Question about replacing Resin

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s10010001

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I have a what I think its a nicer water softener. I don't know the age but everything works correctly. However it doesn't seem to be softening as well as it used to at all, its soft right after it regens, but it only lasts like 100gallons. I was talking to some folks and since I don't know the age I might want to replace the resin. It also used to be getting straight well water before i moved in, I have since installed good filters before it and such. So it might be nasty in there.

unit is 12x52"


questions.
1. anyone have a recommended resin brand/source?

2. Can I put in less resin since were a lower use household? Its just me and my wife home now. Were pretty thrifty with water overall. I don't have an actual number however.

3. I watched a video or two already, doesn't seem like there is much to it. Open it up, clean it out, put the shaft back in, refill. Any other tips?


Pic is the only label on the unit at all.
 

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s10010001

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two more pics of the entire setup. The little stickers on it are just numbers (serial numbers I guess) that don't seem to duckduckgo out to anything.
 

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Reach4

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It also used to be getting straight well water before i moved in, I have since installed good filters before it and such.
Still well water though.

Resin cleaning may be good. I am guessing this thing is dealing with iron, right? How much? You really should get a lab test for iron, Mn, hardness and more in the raw water. There are some techniques and chemicals to discuss if you are up to it.

IO10N.jpg


Can I put in less resin since were a lower use household? Its just me and my wife home now. Were pretty thrifty with water overall. I don't have an actual number however.
Hardness and iron and Mn will have a bearing on what to expect. But a 12 inch tank will take the same amount of backwash regardless of how much resin is in there.
 

Bannerman

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A 12X52 tank will normally contain 2 cubic feet of cation water softener resin + 20 lbs 1/8" X 1/16" bedding gravel.

Your control valve appears to be a Clack WS-1 5-button version. An Operation and Instruction manual may be downloaded here: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...4QFnoECAYQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2-GVRV60PRUwydA1lqFrbx

Post a lab report for your raw well water as the water conditions should be reviewed to determine not only hardness to be removed but also other conditions that maybe consuming the resin's hardness removal capacity.

You have indicated the cartridge filters are plumbed before the softener. The amount of flow restriction caused by the filters may be reducing the flow rate to the softener during regeneration.
 
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s10010001

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So age isn't really a factor? I figured with an unknown age of the resin I might as well just start by cleaning the softer tan out and putting in new resin and going from there. Before paying for a well report and tests and stuff. Just seemed easier. It was working fine a while back but sems like its slowly been getting worse.
 

Reach4

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Do you flush your pressure tank? You should . Annually is good although many of us slide longer.
Annually is good for most wells, but wells with much sediment, adjust the period based on what you see.
To flush the sediment,
1. Turn off the power to the pump. Attach a hose to run water to a good place. Run the pressure tank empty using the drain valve near the input of the pressure tank. Usually you want to use a hose to direct water and sediment to a good place. Note colors and solids coming out toward the end of the flow.
2. Close the drain valve, Turn the power to the pump back on for maybe 6 seconds. Turn the power back off. Again drain the water and sediment.
3. Repeat #2 until no sediment comes out.
4. Check/adjust the air precharge with the water pressure zero. Usually you want 2 psi below the actual pressure switch cut-on pressure for a submersible pump, and 5 psi for a jet pump (or whatever it takes to avoid a pressure stutter when the pump turns on).
5. Close the drain valve, and turn the power to pump back on.

The reason I bring this up on this thread is if you get a lot of orange, that would be iron. If a softener is dealing with significant iron, then the resin needs cleaning periodically. So typically you can rejuvenate the old resin softening well water by cleaning out the iron.
 

Reach4

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So age isn't really a factor? I figured with an unknown age of the resin I might as well just start by cleaning the softer tan out and putting in new resin and going from there. Before paying for a well report and tests and stuff. Just seemed easier. It was working fine a while back but sems like its slowly been getting worse.
So iron.... I would get a 9 lb container of Iron Out. If you do that, I can post or point to a suggested method.

There is also commercial resin cleaner. That can do nicely too. Iron Out crystals go a long way. Not the greatest smell.

