Goulds J10S Humming

[Valveman]

The ohms sound ok, the voltage is good, the motor should be spinning, I am at a loss. It is going to be a simple little wire connection loose or something because a big problem is easy to find. Amp draw will tell you more.

If it is a capacitor or something in the start circuit the pump will draw a lot of amps and buzz for a few seconds before it trips the overload.

 

[Jfharper]

Only 2 starting caps.

I can access the wires on the starting cap...where do I put the leads and how do I test. I have a multimeter with auto functionality, so it makes it easy with the settings, but I'm still new to this.

Yes, this is my house water, but I do have a sub in a well that pumps to a holding take on a platform about 25 feet high, so we are getting water but with low pressure due to gravity feed.

Replacing the pump is expensive and I'd like to avoid that unless necessary.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Reach4]

The Franklin AIM manual offers this capacitor test method using an ohmmeter:

CAPACITOR (Disconnect leads from one side of each capacitor before checking.)
1. Meter Setting: R x 1,000.
2. Connections: Capacitor terminals.
3. Correct meter reading: Pointer should swing toward zero, then drift back
to infinity, except for capacitors with resistors which will drift back to
15,000 ohms.
​

I would add that if you then reverse the ohmmeter leads, the reading should then kick down toward zero again, and drift up again.

Regarding measuring current, if you do not have a clamp-around ammeter, you would have to open one of the wires and put the meter in series to complete the path through the meter. Being limited to 2 hands can make that hard unless you have alligator clips. When putting a meter in amps mode, a different probe jack is often used than for volt/ohm readings. Make sure you put everything back to normal before then trying to measure volts. Otherwise, at best you blow a meter fuse.

A clamp-around ammeter does indeed let you just grab around an insulated wire and measure the amps.

 

[Jfharper]

OK, I tested the two start caps I have, both off the pump. After covering with a rag and shorting the leads with a screwdriver, touching probes to each lead gave a very quick jump to 2,000 Ohms then when back to O.L (which I think is over limit or out of limit range) Tried each, a few times, same result.

 

[Jfharper]

OK, I called the local well drilling company where I've bought parts from before, they had a cap, I thought I would buy there's in case both mine were bad. They let me put the multimeter on it before buying, it did the same as the two I had above, 2,000 Ohms then OL. So I didn't buy it, thinking my two were ok.

I ran the whole story by the tech guy, he said it could be that my windings were burnt. He asked if the motor smelled burnt, I said I couldn't tell cuz it's outside and my sniffer ain't as good anymore. Could what he said sound possible? Could the windings be burnt but still read continuity?

 

[Valveman]

You need to find out if that 8.8 ohms is the right reading for that particular motor.

 

[Jfharper]

What would that be, motor resistance tolerance?

 

[Valveman]

Every motor has a certain resistance between legs that you can measure. But you need to find out from the motor company what that resistance should be.

 

[Jfharper]

OK, just called goulds, closed, I'll try tomorrow.

 

[Jfharper]

If I had to get a replacement, is there an equivalent pump worth getting? Or should I just go with the same one. I know its hard to guess b/c I haven't stated my useage, but this pump has lasted since we bought the place 17 years ago.

 

[Valveman]

Goulds jet pumps are still one of the best.

 

[Reach4]

http://www.pacificcoastwell.com/files/GSSINGLE.pdf page 54 describes checks, many of which you have done already. It does not show the ohms expected, but this still could be of some use.

 

[Jfharper]

OK, I was considering getting a replacement motor and installing that, much cheaper, I think the motors are manufactured by CentriPro. I've rebuilt the front end of this pump before bout 4 years ago, impeller, diaphram, seals etc. I would probably get another front end rebuild kit just to be safe. Parts for just the two seals and shipping is about half the cost of the entire kit, might as well spend a little more and put a new diaphram and impeller in as well...have a new pump for less than buying a whole new pump. Plus I read someone having trouble with the new castings breaking on them. Since this is an older casting might be worth holding on to, besides, I have my Dads old pump, same model J10s, with same castings, that I could use for backup parts. Too bad I can't use the motor...it doesn't turn. Maybe I could take the bearings out of my Dads and repair...I don't know, maybe too much hassle. I like fixing things and I like saving money, I'm reluctant to buy new stuff because it is not made very well anymore.

But I'll see if I can't track down the motor Ohm numbers first before making my decision.

 

[Jfharper]

http://www.pacificcoastwell.com/files/GSSINGLE.pdf page 54 describes checks, many of which you have done already. It does not show the ohms expected, but this still could be of some use.

Thank you.

 

[Valveman]

You can replace the bearings in that old motor. They are sealed bearings, non grease-able, so they are built to last only a certain number of hours. Put in some good quality bearings and that old pump will be better than any new one on the market.

 

[Jfharper]

You can replace the bearings in that old motor. They are sealed bearings, non grease-able, so they are built to last only a certain number of hours. Put in some good quality bearings and that old pump will be better than any new one on the market.

Your post got me thinking, what if I took the motor out of my Dads, put my bearings on it and used that...well, I pulled the motor apart, and saw windings in my motor that were black and dried (didn't look to have that wax/acrylic coating on the windings). So apparently the guy from the well drilling business had it right.

I didn't end up pulling the bearings off my armature (is that what the middle shaft thing is called) and simply put my armature with bearings and front piece in my Dads windings, put the rest back together, rear components, front pump stuff and it worked! Yeah! I have a small slow leak that I anticipated because I used used seal parts, just to get the pressure back on for the house.

This at least buys me some time to order a new motor and I'll order a rebuild kit and redo the pump for a fraction of what the guys in town want to charge me for a new pump. Thanks for all your help. It was a great learning experience. Interesting that I got continuity in the burnt windings. Now, in the future, I'll know how to diagnose the pump better.

 

[Jfharper]

BTW, can anyone think of a possible reason why the windings burnt the same night the power went out? I'm wondering if there is a problem somewhere in my system I should check so this doesn't happen again with a new motor. My pressure switch is new, I have a new breaker out by the well for the booster pump, I would think the breaker or overload should have protected the unit, but I don't know.

 

[Valveman]

Breakers and overloads are designed to protect the electric grid from a bad motor, not the other way around. And yes a power outage also means a power spike when it comes back on, so that can take out the windings. It is very unusual to have a burned stator and not be able to see it on an ohm meter. I'll bet that 8.8 ohms is not the right number.

 

[Reach4]

Nicely done.

Was there lightning the night that the power went out?