To have employees ... or not

[hj]

helper

If you hire an apprentice, unless you go the route of the rooter companies and create 6 week wonders, he is going to be a liability for a long time, because YOU will still have to do all the work, while he rides around with you seeing how you do it. And since he is not doing anything productive, you cannot put his time on your invoice. Once he does become productive, you will have to furnish a fully stocked vehicle and double your gas and maintenance bills. Normally, your workload has to be well beyond what you can do yourself before it justifies an additional worker. The normal route, if you already have employees, is to start paying them overtime to take up the excess until there is enough demand to warrant the additional cost of adding an employee.

 

[99k]

If you hire an apprentice, unless you go the route of the rooter companies and create 6 week wonders, he is going to be a liability for a long time, because YOU will still have to do all the work, while he rides around with you seeing how you do it. And since he is not doing anything productive, you cannot put his time on your invoice.

You would surprised how little an apprentice is paid and how much is invoiced to the customer. I had one guy trying to charge me 2X the hours when he brought his apprentice ... and the space was so tight only one was working

Normally, your workload has to be well beyond what you can do yourself before it justifies an additional worker. The normal route, if you already have employees, is to start paying them overtime to take up the excess until there

Herein lies the problem, the guy doing all the overtime is myself. I imagine getting the first employee is the most difficult. I met another plumber at a jobsite who would just use a helper (not an apprentice) ... cheaper I guess and a lot less demand on his time.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[NHmaster]

Once you make the decision to grow your business, things will change forever. Some for the better, some for worse. There is no doubt that employees add a whole new dimension to the way you not only conduct business, but also the way you think about business. Suddenly time, or more accurately, billing time, takes on a whole new meaning. Employees, good ones can make your business grow beyond your imagination. Bad one's can give you a bad reputation in a very short time. The trick for me is to never get too close to them. You can not be objective when your employee is a friend. Stay out of their personal business. I just flat don't want to hear about their personal problems any more than they want to hear about mine. Employees are there to make the company money. If they are not producing, they gotta go. Treat them with respect and reward initiative and with luck they will be productive for many years.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

never get too close to them

Suddenly time, or more accurately, billing time, takes on a whole new meaning. Employees, good ones can make your business grow beyond your imagination. Bad one's can give you a bad reputation in a very short time. The trick for me is to never get too close to them. You can not be objective when your employee is a friend. Stay out of their personal business. I just flat don't want to hear about their personal problems any more than they want to hear about mine. .

Very well put


you have to be cold as ice...

because 95% of everything
that comes out of their mouths are fabrications tall tales and lies.
basically to get you to feel sorry for them, give them more money,
understand why they need the rest of the week off.....

I have heard it all...

 

[Dunbar Plumbing]

If you hire an apprentice, unless you go the route of the rooter companies and create 6 week wonders, he is going to be a liability for a long time, because YOU will still have to do all the work, while he rides around with you seeing how you do it. And since he is not doing anything productive, you cannot put his time on your invoice. Once he does become productive, you will have to furnish a fully stocked vehicle and double your gas and maintenance bills. Normally, your workload has to be well beyond what you can do yourself before it justifies an additional worker. The normal route, if you already have employees, is to start paying them overtime to take up the excess until there is enough demand to warrant the additional cost of adding an employee.

That above is the number one reason why I've never committed to hiring anyone.

It's just too expensive nowadays to carry driftwood.

 

[Master Plumber 101]

That above is the number one reason why I've never committed to hiring anyone.

It's just too expensive nowadays to carry driftwood.

Keep creating job's and expanding the economy. Your a true entrepreneur.

 

[Master Plumber 101]

Hmmm people like you in the job pool should be sufficient to scare any business owner from expanding...
It would probably take years to get over the bad reputation your style of plumbing would cause.

