Flexible hose connection to Fleck steel bypass

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Eljay

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A Fleck 5600sxt was purchased a couple of weeks back and will finally be arriving soon. I've been indecisive about how it should be installed. Quotes in the $300-400 range by local professionals had me considering doing it myself. As this would be the first time sweating copper, I thought I might get torch and a handful of copper fittings to practice with. I'd also considering using flexible hoses due to their low relative cost--compared to getting Bernzomatic TS8000 torch, MAPP tank, flux, solder, other necessary tools, etc.--and ease of installation.
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Questions regarding using flexible lines:

1. When routing the flexible hoses, what is the minimum loop radius without compromising the connection ends, "necks" and hoses themselves? How close to the connection points can you safely start bending them? I've searched specs and product pages using "bend", "bent", and "loop" to no avail.

The Fleck 5600sxt will be installed in the garage replacing a Culligan Medalist. Space is a concern. The existing softener's copper pipe extends out from the wall about 8". My hope is to cut the copper right behind the existing bypass enabling me to retain the inlet shutoff. However I don't think retaining the shutoff is absolutely necessary since there is another one in the garage upstream just 10 feet away.

If I were remove the original pipe and shutoff for a more compact installation, I'd be forced to cut closer to the drywall than I'm comfortable with due to the proximity of the nearest fitting. Whatever the approach, pushing the installation more than two feet or so from the wall might be too much. The media tank is 8" in diameter.

2. 18" or 24" flexible hoses?

The old copper terminates (perpendicular to the wall) about 8" below where the new bypass will sit. Is being longer generally better so as not to make any necessary turns/loops too tight? I assume between the two, any difference in flow is trivial. So should I get 24" hoses?

3. Sharkbite (SS3094FLEX24LF) or Falcon by John Guest (PTC1JG)?

Sharkbite is much easier to get my hands on though Home Depot and is cheaper in cost. Reviews indicate that they have problems when used to connect water heaters since internal rubber parts deteriorate and leach into the hot water downstream. This is a concern since--due to living in the desert southwest--it is common during the summertime for my cold water to run warm for several seconds before cooling down. It seems like the main water line is shallow enough underground that heat from unrelenting sunlight causes a non-trivial amount of heat transfer. I don't believe the temperature is as warm as a typical water heater gets. I'm sure it's below 120 F. Certainly below 140 F. Should I be worried?

Searching through older threads on this forum, John Guest hoses seem to be well regarded. Though they are costlier and must be ordered online. They also have a bypass side nylon FIP connection whereas the Sharkbite is steel. The ordered bypass is an original Fleck stainless steel model requiring the use of a brass nipple. I assume that the Sharkbite steel FIP connection would be superior in this case? I will use tape and thread sealant.
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I've spent a good deal of time reading up on sweating copper on this forum, on copper.org, and watching Youtube. I'm confident I could get it to work eventually without burning the house down. I mainly get nervous about soldering near the bypass or ball valve but am sure there are ways around it. When it comes down to it, it's likely that my initial attempt(s) would leak increasing time and/or cost with main water shutoff to the entire house. So the cheaper/lazier side of me is currently winning out.

Edit: grammar and links
 
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Bannerman

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Regardless of soldering experience, flexible lines are often preferable for a softener installation as they will allow some height and side to side flexibility when needed (for placement, cleaning, service, painting etc).

I believe both Sharkbite and Falcon flex lines will be equally suitable for your application. As those push-on connection types (Sharkbite & John Guest) are now approved for in-wall applications within my province, I expect you should not experience issues with either and push-on will make the installation quick, easy and straightforward. In addition, since a torch will not be needed, there will be no potential of burning the wall behind.

As your new softener will be equipped with a Fleck bypass, the existing 3 valve bypass may then be eliminated. A wheel type tubing cutter should be used for cutting the copper squarely. There are various cutter sizes, depending on the space surrounding the pipes to be cut. Some cutters are equipped with a retractable blade to make removal of the burr on the inside of each cut edge fairly simple otherwise, a round file may be used.

To ensure the space between the wall and the softener is as minimal as possible, you may wish to consider utilizing elbows when connecting the flex lines. The 2nd link in the 3rd post at the link below shows such an installation. There are various 1" Sharkbite elbows shown on the HD website. https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/leaking-clack-ws1-tank.79248/
 

Reach4

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Your Fleck 5600SXT bypass is 3/4 FIP. Both connectors you linked to are 1 inch.

The Falcon connectors will have bigger ID for a given nominal size.
 

