Convert switched outlet to half hot.

[James Henry 54]

I have switched outlet that I want to make half hot. Outlet is closest to switch with three other outlets beyond this outlet in the room. I realize that tab on hot side has to be broken, but how will existing wiring change? Note: hot side has two black wires connected on the two screws. scThanks

 

[wwhitney]

Currently both top and bottom are switched? And the 3 other receptacles beyond, are they switched as well?

What you want to do may not be possible without pulling new cables, as there may not be a constant hot in that box. If, however, there are downstream unswitched receptacles, and the way the circuit was wired was to run a single cable from switch to box to box, then the unswitched hot would be present.

So the question is, if you carefully peer into the back of the box (with the power off), how many cables do you see entering the box? And are those 2 conductor cables (white, black, and bare, where the bare is not counted in the nomenclature), or 3 conductor cables (also a red)?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Sponsor]

 

[James Henry 54]

Currently both top and bottom are switched? And the 3 other receptacles beyond, are they switched as well?

What you want to do may not be possible without pulling new cables, as there may not be a constant hot in that box. If, however, there are downstream unswitched receptacles, and the way the circuit was wired was to run a single cable from switch to box to box, then the unswitched hot would be present.

So the question is, if you carefully peer into the back of the box (with the power off), how many cables do you see entering the box? And are those 2 conductor cables (white, black, and bare, where the bare is not counted in the nomenclature), or 3 conductor cables (also a red)?

Cheers, Wayne

Thanks Wayne
Currently top and bottom switched. Other outlets are not. Cable coming into the box is one black, one white and cooper ground. No red wires. White wire coming out of cable is pigtail to another white which is hooked to the outlet. One black wire coming out of cable is going directly to the connection on the outlet. The other black is pigtailed and hooked to outlet.
NOTE: I replaced this outlet with another outlet I had . Tab removed and hooked up white and ground, and the two black on other side. The bottom was switched, top was constant. BUT tester was not a steady red and flickered. Didn't seem right so I removed and put back the original outlet.

 

[wwhitney]

If the box has only one cable entering it, and that cable is 2 conductors (black, white, bare), it's impossible to provide both constant power and switched power at that box without adding wires in the walls. And the physically downstream receptacles are not electrically downstream, the box you are working on is a little terminal side branch of your electrical wiring.

You could do something like removing the switch controlling the outlet (put in a blank plate), providing the formerly switched receptacle with constant power, and then using a wireless switch to control a plug in adapter to provide switched power. I think there are battery powered wireless switches that can mount in place of the a blank plate.

[I didn't follow what you meant by "The other black is pigtailed and hooked to outlet," but if there's only one 2 conductor cable at the box, the above is true regardless.]

Cheers, Wayne

 

[WorthFlorida]

From your descriptions it does seem the outlet was wired to be 1/2 switched (as usual), the other hot and it is pigtail to provide constant power to the other outlets. What is strange is the hot jumper tab should have been removed but it was not. When it's not, both halves of the outlet should be hot all the time.

Currently top and bottom switched. Other outlets are not. Cable coming into the box is one black, one white and cooper ground. No red wires. White wire coming out of cable is pigtail to another white which is hooked to the outlet. One black wire coming out of cable is going directly to the connection on the outlet. The other black is pigtailed and hooked to outlet.
NOTE: I replaced this outlet with another outlet I had . Tab removed and hooked up white and ground, and the two black on other side. The bottom was switched, top was constant. BUT tester was not a steady red and flickered. Didn't seem right so I removed and put back the original outlet.

"another white"? What this tells me that power was brought to the outlet first. The cable going to the switch is just two wires. The constant hot black would be tied to the white going to the switch (black tape wrapped around the white), the black wire returns the switched power to 1/2 the outlet. The pigtail you talk about is the constant hot, one wire going to the switch, another to the outlet(1/2), and the other going to the other outlets. I think there is just a little miswire. Below is the correct way, the orange wire nut would have four wires, the forth providing power to the other outlets and the white (neutral) would would be pigtailed for the other outlets or connected to the other screw on the outlet.

 

[John Gayewski]

The power for this outlet comes from the switch. To make it constant power you have to bypass the switch. Which means hook the wires together at the switch. White to white, black to black, ground to ground. Then you can remove the tab and have whichever side you wired to, be hot, and the broken tab portion not hot.

That would give you a constant half hot outlet. Then as stated put a solid cover over the switch.

I'm not sure removing tabs from a factory outlet is legal or a very good idea though. Why not just get a single outlet?

