7000 SXT Low Brine Fill / Slow Brine Draw

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JRC3

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I debated posting in this thread because it's a year old, but basically the same problem and I worked through the same steps. https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/fleck-7000-sxt-brine-fill-fails.80581/

I also used two Pentair Youtube teardown vids.

Details:
1 cuft /32K
BLFC: .250
DLFC: 2.0
Injector: Violet
Capacity set at 24K
BW: 10
BD: 60
2nd BW: 5
RR: 10
BF: 12 (Usually 8)
Well water 28 grains softener set at 30.
1 cuft Pryolox Filter before softener.
Everything installed 9/2016
Well pressure 45-65
No pressure or flow changes at any tap. Pressure gauge after softener never goes below 40psi.
Well delivers 12+ gpm and utility sink right next to the softener delivers 8.5 gpm

I've been running out of soft water for the past month or two and kept forcing regins with it showing at least 1/3 capacity remaining.

I pulled and checked the screen and injector, thoroughly cleaning both. I even tried replacing the yellow part off a white injector I had. Pulled resin tank valve and air stop thinking something was clogged, soaked air gap in vinegar, all working properly but still no fix. Also checked/cleaned and eventually just removed the BLFC. Ran line strait to bucked and only got 5 quarts during a 12min brine fill. Pulled backing plate and brine valve and it was perfect and spotless, greased and reinstalled (inner O-ring is in place). While at it I decided to pull the piston, seals and spacers. All good, greased and repacked. Reassembled everything and checked brine flow again with BLFC still removed. Got almost 6 quarts during the 12min BF, did this again with same results. Also it used to air stop around 15 min during the 60min BD, Checked 2x and it is now taking 30min. The two have to be related.

There is a rust coating in the injector/screen area and two of the piston spacers, but it just a coating and nothing excessive. Like I said, the screen and injector were thoroughly cleaned.

Just curious, how much water should come from the brine fill with the BLFC removed? I would think it would be quite a bit.

As I was typing this I let it regin for a 3rd time to check BD and BF times. BLFC is in place. BD is still 30min and BF still set at 12mins. After it was all done I had to manually add 5 qts of water to get it to my usual water lever mark. This mark is where it usually is at with 8min BF, should be 2.5 gallons. I never add more than 2 bags at a time so I can brush the pellets back and see the mark.

Thanks again. *thumbs up*
 
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Bannerman

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The injector has 2 pieces. When you pulled the injector, did you also use a screwdriver to unthread the 2nd injector piece from the injector throat? While removed for cleaning, also clean the throat itself.

As a 1 gpm BLFC may be utilized which will limit the flow rate to 1 gpm max, that suggests the flow rate will exceed 1 gpm if there is no restrictor installed.
 
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JRC3

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The injector has 2 pieces. When you pulled the injector, did you also use a screwdriver to unthread the 2nd injector piece from the injector throat? While removed for cleaning, also clean the throat itself.

As a 1 gpm BLFC may be utilized which will limit the flow rate to 1 gpm max, that suggests the flow rate will exceed 1 gpm if there is no restrictor installed.
Yes, I actually separated all 3 pieces of the injector. I also cut a bristle from a dish brush and cleaned the injector orifice. I might try installing my extra white injector to see what happens. Wish I'd though of that when testing everything.

With the BLFC removed I'm only getting about .125 gpm. Same as with the .250 in place, obviously.

Does the injector dictate or control brine line refill rate? I'm sure it dictates brine flow into the resin, right?...Both are slow in my softener right now. Maybe I just need to try the white injector today.
 

JRC3

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https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/fleck-7000-sxt-brine-fill-fails.80581/

Perhaps the brine cam is not sufficiently opening the brine valve.

