Las Vegas Water Softener Selection

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by John Vegas, May 23, 2012.

  1. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2012
  2. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

    Messages:
    1,946
    Location:
    Ontario California
    Your first choice. I know them very well, they do a great job, and they offer good customer support.
  3. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Can someone show me (do?) the calculations for the following:
    20 Grains
    Say 75 gallons total a day
    Salt pound dose of 4 LBs
    64K 2 CF softener

    How often will it regen?

    Thanks, JS
  4. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    20 grains x 75 gpd =1500 grains per day.
    4 lb/cubic foot salt dose (8 lbs total) will yield capacity of ~26,000 grains.

    So the gross days is 26000/1500 = 17 days - one day reserve = 16 days.
  5. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    My 64K Fleck 7000SXT will be here tomorrow for a Thanksgiving Day installation. Few questions:

    1. The existing Culligan is hooked up to a drain line with a 5/8" clear flexible tubing. I think the Fleck spec is a 1/2" tubing. I am unable to get the tubing off of the pvc connection that comes from the wall. Of course, I could cut the tubing after I disconnect the Culligan and see if I have to replace the pvc connection of if the 1/2" tubing could be connected to the existing pvc fitting. Any idea if the 5/8" existing clear tubing could work with the Fleck?

    2. After I install the Fleck, do I just turn the water on and let it run? I assume the installation instruction will have some details, but I did recall reading something about adjusting the valve so when I turn the water on, the water drains to the line so you don't pack in the resin with the high water pressure. Any tips?

    Thanks, John

    Culligan Drain.jpg
  6. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

    Messages:
    1,946
    Location:
    Ontario California
    The 7000 comes with a 3/4" MIP connector. Considering the small DLFC size of 3.5 GPM, I would recommend running the drain in no less than 1/2". You can buy a 3/4" threaded PVC coupler from home depot for a dollar, and a 3/4" MIP x 1/2" barb to convert the drain easily.

    To start up the system, the unit should come with instructions. basically turn the water on slowly with the system in backwash. let it fill very slowly, once the air is out of the system, you can open the valve up the rest of the way. Run it through a full regeneration. Sanitization is usually recommended after installation as well. Let us know if the system does not come with more detailed start up proceudres.
  7. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Since you mention 5/8" tubing, the OD is 5/8", the same as 1/2" copper, PEX and CPVC. And the correct fitting is for 5/8" tubing and it is called 1/2" insert/barbed but... as in many things plumbing.... it is incorrect because.the ID is not 1/2", it is smaller by a bit. You should be able to reuse your fitting buy cutting it off if you buy a 3/4" x 1/2" reducer/bushing to screw it into. Or, buy a new PVC 3/4" male x insert fitting for the 5/8" you already have or the same size new tubing which should be coming with the new softener. Or maybe that new fitting will come with the softener also, I always included one with my softeners.

    Since the resin is new you don't have to regenerate it, it is fully regenerated and you don't have to sanitize the softener but if you want to, add a 1/4 cup of non scented regular bleach to the water you add to the salt tank, do that before you add any salt.

    And don't add salt until you check for proper brine draw (no air bubbles in the brine line) and you do that after this next step. Then when you are done filling the resin tank with the control in backwash, open your water valve all the way and step the control to the slow rinse/brine draw and check for no air leaks, then let the unit finish the cycle positions back to Service.
  8. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    I think that last paragraph was a bit over my head. I understand the proper brine draw--you want to make sure the softener is sucking water out of the salt tank. How do you "step the control to the slow rinse/brine draw and check for no air leaks?" Do you hit a series of keys on the 7000 since the thing is not mechanical per se.

    JS
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  9. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    7000 Programming Cheat Sheet

    Anyone have any tips on programming the 7000SXT, found loads of stuff on this forum and online, but wondering if anyone has a "cheat sheet" to share. Thanks, JS
  10. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    To step the valve from one cycle position to another you probably use the same button that is used to go from one programming field to the next; maybe the UP arrow; I don't recall.
  11. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

    Messages:
    1,946
    Location:
    Ontario California

    I will post the cheat sheet tomorrow morning.
    7000 2 cu ft.jpg
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  12. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    So if I set the "C" value to a lower number (say 26), I would use less salt right? I am worried that if I start monkeying around with one number, I am going to screw things up. The 7000 I received via UPS yesterday did say it is set for 25 grains, so I assume my supplier modified the factory settings a bit?

