet IMHO when being in the apt. Be it a family in a shelter, city housing or even private house. Looking around how things were around the house. Showing how caring and devoted these parents or care givers were to these kids. There is no way these people deliberately burnt their children. Some were stupid leaving their kids in a bath tub for just a couple of seconds. To go deal with something in another room. But thats all it takes In most of the calls I was on it was the exception to the rule. I spent 2 yrs Downtown Manhattan and Midtown and 10 yrs in Harlem. Then the Bronx and finally Rockaway. You knew when an adult or a caregiver was responsible for doing something on purpose to their child. I was a Medic in Chicago in some of the worst areas of South and West Chicago. The Cabrini Projects, and the same was true there. Still it always seemed the city or landlord tried to pin it on child abuse.

I am no plumber a handy guy yea. I came to this site for advice on something to do with my new Navien combi boiler. Just started looking at different posts. But I started life out has an auto mechanic in Rockaway. Became an automotive design engineer/mechanical engineer. Then took a 180 turn and went into the Emergency services profession. I remember every child abuse case, shooting, stabbing and burn case I have been on over 23 yrs. I went to many of those children's funerals. The memories this post has just brought up.

 

[Blue_Bleeder]

Arguments about gov't regulations and victimhood aside, there is a reason that technology advances and gives us opportunity to have advanced valves like thermostatic cartridges. That being said, just like every other plumbing part, they eventually fail. We see that after about 15 years. There are two types of thermostatic cartridge controls (that I know of): wax element and bi-metal. The wax element ones are the most common and that part makes up such a tiny part of the multi-piece cartridge. (pic below).

We have come a long way from replacing bibb washers and seats to throwing out a cartridge that costs hundreds of dollars. Just an observation.

 

[Sylvan]

Interesting you bring this up small world. I have been retired since 911. But my partner who just retired was on that job was Hunts Point don't even have to look at the link. He told me about it and still does. I am telling you that you have no idea how it affected him. I can't tell you how many 911 calls I have been to for burns to children from scalding. I can also tell you how the parent is tried to be blamed for child abuse. Yet IMHO when being in the apt. Be it a family in a shelter, city housing or even private house. Looking around how things were around the house. Showing how caring and devoted these parents or care givers were to these kids. There is no way these people deliberately burnt their children. Some were stupid leaving their kids in a bath tub for just a couple of seconds. To go deal with something in another room. But thats all it takes In most of the calls I was on it was the exception to the rule. I spent 2 yrs Downtown Manhattan and Midtown and 10 yrs in Harlem. Then the Bronx and finally Rockaway. You knew when an adult or a caregiver was responsible for doing something on purpose to their child. I was a Medic in Chicago in some of the worst areas of South and West Chicago. The Cabrini Projects, and the same was true there. Still it always seemed the city or landlord tried to pin it on child abuse.

I am no plumber a handy guy yea. I came to this site for advice on something to do with my new Navien combi boiler. Just started looking at different posts. But I started life out has an auto mechanic in Rockaway. Became an automotive design engineer/mechanical engineer. Then took a 180 turn and went into the Emergency services profession. I remember every child abuse case, shooting, stabbing and burn case I have been on over 23 yrs. I went to many of those children's funerals. The memories this post has just brought up.

Ironic Hunts point and children murdered OPPS I mean scalded ... I work for over 37 law firm as an expert witness and the worst case I have been called to investigate was this one at Hunts points


I even spoke to the lieutenant at the property clerks warehouse in Brooklyn and the SGT neither one could give a damn

I told them this radiator DID NOT EXPLODE and if you read " Two tottled die in Hunts point explosion" each FAKE newscasters spews even bigger lies and what they don't know they make up

One moron stated "High-pressure steam" the code states any steam pressure 15 PSI or above is considered high pressure, most apartment building operate below 3 pounds

I do have a lot of legitimate scalding cases where nonlicensed stumblebums or a handyman or building Superintendant installed a shower body without scald protection or the low flow shower head caused the water to become extremely hot when another fixture was used


Over 80% of my cases are scalding of children of course the low life single parent is never held accountable or the fact there are crack viles all over the apartment

https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/bronx/bronx-radiator-explosion-kills-toddlers-article-1.2901985


And


https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-borough...arents-suing-nyc-for-radiator-explosion-bronx

And

https://abc7ny.com/children-burned-apartment-in-hunts-point-the-bronx/1645983/

Notice NOT A single government agency drug tested the father, Also how could he not hear the screams? How did he have a video game on when he was homeless a few days before EACH fake news carrier spews a different story IMHO

 

[DIYorBust]

It would be great if a company would make cheaper cartridges. I bought I generic thermostatic valve, probably from china, on the internet an few years ago, and hooked it up to some hoses to make a temporary yard shower. It close 10 bucks I think and worked fine.