Can you manually push the rod during a brine fill to see if the flow rate picks up?
Cam is perfect. And yes I did manually push the valve with a screwdriver as it was BFing. The tone of the water passing through changed a bit, but no noticeable change in flow. I am 100% sure the valve is in perfect shape. I took it apart and checked that the rubber seal wasn't moving causing a blockage. I also cleaned as precaution (though it was spotless) and greased everything double checking the inner O-ring inside the filter head was in place. In my brain the valve was the main suspect, so I completely check it out.

BTW, it is proper silicone plumbing grease, and nothing excessive, just a a few dabs and then smearing as a thin coat on everything I mentioned greasing above.
 

Bannerman

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The BLFC button is utilized to control the brine tank refill rate. To work properly, the raised lettering needs to be installed facing the control valve. Since you are testing the brine refill rate with the brine line connected, ensure the line and both fittings do not contain anything which are restricting flow.

As the refill flow will also pass through the injector, I asked about cleaning in inner injector and the valve's injector throat/socket. An ear swab would probably be most effective for cleaning the inside of the socket.

Try installing the other injector you have available. If the flow rate improves, that will suggest a defect with the original injector.
 

Reach4

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I wonder if the brine line, the float valve, or the air check could be restricting things.

In the valve, how about running a pipe cleaner through the passages marked in green.
525px-Pipe_cleaner_white.jpg
 

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JRC3

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I wonder if the brine line, the float valve, or the air check could be restricting things.
I checked all of those and then completely took them out of the loop and went directly to a bucket.

OK, installed the white injector and am getting proper brine fill. Then I reinspected the violet injector with a magnifier and it looks perfect except for a little rust discoloration. There are two orifices, one in each of the colored non-yellow parts and those orifices are relatively the same size, but in my violet injector one of the orifice looked a lot smaller. So I got my small drill index out and scraped the sides of the smaller one with a drill bit. Seems it had build up. I had only used the brush bristle to pass through to clear possible a particle or debris. Maybe next time I'll try soaking it in vinegar for a few days.

Anyways now the violet injector works correctly. I didn't check the brine draw but I bet it's good too. I'll check on the next regen.

Still gonna order a new injector just in case the orifice isn't smooth enough causing it to build up.


Thanks again.
 

Bannerman

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Since the resin 's capacity had been 100% exhausted, it will now need to be regenerated fully to restore all 48K capacity. Although a 1X regeneration using 20 lbs salt is the usual proceedure, the current 12 minute BF setting will result in 9 lbs salt being dissolved each cycle, so if you perform 2 manual regenerations back-to-back, that should restore sufficient capacity to ensure there will not be excessive hardness leakage directly preceeding each regeneration cycle.

After the first manual regeneration has completed and water has re-entered the brine tank, wait 1-1.5 hours before initiating the 2nd manual regeneration cycle to allow sufficient time for salt to be dissolved for the 2nd cycle. The 2nd cycle could be initiated before going to bed.

Eight lbs salt is the correct quantity of salt needed to regenerate 24K capacity in 1 ft3 of resin. With a 0.25 BLFC restrictor, the BF setting will need to be 10.67 minutes (11 minutes rounded), not 8 minutes. To reset 8 lbs for ongoing regeneration cycles, reprogram before initiating the 2nd manual regeneration cycle so 8 lbs brine will be prepared for ongoing automatic regeneration cycles to follow.
 
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JRC3

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It got regenerated yesterday afternoon and the night before while I was testing the fill and draw, I also did it to restore the capacity. And After contemplating and looking at old notes, I must've got confused on thinking I normally did 8 min BF. My target was 8 lbs, and normally did that with a 12 minute BF...I just rounded up to 12 to be sure, even though a little more wasteful. I always meant to start taking off a minute or two to see when I started running out of soft water but never did.

The next regen I will set to 11 and measure with a bucket to double check the BF volume.

The 2 bags of pellets added last week were Morton Rust Remover. I was worried some of the iron getting by the iron filter was lowering my softener capacity and causing the problem. Might start using Iron Out with regular pellets to keep the injector from clogging again.

This place as helpful as usual. Thanks.
 
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