  13. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

    Messages:
    1,946
    Location:
    Ontario California
    The hardness needs to be set to your actual hardness. The valves can be programmed from the factory with any default we chose. You need to test your water and set the hardess accordingly. The C is the capacity, capacity is based on resin volume and salt setting. The 2 must match. So if you change the capacity, the salt needs to be adjusted as well. 8 Pounds per cubic foot gives you exceprional water quality for residential applications, and maintains fairly high efficiency. lower salt settings will give you slightly higher efficiencies. Below 6 pounds of salt per cu. ft, the water quality may suffer, but most people are happy with salt settings as low as 4 pounds per cu. ft.

    Hope this helps.
  14. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    The hardness in a city water system has to be set to the max hardness in the system due to fluctuations from time to time.

    And you can set the salt dose less than 4 lbs/cuft and never notice a difference in your softened water quality.
  15. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    The hardness here is reported as 19 from my water purveyor. I figured setting it to 20 or a bit more for fluctuations made sense. I understand the whole salt dose thing, but where do you actually set the salt dose or is it a direct function of "C"?

    I see it seems to be a function of the Brine Refill Cycle time setting, which makes sense. I guess what time do I use for a .25 BLFC for a 4 lb salt dosing (or even a 6 lb salt dose)? Do I assume it takes 1 gallon of water to dissolve 3 pounds of salt? If so, then I need 2.5 gallons of water to dissolve 8 lbs of salt (using a 4 lb dosage). Then 2.5 gallons dividied by the BLFC size say .25 (I'll double check) means I need a Brine Refill Cycle Time of 10 min (I assume this is the BF setting? However, 10 seems much lower than the amount on the Cheat Sheet, but makes sense since it is 1/2 the salt dose). Then is my C set for 30 (which is approx. 3800 grains per pound times 8 lbs of salt--this part is confusing--I don't how the grains per pound is arrived at)? I think I am getting this...

    Thanks, JS
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  16. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,316
    Location:
    Maine
    I hope that hose clamp connection is a temporary thing
  17. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    It was installed originally by Culligan about six year ago when the original owner of the home had the Culligan installed by the builder. It has not been an issue, but I always thought is seems a "substandard" installation.

    This drain line has become a real PITA. The existing Culligan uses a 5/8" INSIDE diameter clear plastic tube that connects to some some type of plastic nipple that is screwed into the copper fitting that was sweated to the 1/2" copper pipe (the last picture that Tom commented on) that goes to the drain in the laundry room and then connects to the Culligan.

    The new 7000SXT came with a barbed plastic adapter to convert the 7000SXT to a 1/2" tubing connection. Obviously the 5/8" ID diameter clear plastic tubing that is connected to the pipe is not going to work to connect to the 7000SXT. I was HOPING to avoid pulling off the 5/8" ID clear plastic tubing from the wall connection because I can seem to pull it off and I will have to cut it, since I don't seem to have a choice. I would think I could buy some brass fitting to screw into the copper fitting that was sweated to the copper pipe, and then connect the 1/2" tubing from the new 7000SXT. The supplier of the new 7000SXT included black plastic 1/2" tubing, but it does seem cheap compared to the much much heavier clear plastic that Culligan used. It probably doesn't matter much I guess since this line is not under permanent pressure.

    Just for my info, how are you SUPPPOSED to connect a water softener to a 1/2" copper line that comes from the wall. Culligan installed all (well I have seen three) softeners like this in my community (they partnered with the original builder to rip people off and install the Culligans as part of the sale price of the homes).

    Thanks, JS



  18. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Yes 3 lbs per gallon of water.

    There is nothing wrong with the hose clamp. Your reinforced vinyl is not tubing, it is iron pipe size (IPS) hose.

    IPS maintains the ID, tubing maintains the OD. Your new drain line is 5/8" OD tubing and the ID is smaller than 1/2", so you need an insert fitting for 5/8" tubing x 1/2" male to replace the vinyl if you're going to, which I wouldn't. To connect the new drain line to the vinyl you need a 5/8" insert x 1/2" female to accept the new drain line 1/2" male and screw them together. The new drain line is industry standard although it usually is opaque not colored. Just make sure the vinyl doesn't kink closed.
  19. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,316
    Location:
    Maine
    How about you show me in ANY plumbing code book where that hose clamp connection is approved LOL Oh, sorry, I forgot that you don't bother with codes. LOL
  20. John Vegas

    John Vegas New Member

    Messages:
    57
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Any suggestions on how TO connect it then?

    JS
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