Bad Install? Video included

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Christina C

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I posted on another thread but have additional questions and I've included a video link. We paid a plumber to install a shower pan, they said they would only guarantee the product if they purchased it so we paid the increased price that they upcharged and had them install a Florestone 3636F. Initially the pan wasn't installed level, I could see it and took photos and sent it to them. When the guy overseeing the job came out I mentioned that the pan sounded hollow and felt flimsy. He said once his installer came back out and leveled it into place it should feel more stable.

We stayed out of the shower, let them complete their work and went forward with wall installation. After the walls were installed and my husband stepped in he noticed that the pan still felt flimsy. I understand it's acrylic and might have some flexing, but this feels excessive. We had another plumber come out to check and he said it also felt flimsy but maybe it was the pan and without tearing it out, he couldn't tell.

I called the manufacturer and they were surprised to hear that it's flexing and has referred me to a sales manager who has more infield experience. Does the flexing on this video seem excessive? It makes like stress/cracking type sounds under my weight, I weigh 145lbs. Any advice is appreciated.


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Jeff H Young

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many tubs come with a foam support underneath I think some pans might but without throwing plumber under the bus its either wasn't installed properly or it was poor product missing or damaged underneath . If you want to post all detailed specs on the pan or info where we can view it sure I'll look. It looks so flimsy Id have trouble recommending the job didn't stop immediately
 

Jeff H Young

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ok I had a look of course their installation isn't that detailed it mandates set with mortar underneath my guess at this point leads to suspect the plumber didn't set properly or your sub floor is super funky. its all there just google the pan
 
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Christina C

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Thank you for the feedback. The subfloor is concrete and was completely clean when they started, although I'm sure not perfectly level, hence the need for mortar bed. I have reached out to the manufacturer, Florestone, and they also said that it appears to be an excessive amount of flexing and that their pans do not usually have that issue when installed with the required mortar base.

The plumber came out yesterday to cut the too tall drain pipe and said that would fix it, but we asked them to stop work and do nothing until the supervisor on our job could be present as well.

I am worried that the installer is going to try to make us eat the price to pull down and reinstall the walls, but we paid them for the job and even expressed a concern prior to the walls going up. He assured us that when the pan was installed level, it would feel flimsy like that. The company came highly recommended and we paid a lot, including having our entire house replumbed, but the guy he sent out for this part of the job just feels like he's sloppy/rushed/lazy/untrained?
 

Christina C

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oatey drain looks wrong too gasket goes on bottom check that out confirm but looks real funky totaly wrong
Thank you for noticing that, I know at least enough about plumbing to find a video on youtube showing the installation of this gasket. It does appear incorrect. I wish I'd just done it myself! :confused:
 

John Gayewski

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We are installing about 60 showers and tubs at the moment. We noticed a lot of flex on the ADA versions of the same brand tub/showers that are elsewhere in the particular apartment building. We opted to put a bed of plaster under these pans. The rest are reinforced with balsa wood and have no flex. The tubs also had no flex, but we still used piles of plaster under those.

I would call your install incorrect and it definitely needs redone. That drain will start leaking in no time.
 

Jeff H Young

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I'll let you sort through the details but the pan can't have voids under there . I suppose if its a really crappy pan and you don't set it in place dry and walk around in it and see how bad it is that someone could set it in mud and then not know that the mud slumped or wasn't enough and find out how flexy it is later
 

Jeff H Young

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Christina, one of the people involved may try opening hole in wall on other side and attempting to pack mortar, expanding foam or another product. creating need for drywall patch but not requiring damage to shower walls. but we really don't like to be in this predicament.
 

Christina C

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The owner of the plumbing company came out today and took full responsibility. The pan has to come out so they are contacting the wall installer, tearing out the entire job at their expense, resetting the pan and redoing the drain connection. He said the plumber who installed it has lots of years experience so he's not sure why he did that unless he let his apprentice do it, but even then he said the plumber should have noticed it. Lord willing we will have a second shower soon, 5 people with one shower isn't super fun.
 