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Eaton-White-20-Amp-Round-Tamper-Resistant-Outlet-Residential-Commercial-Outlet/1001462434?cm_mmc=shp-_-c-_-prd-_-elc-_-ggl-_-LIA_ELC_205_Wiring-Devices-Extension-Cords-_-1001462434-_-local-_-0-_-0&ds_rl=1286981&gclid=CjwKCAiAlrSPBhBaEiwAuLSDUM2IfKmDH0t0_nWbMd7dso579h1DuxX-L4jFc3pGY3utSOMxnVdIqxoCSqYQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

[wwhitney]

I'm not sure removing tabs from a factory outlet is legal or a very good idea though.

The tabs connecting the top and bottom of a duplex are there precisely for applications like a half switched duplex. So it's fine to remove them.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[James Henry 54]

If the box has only one cable entering it, and that cable is 2 conductors (black, white, bare), it's impossible to provide both constant power and switched power at that box without adding wires in the walls. And the physically downstream receptacles are not electrically downstream, the box you are working on is a little terminal side branch of your electrical wiring.

You could do something like removing the switch controlling the outlet (put in a blank plate), providing the formerly switched receptacle with constant power, and then using a wireless switch to control a plug in adapter to provide switched power. I think there are battery powered wireless switches that can mount in place of the a blank plate.

[I didn't follow what you meant by "The other black is pigtailed and hooked to outlet," but if there's only one 2 conductor cable at the box, the above is true regardless.]

Cheers, Wayne

Hi Wayne
What I meant is one black wire is coming from cable and connected directly to outlet and a second black wire is pigtailed and connected to 2nd screw on outlet.
Jim

 

[James Henry 54]

From your descriptions it does seem the outlet was wired to be 1/2 switched (as usual), the other hot and it is pigtail to provide constant power to the other outlets. What

From your descriptions it does seem the outlet was wired to be 1/2 switched (as usual), the other hot and it is pigtail to provide constant power to the other outlets. What is strange is the hot jumper tab should have been removed but it was not. When it's not, both halves of the outlet should be hot all the time.

"another white"? What this tells me that power was brought to the outlet first. The cable going to the switch is just two wires. The constant hot black would be tied to the white going to the switch (black tape wrapped around the white), the black wire returns the switched power to 1/2 the outlet. The pigtail you talk about is the constant hot, one wire going to the switch, another to the outlet(1/2), and the other going to the other outlets. I think there is just a little miswire. Below is the correct way, the orange wire nut would have four wires, the forth providing power to the other outlets and the white (neutral) would would be pigtailed for the other outlets or connected to the other screw on the outlet.

View attachment 80300

is strange is the hot jumper tab should have been removed but it was not. When it's not, both halves of the outlet should be hot all the time.

"another white"? What this tells me that power was brought to the outlet first. The cable going to the switch is just two wires. The constant hot black would be tied to the white going to the switch (black tape wrapped around the white), the black wire returns the switched power to 1/2 the outlet. The pigtail you talk about is the constant hot, one wire going to the switch, another to the outlet(1/2), and the other going to the other outlets. I think there is just a little miswire. Below is the correct way, the orange wire nut would have four wires, the forth providing power to the other outlets and the white (neutral) would would be pigtailed for the other outlets or connected to the other screw on the outlet.

View attachment 80300

 

[James Henry 54]

Do I simply break the tap on the hot (right) to make it work as half hot?

 

[wwhitney]

You need to answer the question, is there just 1 cable going to your box? If so, then see my above answers.

Or are there 2 cables going to the box, as WorthFlorida inferred? If so, please better describe the connections--cable 1 white, cable 2 white, cable 1 black, cable 2 black, etc.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[WorthFlorida]

Do I simply break the tap on the hot (right) to make it work as half hot?

Yes, if the wiring is correct but in your first post it implies that both outlets are switched but if the tab is still attached it cannot be since one of the black wires is constantly hot. Please take a picture of inside the outlet box, the gold cooler black wired connections and the wall switch wiring.

To be really sure use a light/lamp and turn on the lamp switch. You might have been getting a false alert using a touchless voltage tester. With the wall switch off, plug the lamp into each plug of the duplex and the outlets further down. I'm sure the lamp will light with from all of them. If you are absolutely sure the the wiring is the same as the diagram I attached, turn off the circuit breaker, break the tab off the outlet and turn the breaker back on. With the wall switch off, the lamp will not work with in one outlet and will work in the other. The flip on the wall switch and plug in the lamp in th switched outlet. It will work. It's not uncommon that someone, when replacing an outlet, did not know that the tab must be broken off. I have a few times, just recently in my home, bypassed the wall switch so I have both outlets always hot. At the wall I'll connect both wires removed from the switch or at the outlet, cap off the switched wire and replace the outlet with a new one with the tab intact. I have ceiling fans with a switched light so as you walk into the bedroom, flipping the wall switch will turn on the fan light instead of a table lamp.

