PVC 90-degree long sweep 'turned' at an angle?

[Dan]

Hi all, once again here for some help: can I turn a PVC 90-degree long sweep elbow slightly towards its side?

The problem is the plumbing below my bathroom is not in line with the wall above it. I am replacing some old steel 1.5" drain pipe and when I took the section out it is not perfectly 'vertical.' see photos of the cut out galvanized piping:

For most of my DIY plumbing work everything has been lined up in a plane: perfectly horizontal or perfectly vertical. but to get the pipe into the cavity of the wall I need to angle the long sweep before going straight up.

I'm thinking there are two ways to achieve this 'angle':

(1) Replicate the original bends: turn the long sweep on its 'side' a bit and add 45-degree elbow and angle it a bit
(2) Have the long sweep go straight up and use a 45-degree elbow to get it set back into the wall above

I imagine replicating the original is easiest to do, if 'laying' the long sweep on its side a bit is up to code. are any of the two methods preferable? Any other methods to do this and be up-to-code? thanks.

 

[wwhitney]

So you have a horizontal line (2% slope) and a vertical line (true vertical) but they're not quite in plane with each other, they are skew lines?

If so, you could jog one line with a couple 22.5s. Or depending on how big an offset you need, you could rotate your long turn 90 22.5 degrees and then use a 22.5 to get back to true horizontal/vertical (depending on which side of the long turn 90 you have the 22.5 degree elbow).

Or, more complicated but more flexible, you could use a 45, a 22.5 and a 45; now you have two degrees of freedom and should be able to accommodate different amounts of offset. But it will be tricky to get the relative rotations of the elbows correct.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Dan]

So you have a horizontal line (2% slope) and a vertical line (true vertical) but they're not quite in plane with each other, they are skew lines?

If so, you could jog one line with a couple 22.5s. Or depending on how big an offset you need, you could rotate your long turn 90 22.5 degrees and then use a 22.5 to get back to true horizontal/vertical (depending on which side of the long turn 90 you have the 22.5 degree elbow).

Or, more complicated but more flexible, you could use a 45, a 22.5 and a 45; now you have two degrees of freedom and should be able to accommodate different amounts of offset. But it will be tricky to get the relative rotations of the elbows correct.

Cheers, Wayne

Wayne I appreciate your suggestions.

I want to confirm that it is up to code to 'rotate' the long sweep (see circled portion thumbnail image i borrowed below) as i think you're suggesting in the first option? in other words the 'sweep' coming up does not need to be perfectly vertical?

For your second option, I'm not understanding the placement of the 22.5-degree elbow with the long sweep (i never did like geometry). could I not do:
long sweep (straight vertical) + 45-degree (turned) + straight pipe + 45-degree?

Are there any rules about number of bends and proximity of bends to an elbow? I want to work with the solution that has the fewest bends but want to learn and be sure I'm not missing anything.

Also always love me more degrees of freedom. Though not sure if I should penalize myself for every 'test' fit I do.

 

[Dan]

So you have a horizontal line (2% slope) and a vertical line (true vertical) but they're not quite in plane with each other, they are skew lines?

If so, you could jog one line with a couple 22.5s. Or depending on how big an offset you need, you could rotate your long turn 90 22.5 degrees and then use a 22.5 to get back to true horizontal/vertical (depending on which side of the long turn 90 you have the 22.5 degree elbow).

Or, more complicated but more flexible, you could use a 45, a 22.5 and a 45; now you have two degrees of freedom and should be able to accommodate different amounts of offset. But it will be tricky to get the relative rotations of the elbows correct.

Cheers, Wayne

also heres a photo of a stand in down pipe and long sweep lined up vertically

 

[wwhitney]

No problem rotating the combo. Looks like you could rotate it 22.5 degrees and use a single street 22.5 to get back to vertical, and it would line up.

But if that's off by more than 1/2", it would be simplest just to use the combo with inlet plumb, and a pair of 22.5s to get the correct offset. 22.5s are better than 45s, I'd say, unless you would run out of room with the 22.5s (they would need a longer segment between them).

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Dan]

the original pipe is a wye with a 45-degree elbow. im' wondering if using a wye + a 45-degree elbow would be easiest rather than the long sweep?

if i go wye + 45-degree elbow route, does the 45 degree need to be a 'street' fitting or can i but a straight piece of pipe in between the 45-degree elbow fitting and the wye? as in:

wye + 1.5" pvc straight pipe + 45-degree fitting

also same question related to the long sweep 'turning' its side for the wye: can i turn it at an angle?

 

[wwhitney]

the original pipe is a wye with a 45-degree elbow. im' wondering if using a wye + a 45-degree elbow would be easiest rather than the long sweep?

What you are calling a long sweep is a combo or tee-wye. A long sweep would be an elbow with just two connections.

No advantage I see in your situation to the "2-piece" combo (wye plus 45) versus a combo.

if i go wye + 45-degree elbow route, does the 45 degree need to be a 'street' fitting or can i but a straight piece of pipe in between the 45-degree elbow fitting and the wye?

No need to use a street 45. No problem rotating the wye.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Dan]

What you are calling a long sweep is a combo or tee-wye. A long sweep would be an elbow with just two connections.

No advantage I see in your situation to the "2-piece" combo (wye plus 45) versus a combo.

No need to use a street 45. No problem rotating the wye.

got it. just got me some street 22.5-degree fittings. i'm hoping one 22.5-degree street + 90-degree 'combo' will do the job. i have a 2nd 22.5-degree street fitting in case.

i couldn't find whether it is up-to-code to join 2 street fittings together but given they are 22.5-degrees i can't imagine why it wouldn't be allowed.