There are also resin treatments that treat the resin on each regen. There are dispensers that use a wick to meter the solution into the brine tank. But I expect you will need some remedial treatment. Res-UP and Res Care feeders use a wick to meter an acid solution into the brine tank. Their acid is mostly phosphoric.

You can also add citric acid or Iron Out to your salt. Citric acid smells better.
You might call the phone number that is in https://www.twdb.texas.gov/groundwater/data/doc/Well_Water_Testing.pdf
 
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Bannerman

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Resin will often continue to be used beyond 20 years but an oxidant such as chlorine will degrade any resin more quickly

Well water often contains iron and/or manganese which will accumulate on the surface of resin if the resin is not cleaned on a regular basis. Resin that is iron fouled will have reduced hardness removal capacity as the iron interferes with the ion exchange process utilized to remove hardness ions.

Whether it it possible to restore resin that is iron fouled will be conditional on various factors including the quantity of iron in the water, water pH, the salt setting and Capacity the softener is programmed to use, when the resin was last cleaned, whether salt with an iron removal additive has been used. ...

The most appropriate starting point is to review the condition of the water. If a lab test has not been obtained, National Labs Standard WaterCheck Well package is recommended. http://watercheck.myshopify.com/?aff=5
 

s10010001

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I don't have a large pressure tank, only a small one on my CST. Its pretty new. I'm not getting any orange iron stains or anything, just harder water than I used to get.

I also liked the idea of new resin so I know its condition as a starting point. Forgive me if I want to skip the tests and just refresh the softener with new resin, IDK seems solid but yall think thats a waste? I did have a good amount of bleach running through the softener by mistake a while back too.
 

Reach4

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IDK seems solid but yall think thats a waste?
Kinda, yes. When resin cleaning with Iron Out or resin cleaner is not that hard. A lot easier than swapping resin. The resin stays in the tank while cleaning.

But if you get new resin, establish a way to clean it and treat it. And consider cleaning the softener while you are at it.
 

s10010001

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Kinda, yes. When resin cleaning with Iron Out or resin cleaner is not that hard. A lot easier than swapping resin. The resin stays in the tank while cleaning.

But if you get new resin, establish a way to clean it and treat it. And consider cleaning the softener while you are at it.

yea, that was my thought process. There was a lot of crap in my lines and stuff when we moved in. I cant even imagine how nasty the bottom of the softener is. I would feel better knowing it was all cleaned and like new. Then I can maintain from there. I did clean out the salt brine tank a while back it was really nasty, the smell was horrible. Crazy consider it full of salt!


So, and recommended brand? good place to buy it besides taking the amazon "is it real" challenge?

It sounds like I can use less the 2cu/ft if I wanted to, but reading here I think I wil just shell out for 2cu/ft+20#gravel.
 

Bannerman

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I cant even imagine how nasty the bottom of the softener is.
A water softener will be back washed at the beginning of each regeneration cycle. Backwashing causes the resin to be lifted and expanded so as to flush out any sediment and debris accumulation that entered from the well, eliminates channelling, and expands the spaces between the resin granules so the brine that enters during the following stage will have greater surface contact with each resin granule.

The amount of expansion is determined by the drain flow rate which for a 12" softener tank, is usually 3.5 GPM as governed by the drain flow restrictor.

2 ft3 is the correct quantity of resin for your 12" tank.

The salt setting will determine the usable capacity between regeneration cycles as well as the hardness reduction efficiency per lb of salt.

For example, the usual recommended salt and capacity setting to provide the best balance of efficiency, capacity and water quality is 8 lbs salt per ft3 of resin.

For your 2 ft3 softener, 16 lbs salt will regenerate 48,000 grains usable capacity per cycle. This results in a Hardness reduction efficiency of (48,000 / 16) = 3,000 grains/lb.

For slightly higher efficiency, 12 lbs salt (6 lbs/ft3) will regenerate 42,000-grains Capacity, resulting in an HRE of 3,500 gr/lb, but slightly lower water quality as hardness leakage through the resin will be greater compared to the 8 lb/ft3 setting.