Go drown in your pool or something.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

their are those who do and those who teach

Keep creating job's and expanding the economy. Your a true entrepreneur.View attachment 5331

Actuallly until you have run your own business, you really
dont know what in the hell you are talking about....

Cutting grass as a side job ....while you are sitting on the
bench waiting for the next union job to come up is not the
same as haveing to be the one responsible for everything. .... every day......


I doubt you have ever skipped a mandatory mid-morning
break,
I doubt you have ever totally skipped lunch either
to get the job done and move on to the next one...

the tools hit the ground exactly at high noon....
no..... make that 10 till noon...


and you dont start back up again till the clock says so.
or you are done with that last drag on the cigarette.....

grumbling and moaning about your benefit package
all the way back to the crime scene....


that is probably why Rugged does not want to hire

it makes sense to me

 

[hj]

helper

You would surprised how little an apprentice is paid and how much is invoiced to the customer. I had one guy trying to charge me 2X the hours when he brought his apprentice

When I made my original comment, I was referring to an ethical plumber who would only charge for the helper/apprentice if the job actually required a second person. Not one charging for someone he was just transporting around all day long. That is done by the big Yellow trucks that always have two people in them.

 

[Cookie]

You should really take your argument private.

 

[Mort]

Wow....some of you guys are pretty brutal. I've only got six employees (not plumbing however) and couldn't run my business nearly as well or profitably without them. I've only hired one new person recently but the rest have worked for me ten or more years. To get licensed (necessary in my field) takes 80 hours classroom time and a state test, but about two years to really get up to speed and be productive (read profitable) When hiring a new employee I usually let them ferment for about three months or so just to see if they really want to do the job and like the enviroment. If they like it, I pay for the schooling, room and board while attending, and the associated costs of getting a license. After that, it's just learning the ropes.

My employees, having to deal with the public, do have to put up with a lot of guff at times. It goes with the territory. I insist they maintain a professional attitude and be courteous to all clients. That said, NOBODY is required to listen to foul language or tolerate hot tempers....those cases come directly to me and if I can't get them to calm down and discuss whatever their issue might be then they can take a long walk of a short pier.

Are employees expensive? You bet!! Ouside of the government mandated taxes, fees, etc., providing decent health insurance is pretty danged costly (and it's something nobody sees on their paycheck so it largely goes under appreciated as compensation) As an employer, I get less time off in the sense of taking continous time off (like the two week vacation time I provide with full pay) and when things aren't going well am also the first in line to get reduced pay if necessary to get through the lean times.

All in all....I wouldn't change a thing

Mort

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

Mort....you are lucky

Mort. I fondly remember those days....

had about 7 employees at one time, but with one
then another, then another retireing, it degraded quickly into troubles..

the good guys watched my back for me...and made sure that the others stayed in line.....

If you have a couple of good guys , good for you...


Enjoy the moment....maybe if you are lucky ,,,

you will retire before any of them do...........

 

[Master Plumber 101]

Actuallly until you have run your own business, you really
dont know what in the hell you are talking about....

Cutting grass as a side job ....while you are sitting on the
bench waiting for the next union job to come up is not the
same as haveing to be the one responsible for everything. .... every day......


I doubt you have ever skipped a mandatory mid-morning
break,
I doubt you have ever totally skipped lunch either
to get the job done and move on to the next one...

the tools hit the ground exactly at high noon....
no..... make that 10 till noon...


and you dont start back up again till the clock says so.
or you are done with that last drag on the cigarette.....

grumbling and moaning about your benefit package
all the way back to the crime scene....


that is probably why Rugged does not want to hire

it makes sense to me

Never had to cut grass while sitting on the bench..never been layed off. How would you do that any how?It's hard to cut grass and sit on a bench.I choose not to run a bussiness because my family is more important. I have my Master's just in case, but I probably will never do it. Also who can afford the outrageous cost of healthcare. Maybe if our politician's can provide it's citizen's with the same healthcare they get I'll think about it.