 

[Reach4]

No advantage I see in your situation to the "2-piece" combo (wye plus 45) versus a combo.

Do you think a wye+60 could give the required jog?

 

[wwhitney]

Do you think a wye+60 could give the required jog?

I don't see how that would work in this case. If you rotated the horizontal wye 15 degrees, you'd need a 45 and a 15 to get back to plumb, but they wouldn't be in plane with each other, so it wouldn't be a 60. My instinct is you couldn't get back to plumb with a wye and a 60, but I haven't convinced myself that's true.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Reach4]

I don't see how that would work in this case. If you rotated the horizontal wye 15 degrees, you'd need a 45 and a 15 to get back to plumb, but they wouldn't be in plane with each other, so it wouldn't be a 60. My instinct is you couldn't get back to plumb with a wye and a 60, but I haven't convinced myself that's true.

You could get plumb with a wye and a 90. You could get plumb with a wye and a 45. So you are bound to be able to get plumb with a wye and a 60.

 

[wwhitney]

Yes, a mistake on my part. 60 degrees is what you need to get back to plumb if you roll the wye 45 degrees off vertical (also 45 degrees off horizontal). I think that would give the OP more jog than required.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Sylvan]

I loved the olden days

For "pitch" we used a Rigid 65 R 1" -2" and made a crooked thread

Great for steam condensate and drainage lines

With no hub the couplings allow misaligned lines to still function properly

 

[Jeff H Young]

No problem with the way it was? Replicate it . Sometimes you're in a jam I can't tell why it was plumbed that way but it's fine

 

[Dan]

No problem with the way it was? replicate it . sometimes your in a jam I cant tell why it was plumbed that way but its fine

Here is what I ended up doing. Using a 22.5-degree street elbow and rotating the 'combo' PVC. If I goofed this up too i'm selling the house.....

 

[Jeff H Young]

That's it !

 

[wwhitney]

What we can see in the pictures looks good.

A question I would have if whether it is worth replacing galvanized vents while the wall is open, or whether as vents they don't rust, so they work just as well as plastic.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Jeff H Young]

What we can see in the pictures looks good.

A question I would have if whether it is worth replacing galvanized vents while the wall is open, or whether as vents they don't rust, so they work just as well as plastic.

Cheers, Wayne

Good question Wayne. For the most part galvanized vents last forever !(actually a bit of a stretch). Its just a very slight peace of mind knowing they are new pipes but 70 , or 80 year old pipes can't really expect 50 more years out of them though they could very well last that long, I expect 50 years out of new vent piping but I also figure not all will make it that long .
I feel a slight edge on the new pipe even plastic but if I don't see obvious signs of question I don't push it.
I'd be interested as well if others agree or disagree. Talking vent only if its waste line, I'd get rid of it

 

[Dan]

What we can see in the pictures looks good.

A question I would have if whether it is worth replacing galvanized vents while the wall is open, or whether as vents they don't rust, so they work just as well as plastic.

Cheers, Wayne

Yea not sure if I should replace it.. I just am trying to to minimal work and anything connected to the main stack looks like its soldered in. That sounds like a massive headache. once its all clean looks like using a fernco donut makes life really easy. But getting there may be a pain in the ass.

Good question Wayne for the most part galvinized vents last forever !(actualy a bit of a stretch). Its just a very slight peace of mind knowing they are new pipes but 70 , or 80 year old pipes cant really expect 50 more years out of them though they could very well last that long, I expect 50 years out of new vent piping but I also figure not all will make that long .
I feel a slight edge on the new pipe even plastic but if I don't see obvious signs of question I don't push it.
Id be interested as well if others agree or disagree. talking vent only if its waste line, Id get rid of it

The house is 1940s so yea been a few decades (assuming the steel is original). i can't find any good videos of people chipping away at the insertion point of galvanized pipe into cast iron. cast iron is strong as heck so i don't imagine I could damage it. but if i mess up the main sewer stack, that's going to be a massive problem for me.

I'll have the wall open for a few more weekends so if people are saying the pipe is really past its time, I'll do it. I guess I can document the process on terrylove for others.

 

[Jeff H Young]

yea not sure if i should replace it.. i just am trying to to minimal work and anything connected to the main stack looks like its soldered in. that sounds like a massive headache. once its all clean looks like using a fernco donut makes live really easy. but getting there may be a pain in the ass.



the house is 1940s so yea been a few decades (assuming the steel is original). i can't find any good videos of people chipping away at the insertion point of galvanized pipe into cast iron. cast iron is strong as heck so I don't imagine i could damage it. but if i mess up the main sewer stack, that's going to be a massive problem for me.

i'll have the wall open for a few more weekends so if people are saying the pipe is really past its time, i'll do it. i guess i can document the process on terrylove for others.

I'm not really saying its bad . but 1940 was 70 years ago, and its not new and probably not as good as new. then again material isn't free and neither is time. mostly issue occurs at joints. by the time vents fail they usually are replaced house is knocked down or fully remodeled
Home owner choice its highly likely to have many years left of service. to me its kind of a sales point too, if you go to sell your house some one asks about plumbing and you tell them I changed the leaky ones 10 years ago it all looked good when I drywalled it, might not sound as good as a complete waste and vent repipe. or to at least be able to tell them everything in the walls is changed but some accessible ones in attic were left as is in good shape.