Since your water is not chlorinated, standard 8% cross-linked resin will be appropriate whereas premium 10% C-L will better tolerate continuous chlorine exposure in municipally supplied water.

The standard recommendation is to obtain resin manufactured within North America such as Purolite or IonPlus brands.
 
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Reach4

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buy it besides taking the amazon "is it real" challenge?

It sounds like I can use less the 2cu/ft if I wanted to, but reading here I think I will just shell out for 2cu/ft+20#gravel.
Kinda depends on how often your softener will regenerate and how much iron you have. If your water is not very hard, and there is a fair amount of iron, you want the softener to regen more frequently. So there might be a case where using 1 cuft would make sense to handle the iron better. But usually you would want the 2 cuft.
 

s10010001

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ok, good stuff everyone. Gave me lots to go on. I'm going to revie my hardness settings (vs a hardness test) as well as how much salt I have in there and go form there. Glad to know backwashing should be keeping it clean in there. Also thanks for finding my model and Manual, that's going to help a lot.

I do know people around me that say their softener regens nightly. Mine is using a gallon gauge, its like every ~980 gallons it regens. It seems ot count down, then regens at night when it gets below 100.

Im looking into a proper water test too.
 

Bannerman

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Glad to know backwashing should be keeping it clean in there
That is assuming it is getting full flow. You haven't described the filters you placed before the softener. If the filters cause too much flow restriction, particularly after being used for some time, it is possible there will be insufficient flow to properly backwash the resin.

people around me that say their softener regens nightly.
Their hardness & iron may be excessive for the capacity of the softener, or the softener maybe equipped with a time clock style control valve that is set to regenerate after so many days, not gallons. When a user does not understand how to calculate and program the correct settings, they will often program to regenerate more frequently than necessary.

Almost all modern softeners are now demand based so they will regenerate only after the programmed capacity has been depleted. When there is little/no iron or manganese, the usual recommendation for efficient operation is to size the softener to supply the usual soft water requirements while using an efficient salt & capacity setting, so that regeneration will be required no more than 1X per week, to as few as 1X per month.

When there is iron, manganese and other problem conditions, depending on the severity, regeneration may need to be performed more frequently than 1X per week, and the salt setting may need to be higher and less efficient to reduce fouling.

How about Aldex?
Sure, there are other suitable brands, which is why I specifically said 'such as'.
 
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Skyjumper

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the Clack Ws1 is the best valve available, so you're good there. it will certainly need to be disassembled and cleaned, and likely need a new injector. I get all my clack parts from softenerparts.com the guy there is great and will help you with whatever you need resin too. get the Clack service tool too. youtube videos show you exactly what to do. soaking iron stained parts in a strong iron out solution overnight will clean them right up.

since your softener is in the garage it will be easy for you to roll it outside and dump it into an old pillow case to collect the resin. it's still a bit of work to clean it out. I just bought a new tank, riser, etc, put the resin in and got it all staged, and then just swapped out the tanks to minimize downtime. mine is in basement, much more difficult to get outside.

you really should do an iron test so you have a sense for what you're dealing with. hardness too. so you can program the valve correctly and avoid the mess you currently have. high iron is probably why the softener is so big, and why your neighbors regenerate every night. the iron test strips don't work, you need a proper test kit or send it to a lab. or ask a local water company to test it most will do it free if you bring them a sample.

the nasty crud descriptors in your posts make me think you have iron bacteria too. that will make your headaches much worse. fill a glass with raw well water and let it sit overnight. if it turns cloudy with orange crud at the bottom you have iron bacteria. brown slime in your toilet tank is also a sign. shocking your well with bleach will kill off the bacteria for a while.

keep an eye on those canister filters they will clog up quick with iron crud.
 

s10010001

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Yea I shouldn't have any issues getting it dumped. I do plan on getting a test done actually.

I did however get the Rona this past week, so I'm down for the count sick (currently feeling a little better). So I will get to this sometime next week.
 

ditttohead

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Get a real water test so we can see what is going on. Resin is in short supply as are Clack parts. I am currently down to less than 5 containers in my building, with only a few expected to get here in the next month.
NTLWATERTEST
 
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