Quit saying 10:00 break, it's 9:30, get it right already.I have skipped break and lunch a number of time's because I wanted to get the job done. In the end you can't make the boss money when your tired and hungry. Believe it or not people need food to survive. When you ran your buissness did you tell your employee's you better not take a lunch or your fired?..wait you probably did.

I don't smoke. It cause's cancer you know. So no cancer stick's for me.

I don't grumble what I get cause there is nothing to grumble about. I'm compansated fairly, that's why i joined a union.

So next time don't presume you know people when your completely clueless.

 

[Mort]

Mort. I fondly remember those days....

had about 7 employees at one time, but with one
then another, then another retireing, it degraded quickly into troubles..

the good guys watched my back for me...and made sure that the others stayed in line.....

If you have a couple of good guys , good for you...


Enjoy the moment....maybe if you are lucky ,,,

you will retire before any of them do...........

I hear that. Made it 24 years (so far) and have had a few retirees and such over that time but have been fortunate enough (or maybe it's good management skills ) to find good people as replacements. Had more employees in the past when it seemed like a good idea to "grow" the business but it didn't turn out to be such a good idea afterall. Being a bigger business, at times, was like having a target painted on my back.

Mort

 

[NHmaster]

You should really take your argument private.

Where's the fun it that.?

 

[Cookie]

"No one expects you to agree with everything," quoting the words of, Palin, from the Republican National Convention, " but, it (disagreements) should be done with integrity and goodwill." Makes sense to me.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

Dont Worry

So next time don't presume you know people when your completely clueless.

I dont presume anything about you....

I think that everyone here has got your number already..

considering half the people have you on their ignore list...

you are a real ....."tool" .....pal

 

[Kingsotall]

bussiness because my family is more important. I have my Master's just in case, but I probably will never do it. Also who can afford the outrageous cost of healthcare. Maybe if our politician's can provide it's citizen's with the same healthcare they get I'll think about it.

Quit saying 10:00 break, it's 9:30, get it right already.I have skipped break and lunch a number of time's because I wanted to get the job done. In the end you can't make the boss money when your tired and hungry. Believe it or not people need food to survive. When you ran your buissness did you tell your employee's you better not take a lunch or your fired?..wait you probably did.

I don't smoke. It cause's cancer you know. So no cancer stick's for me.

I don't grumble what I get cause there is nothing to grumble about. I'm compansated fairly, that's why i joined a union.

So next time don't presume you know people when your completely clueless.

Master's¿


btw, I'm sure I missed more punctuation errors in that post but it got to be a little overwhelming!

 

[Kingsotall]

I choose not to run a bussiness because my family is more important. I have my Master's just in case, but I probably will never do it. Also who can afford the outrageous cost of healthcare. Maybe if our politician's can provide it's citizen's with the same healthcare they get I'll think about it.

Quit saying 10:00 break, it's 9:30, get it right already.I have skipped break and lunch a number of time's because I wanted to get the job done. In the end you can't make the boss money when your tired and hungry. Believe it or not people need food to survive. When you ran your buissness did you tell your employee's you better not take a lunch or your fired?..wait you probably did.

I don't smoke. It cause's cancer you know. So no cancer stick's for me.

I don't grumble what I get cause there is nothing to grumble about. I'm compansated]/B] fairly, that's why i joined a union.

So next time don't presume you know people when your completely clueless.

A Master's huh¿

 

[Cass]

Maybe if our politician's can provide it's citizen's with the same health care they get I'll think about it.

You mis spoke there...

Politicians can't provide health care...They can't provide anything...They reach into the pockets of tax payers and take our $$$ so we can provide it for every one. They know best. Yeah Right.

Hmmmm. take our money so they can create a money sucking bureaucracy that inflates the costs and lowers the quality of health care.

It will be a corporate boost if they provide health care for every one and the corps. can drop what they offer, and I bet the politicians have a different plan for themselves.