Vintage AS Pressure Balancing Spool Won’t Budge

[Ellesse]

Help. Stuck.

Replacing all valves/cartridges (hot and cold stops, pressure balancing spool, cartridge) for late 80s/early 90s American Standard UltraMix single lever shower w volume control lever. (1363 series)

Needed to replace all valves/cartridge and pressure balancing spool after it
1. Stopped having a hard “stop”. Rather than turning off with a hard stop, the handle would continue rotating ramp the shower up again, requiring the user to find the “sweet spot” where the shower was not turning back on again.

Managed w that until

2. The shower yielded only hot water

Given the age, as I had to take off the handle, escutcheon etc in order to replace the cartridge and pressure-balancing spool, I decided to replace the hot and cold check stops while I was at it.

Replacing check stops w/o incident. Removed old cartridge and confident I will be able to install replacement w/o difficulty.

My problem? Unable to remove the pressure balancing spool. (Replacement spool assembly has a hex head so won’t have this problem in future. For now, I am at an impasse for removing the original.

Top of the spool assembly (see photo) has two parallel edges, ant the top and bottom and two round sides, with slot between the parallel edges for a screwdriver. No socket I’ve seen will fit, as the distance between the parallel top and bottom edges is less than the distance between the rounded sides.

Adjustable wrench and 9/16” open ended crescent wrench will fit around the parallel portions, but have failed to budge it. Have tried regular length wrenches and a stubby wrench.

Have also tried letting it sit w a citric acid soaked towel wrapped around it. No success.

Have been hesitant to use a penetrant like Liquid Wrench, but eventually tried that, too. It failed.

Have even drilled two spots for inserting needlenose pliers so I could turn those with a wrench (video on YT showed that working). All that happens for me is the plier jaws start to twist. Sticking bolts in the two drilled holes and grabbing and turning w adjustable wrench only succeeded in twisting and deforming bolts.

Have tried inserting wide flathead screwdriver (with straight sided shaft) into holes and grasping shaft w adjustable wrench and turning. No success. Screwdriver eventually just pops out.

Open ended wrench proving difficult to get enough leverage on, given limited space. Tends to pop off if much torque is applied. Have tried using hammer on wrench running perpendicular to shaft of wrench on spool head, to try to loosen it. (See photo w red “hammer” illustration.)

Now that I’ve drilled into it, it MUST be removed.

This is all that is standing between us and using the shower again.

Everything is being held up by this stubborn balancing spool.

Anyone w a similar experience who overcame this? Short of C4 or other suggestions that would destroy the bower or home, any tips that have worked, or other helpful suggestions? In the photos you can see I have removed the hot valve stop temporarily to provide more access.

Photos show 9/16” wrenches (reg and stubby) in both orientations - neither orientation has succeeded.

Thank you in advance for your time and effort.

 

[Breplum]

Happily never had your particular issue. I would try heat from a torch, judiciously. maybe have two people doing the wrenching with one just holding primary wrench in place, and hammering is smart.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[John Gayewski]

I was also gonna say tapping with a hammer. Either on the wrench tapping or on the face. I think it might just need a good shock to start it loose.

Have you tried vinegar in a spray bottle?

Possibly a very large flat head screw driver, in combination with the wrench both twisting together.

As a very last resort drilling it out stepping up sizes until there's only a shell left, but that's the last resort as any wrong move there will require a new valve body.

 

[Ellesse]

Have tried hammer. Did subsequently wonder about heat.. Perhaps alternating heat and cold? Will try the suggestions incl vinegar.
Yes, drilling all out is a lats ditch option, due to the risk involved.

Will advise on any progress made, and if successful, what worked.

 

[Ellesse]

Thank you for your input.

 

[Ellesse]

Promised an update - prepared with thanks to both Breplum and John Gayewski for your thoughtful suggestions.

A good degree of success to report.

It has moved and is now several threads out.

Sadly, that’s as far as it goes. It just spins and spins without coming out further.

What I did:

Sprayed vinegar several times and let soak in (as much as one can, on a vertical surface), and left it to sit with a vinegar soaked paper towel around the edge of the head. Wiped carefully and deeply (using a finger nail) around the edge of the head and the flat mating surface below, to remove whatever remaining corrosion etc deposits I could reach.

Took a wide slotted screwdriver and gave the edge of the head several firm taps with a hammer as I moved the screw driver around the edge of the spool head rim.

Inserted the wide flat head driver, w the square shaft, firmly into the drilled holes and using the adjustable wrench around the shaft, applied slow, steady but very firm torque.

It moved!

And after my initial jubilation, it’s not coming out any further (see photo in situ, plus photo of replacement part, for an idea of number of threads that are exposed, vs number that need to be exposed - I think it’s there and doesn’t need to be “unthreaded” further in order to be released from captivity).

Am wondering if it is hitting resistance w the old o rings. Pulling at it with needle nose pliers as I turn it doesn’t get it out any further, however. 100 revolutions - even having a go at it w a slotted driver in the power drill - nothing can coax the spool out further - so far. Have pulled by hand, too.

I am very grateful for the suggestions that have moved it to this point.

Any further suggestions to get it to fully removed remain welcome. Am thinking of cutting off the spool at the face of the housing hole, if nothing else works. My question on that is: Would that make it more difficult to retrieve the remains inside the hole?

Seems as though something that fits around the threaded portion, the shaft, under the top edge, that tightens up and pulls it out, as the spool turns (not dissimilar in concept to a bearing puller n some respects), might be helpful and less potentially destructive than cutting the exposed portion off and trying to retrieve the remainder that is still in the housing.

Again, many thanks in advance and also for the advice so far.

 

[Ellesse]

Further update. Interdisciplinary tools - plug inserted for repairing tire punctures - inserted, turned, and pulled, and pulled, and pulled, have brought another degree of success.

 

[Ellesse]

Success!!!

Even my strong husband could not yard it out; however, continued to spray with vinegar and suddenly it all released.
Thank you again for your help and thank you to Terry Love for this site and forum. It has been a helpful resource.
I am one very grateful forum member.
Now to clean out the housing, apply some silicone lubricant to the replacement spool and I can almost see the light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[Ellesse]

This is just some of the residue that the old spool left in the housing.

The interior of brass housing was gross. A tooth brush removed very little, and the smallest brass brush from Canadian Tire splayed but was helpful far as it could go - only the uppermost threads. Unrolled enough of a DollarTree copper scourer to make a thumb-sized wad of copper mesh. (Copper being softer than brass, this posed no risk of damaging threads). Chucked the wad in a drill, fed it into the housing, and after several minutes with the homemade copper ‘brush’, the housing went from yuck to quite acceptable and made it possible to both insert AND remove the new spool assembly with ease. Before this cleaning, the new spool would stick greatly and be hard to remove, even w silicone lubricant applied. There remains a rough, dark lip at the bottom on the threads, but that appears to be structural and I do not want to try anything more aggressive. I do not want to risk damaging the housing and hindering a seal, and its current condition does not hinder insertion or removal of the spool assembly.

New cartridge installed. Shower up and running. Cartridge “stop” does allow handle to overshoot the closed position and reopen the valve slightly, but that I can either live w that or try to finesse the stop w a small modification, like a small rubber pad inserted as a bumper at the molded stop at the top of the cartridge.