Can't find this basic cap/plate from NDS?

[Jack Miller]

Hello,

This may be a dumb question, but I've looked high and low online and am not able to find a simple cap (maybe it's called a plate) that was in place on one of my basement drains, but not the other. The drain is closed shut about a foot down or so, but open from there up to the basement floor. Now that the kids are using the basement more I don't want one of them twisting an ankle. I thought it'd be easy enough to find a replacement cap, but no luck at the local big box stores either.

Anyone know where I can find one of these??

Thanks!

 

[Plumbs]

https://www.ebay.com/p/1010018597?i...d2bCAhIAx1tLmKgT40Ry8JXq1LfWfysAaAqODEALw_wcB

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Plumbs]

Actually this one might work if it goes on the inside. Do you have a picture of the drain you said is sealed below? Sounds like it may be a backwater valve. Do you know what the diameter is? Looks like it's 4" from your pictures.
https://www.supply.com/browse?refin...t8zbFpYZ7GOcZWfhpN8hwjku-pf_0VlQaAlHBEALw_wcB

 

[Jack Miller]

Thanks for the reply. I just measured and it's actually 6". The eBay link you found seems to be the same item but in 4". Unfortunately I'm not seeing it in 6" but will keep searching.

Here's a picture of the drain. It's not a foot down like I originally said. More like 4-5" down. I'm just looking for something to keep it flush with the floor. The cap on the other drain snaps into this and holds in place.



Wonder if a 6" knockout test cap from your other link might achieve the same result?

Thanks!

 

[Jadziedzic]

Maybe contact NDS and ask them if they have any current product that matches? https://connect.ndspro.com/contactus

 

[Plumbs]

That is a backwater valve that is buried. The 6" cap should work on it.

 

[Mliu]

What is the actual inside diameter of the pipe in the floor?

 

[Reach4]

I am not sure what you have there. Vertical sides, or some other shape?

Anyway, suppose you lined the hole with some plastic sheet pushed into the hole. Then fill that hole with concrete or mortar. Trowel it flat. To later lift that out, drill a hole for an anchor to use as a lift handle, or maybe set an anchor with female threads flush while placing the concrete.

Another idea is to use a well seal. Usually they have holes, but nobody could step into those holes Here is a special blank version: http://www.simmonsmfg.com/index.php/our-products/well-seals/well-seal-steel-blank/

The mortar/concrete would be the cheapest, available, and guaranteed to fit.

 

[Mliu]

Anyway, suppose you lined the hole with some plastic sheet pushed into the hole. Then fill that hole with concrete or mortar. Trowel it flat. To later lift that out, drill a hole for an anchor to use as a lift handle, or maybe set an anchor with female threads flush while placing the concrete.

The mortar/concrete would be the cheapest, available, and guaranteed to fit.

Sorry, but this is a bad idea. What if the concrete plug gets stuck? Then you're screwed. The backwater valve needs access for maintenance and service. Realize that concrete gets hot as it cures so it's possible it can distort the riser pipe, which may prevent you from pulling it out. And if it's loose, then you have the weight of that big slug of concrete sitting on the PVC cap of your backwater valve.

A well cap will not sit flush with the floor, so it would present a tripping hazard. And I doubt anyone wants to step on those hex head bolts with bare feet, especially the OP's young kids.

 

[Mliu]

Wonder if a 6" knockout test cap from your other link might achieve the same result?

The problem with a knockout test cap is that they're designed to be knocked-out. In other words, they are thin and designed to break easily. I think that might be actually worse than leaving it open as it could lead to a false sense of security: a kid would be more likely to step on the cap.

 

[Reach4]

Sorry, but this is a bad idea. What if the concrete plug gets stuck? Then you're screwed.

Yes, but if the hole is lined with plastic sheet before pouring, and the sides are straight or belled outward, that should not be a problem. If that is a concern, there are concrete release agents that are used when pouring concrete into a form. While hydraulic cement expands as it cures, regular concrete, I think, does not. https://www.concreteconstruction.net/how-to/does-concrete-expand_o says

When it first dries, concrete shrinks and undergoes structural alterations that make some of the shrinkage irreversible. Thus, even if it is later resaturated, the initial drying shrinkage isn't fully recovered.​

Realize that concrete gets hot as it cures so it's possible it can distort the riser pipe, which may prevent you from pulling it out.

I don't think this small volume of concrete will have enough temperature rise to distort plastic.

 

[Mliu]

This might work:

6" Round Standard Series ICV Cover

Top diameter: 6-1/2"
Bottom diameter: 5-3/4"
Rim thickness: 3/16"

They come in 3 colors: sand (pictured), green, or purple. I figured the sand color would look best with your brown floor.

 

[Mliu]

Yes, but if the hole is lined with plastic sheet before poring, and the sides are straight or belled outward, that should not be a problem.

How do you know the walls are straight or belled outward? They're probably straight. But if belled inward or otherwise out-of-round by even the smallest amount means you may not be able to pull it out.

I don't think this small volume of concrete will have enough temperature rise to distort plastic.

I agree. But why gamble? There are better solutions, even makeshift ones.

 

[Plumbs]

Here's another idea if you can't find the correct cover or if the pipe is no longer round at the top and a cover won't work- Cut some of the flooring around the pipe so it's square then use one of these cast iron covers. You can even paint it to match your floor if you'd like. It's only a 1/2" thick so it should be close to level with your floor.
Obviously, getting a cap like the other would be the first choice. You just want to make sure the bwv is accessible. You should probably open it up to make sure everything is fine in there just to be safe.

https://www.hardtofinditems.com/12-cast-iron-bar-strainer-square/

 

[Tuttles Revenge]

That is a backwater valve.. The inside diameter of the riser CAN NOT be diminished if you ever want to remove the cover and the flapper underneath.

The replacement part is probably listed on the below pages.

https://www.ndspro.com/PDFs/Tech-Spec-Sheets/Gravity-Backwater-Valve.pdf

or similarly
http://www.canplas.com/plumbing/wp-content/uploads/documents/BWV-Brochure-CAN-ENG.pdf

PS. That is not a basic part.. As evidenced by the wide array of opinion and advice. They're also not standard by manufacture.. as I've come to find out trying to find caps similar at the end of a project. We've resorted to very expensive brass covers and very elaborate wooden covers made to match flooring.

 

[Themp]

If it was me, I would try and replace both covers with wood. Would look nicer in the end. I wish the flooring was cut better around the hole. So, you could make the flooring hole square and then try and find matching flooring to use. A 2x2 could be used to support the flooring over the hole. I assume the concrete edge of the hole would provide the most support and the 2x2 would keep it from flexing. Or just make a wooden plug:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Klein-Tools-6-3-8-in-Bi-Metal-Hole-Saw-31900/206432477

The above hole saw is pretty expensive, if you Google 6 3/8 inch hole saw, you can find one in the 20 dollar range. Then used a Dremel to make the lip. Or a router to make the lip. Stain to match.