Terry

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It may be that there wasn't any mortar mix on the truck. It's not something that the plumbing suppliers have on hand. If they send the plumber out again, the mortar mix, mixing bucket, spade to work with the mortar.
I can see him arriving on the job, missing those things, and hoping for the best.

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1907 home, the floor was out of level by about 3"
I used mortar to support the pan, the floor was really wonky. I let the pan firm up overnight, as I was there doing other things anyway.

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Some plywood shimming and mortar mix to install with. It was rock solid when finished.
 
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Breplum

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Not reading the other contributions, line by line, I wanted to comment that the black rubber gasket NEVER goes on the upper part of the pan, it goes underneath.
And we NEVER use the crappy plastic (sorry Oatey) shower drains. The solid brass shower drain (also made by Oatey) are far superior. The problem with the plastic drains is the plastic nut, used the secure from below, often pops loose.
 

Jeff H Young

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Not reading the other contributions, line by line, I wanted to comment that the black rubber gasket NEVER goes on the upper part of the pan, it goes underneath.
And we NEVER use the crappy plastic (sorry Oatey) shower drains. The solid brass shower drain (also made by Oatey) are far superior. The problem with the plastic drains is the plastic nut, used the secure from below, often pops loose.
I have seen lav drain ass that take a washer on top but a shower drain ? give me a brake.
I can say I'm glad they are fixing it Christina, I do feel bad for Contractor and his employee to me its a no brainer but hate to rag on them too much
 

Christina C

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I have seen lav drain ass that take a washer on top but a shower drain ? give me a brake.
I can say Im glad they are fixing it Christina, I do feel bad for Contractor and his employee to me its a no brainer but hate to rag on them too much
Yes, our house was fixer upper when we bought it so we've had our share of projects; DIY and professional, and we know stuff happens. I wasn't mad at the company and the owner has been very helpful so far.

My biggest gripe would be that I addressed those concerns before the walls went up and the installer kind of treated me like I was a stupid housewife and tried talking me out of any concerns.
 

Tuttles Revenge

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My biggest gripe would be that I addressed those concerns before the walls went up and the installer kind of treated me like I was a stupid housewife and tried talking me out of any concerns.
Unfortunately some people have an attitude towards being told what to do / stepping on their toes. The unfortunate result is that they installed the pan incorrectly without support and installed the plastic drain with the gasket in the wrong location. I'll second that the plastic drain is less than ideal. I can't remember the last time I used a plastic shower drain. Our go to shower drain is the Sioux Chief Jackrabbit. All brass construction and tightens to the bottom with 4 set screws rather than the 4" nut
 

Jeff H Young

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Looks common to me. like what would go in a KB home or low cost build in our neck of woods. Oatey is a respected brand name .
Its not fancy or top notch best you can buy perhaps upgrade when they tear it out if you want Christina
 

Christina C

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I don't mind grabbing a better drain kit than the plastic oatey and having them install it. I tend to prefer metal parts, but what would you recommend?
 

Christina C

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UPDATE:
The pan was reinstalled and we could tell there is more mortar underneath but it seemed fine. Our wall installer came out today and said he will not be installing the walls because there is still flex in the pan. He also pointed out the hollow areas of the pan, heard with my heel on the floor. He called the plumber and let him know and we are just frustrated. I've attached a video of the wall installer flexing the pan.

I appreciated his honesty and he said that the pan may not leak into the walls, but we will be constantly dealing with mold at that bottom edge between the wall and the pan because the flexing will cause the silicone caulk to split and allow water to sit. The plumber said once the walls are installed it will be fine but we've already had to have the walls torn out once.

The plumber is reaching out to the manufacturer to see about a warranty, and if this is a crappy pan we are fine paying for a better one. If I could get whatever I want it would be a cast iron pan but I can't find one in our size 36 x 36. What do you think of the video, I think the plumber thinks we are being particular but the wall installer has said it needs to be done right. Any advice?


 
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