Eljay

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To ensure the space between the wall and the softener is as minimal as possible, you may wish to consider utilizing elbows when connecting the flex lines. The 2nd link in the 3rd post at the link below shows such an installation. There are various 1" Sharkbite elbows shown on the HD website. https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/leaking-clack-ws1-tank.79248/

Looks great. I hadn't thought of that. So the Sharkbite elbows' ability to rotate wouldn't cause problems? Have you done/seen many installations similar to the one pictured using PTC fittings on the house plumbing side?

On the bypass side, I suppose I could get a brass elbow like this (supplyhouse). So connections would be:

flex hose FIP > brass elbow > nipple > bypass

But aside from the additional complication of adding an extra fitting, I take it that getting it in an upright position and just the right tightness could be problematic. Those concerns aside, would it be worth a shot if I needed to get everything closer to the wall?
 

Eljay

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Your Fleck 5600SXT bypass is 3/4 FIP. Both connectors you linked to are 1 inch.

The plumbing is 1". So, I got the 1" Fleck bypass. I did see that the valve is 3/4". But I was told that it would be sufficient for a two bath home with two people. Was I given poor advice?
 

Reach4

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The plumbing is 1". So, I got the 1" Fleck bypass. I did see that the valve is 3/4". But I was told that it would be sufficient for a two bath home with two people. Was I given poor advice?
The 5810 SXT is 1 inch internal, so it might have been the better choice. It is behind the counter like pseudoephedrine at the drug store, so you have to ask.

Is the pipe coming in copper from above? When using flex lines, it is usually best to not have the two ends right in line with each other.

A street elbow could help eliminate a nipple.
bres100-2.jpg


Too bad they don't seem to make
DV_WebSmall_P_6396.jpg
in 1 inch brass.
 

Eljay

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The 5810 SXT is 1 inch internal, so it might have been the better choice. It is behind the counter like pseudoephedrine at the drug store, so you have to ask.
Ah. Always saving the good stuff for people in the know I see. I had searched for it online. The only options for systems I saw were upwards of 50% higher price. I suppose I'll see how the 5600sxt performs and consider swapping it with a 5810 if necessary. Maybe then just put the 5600 on craigslist.

After ordering the system, I stumbled across a Culligan media tank adapter (softenerparts)
CulliganAdapter-2T.jpg

Do these perform well? This one would've worked with the 5600. I assume this would've worked for a 5810 too?


Is the pipe coming in copper from above? When using flex lines, it is usually best to not have the two ends right in line with each other.
Not sure I understand. The copper comes out of the wall. So you're saying I should cut the copper to different lengths so the PTC fittings are offset?

A street elbow could help eliminate a nipple.
bres100-2.jpg


Too bad they don't seem to make
DV_WebSmall_P_6396.jpg
in 1 inch brass.
Since the stainless steel bypass has a FIP connection, I'll still need the nipple with or without the street elbow. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Here's another product I'm interested in getting you all's take on (Fleck right angle adapter online):
71B15HvVxlL._SX679_.jpg

Just looking at it, this would go into the back of the valve. Then the steel or noryl bypass would go behind it, right?
 
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Reach4

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Not sure I understand. The copper comes out of the wall. So you're saying I should cut the copper to different lengths so the PTC fittings are offset?
No. I am saying that you would usually be better to not have the flex line straight. A curve is usually better for a flex line.
Since the stainless steel bypass has a FIP connection, I'll still need the nipple with or without the street elbow. Correct me if I'm wrong.
You would need one less with a street elbow than with the common fip x fip elbow.

https://www.qualitywaterforless.com/Fleck_19620_01_p/19620.htm

I have the equiv to that on my 5800SXT to put the tank closer to the wall.
 

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Eljay

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No. I am saying that you would usually be better to not have the flex line straight. A curve is usually better for a flex line.
You would need one less with a street elbow than with the common fip x fip elbow.

https://www.qualitywaterforless.com/Fleck_19620_01_p/19620.htm

I have the equiv to that on my 5800SXT to put the tank closer to the wall.

Regardless of soldering experience, flexible lines are often preferable...

I'm definitely feeling much better about the install. I'll be incorporating many suggestions above. But, I've also decided to order a plastic bypass and yoke since I think it'll make thingss easier and I won't have to worry as much about galling or corrosion with the steel bypass. So now it'll be the plastic yoke with MIP connection on one side. Then, it'll be a Sharkbite MIP adapter connected to a brass street elbow on the plumbing side to make the new vertical connection. Between the two, I'll just use the Falcon stainless steel FIPxFIP flex connector. I'll add the Fleck right angle adapter plastic part on the bypass side later if I still need to tighten things up.

Thank, folks. Hopefully everything goes smoothly next weekend.
 
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