 

[James Henry 54]

Yes, if the wiring is correct but in your first post it implies that both outlets are switched but if the tab is still attached it cannot be since one of the black wires is constantly hot. Please take a picture of inside the outlet box, the gold cooler black wired connections and the wall switch wiring.

To be really sure use a light/lamp and turn on the lamp switch. You might have been getting a false alert using a touchless voltage tester. With the wall switch off, plug the lamp into each plug of the duplex and the outlets further down. I'm sure the lamp will light with from all of them. If you are absolutely sure the the wiring is the same as the diagram I attached, turn off the circuit breaker, break the tab off the outlet and turn the breaker back on. With the wall switch off, the lamp will not work with in one outlet and will work in the other. The flip on the wall switch and plug in the lamp in th switched outlet. It will work. It's not uncommon that someone, when replacing an outlet, did not know that the tab must be broken off. I have a few times, just recently in my home, bypassed the wall switch so I have both outlets always hot. At the wall I'll connect both wires removed from the switch or at the outlet, cap off the switched wire and replace the outlet with a new one with the tab intact. I have ceiling fans with a switched light so as you walk into the bedroom, flipping the wall switch will turn on the fan light instead of a table lamp.

I want to apologize to all for any confusion. I think I have been using the wrong terms describing my issue. Let me start over...
I want the switch on the wall to turn on/off a plug-in lamp on the outlet I have been describing. Currently this outlet, and all others in the room are all live. (Both plugs on the outlets on all are live. )The wall switch does not work with the outlet I want to be half hot, and doesn't work on any of the other outlets. I believe I have been using the term "switched" incorrectly. With that being said, to make this outlet half hot do I just need to remove the tab. Again sorry, and thanks for your patience.

Jim

 

[wwhitney]

Very likely yes.

I take it that WorthFlorida's inference is correct, and there are in fact (2) different cables entering the box, each with a black and a white? [A cable is 1 or more wires inside a common sheath.] One cable has the white go to the left side of the receptacle, and the black go to a wirenut. That wirenut has the other cable's white and a jumper to one of the receptacle's right side screws. And the other cable's black goes to the other screw on the receptacle right side?

If that's correct, it matches WorthFlorida's diagram, and assuming anything reasonable about what is happening at the other ends of the two cables, breaking the right side tab will get you what you want.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[WorthFlorida]

Thanks Wayne. James, shut the power off and then break the tab off. Reset the breaker and I think it will work as you want. Either the tab was never broken off or the outlet was replaced many years ago.

 

[Reach4]

I only see one cable.

Note: hot side has two black wires connected on the two screws.

I expect that the switched hot is being daisy-chained to the next switched outlet.

If I were to run another cable in thru the basement or attic, I would consider going to a 4 inch box with 3 unswitched outlets.

 

[wwhitney]

I only see one cable.

The angle is not great, but the picture is consistent with there being another cable entering from above, but block by the wirenut. With only one cable, there'd be no reason for there to be a wirenut, and there wouldn't be so many different wire segments visible.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Reach4]

The angle is not great, but the picture is consistent with there being another cable entering from above, but block by the wirenut. With only one cable, there'd be no reason for there to be a wirenut, and there wouldn't be so many different wire segments visible.

Cheers, Wayne

Wire nut could be for neutral. So why would somebody daisy chain hot by using two screws but continue the neutral with a wirenut?

Maybe one of the whites was too short, or the person wanted to avoid having 4 wires fighting putting the outlet back into the box?

 

[wwhitney]

Wire nut could be for neutral. So why would somebody daisy chain hot by using two screws but continue the neutral with a wirenut?

With only 1 cable, there's no daisy chaining or anything.

WorthFlorida's hypothesis explains everything we seen so far, given the updated info on the current behavior. I vote for that.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Jadnashua]

Just to clarify...does the switch actually turn the desired receptacle off and on now? Does it do it to both of the outlets in the receptacle?

If so, you do not have power there all of the time, and breaking the tab is only half of the problem as you'd need to get power to the other half. That may be easiest by pulling a new wire from one of the always on, nearby receptacles. Note, verify that they're either all on the same circuit, or if they're separate, as that will determine what you need to do with the neutral wire. You WILL need to break the tab on the other side if you find they're on different breakers, otherwise, you can leave it intact..

FWIW, the wires should wrap around the screw clockwise, or, if the receptacle has a rear inlet connection, you can push it in the back. I prefer rear connections that use a screw clamp versus a spring/friction fit. A metal box should have the ground bonded to the box before connecting to the receptacle unless the receptacle is rated for self-grounding.