Multiple Circuits, one box

[Marcus Waddell]

Hi all,
I know as long as you keep the hots/neutrals separate for each circuit and don't exceed the box fill that it's OK to have multiple circuits in the same box. I'm wiring up a wood shop and I'd like to have 7 3-gang boxes along a cement wall. I'll be using 3/4" EMT to connect and running 12 awg THHN-2 wire. These will not be multi-wire branch circuits, but three separate circuits. The 120v circuits will be GFCI breaker protected.

In each box I want to put two separate 120v/20A circuits and one 240v/20A circuit. I know there is a way to tie the 2 - 120v single pole breakers together in the sub panel, but is there a way to have all three breakers (2 - 120V single pole GFCIs and 1 - 240V 2-Pole) tied together? These are Square D QO breakers. This way if anyone ever needs to work on the one of the circuits all three will be turned off.

 

[Reach4]

Square D part QO1HTCP will each tie two adjacent QO breakers together, but I think not 3.

https://www.schneider-electric.us/en/product/QO1HTCP/qo-mini-circuit-breaker-accy,-handle-tie,-qo-qob,-cp/

While you could use a 3-pole breaker, you would not want that.

Have you considered a small subpanel? You could have a cutoff for the whole panel.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Marcus Waddell]

Already have the subpanel in. It's a 60A subpanel that will be servicing the shop. Will that "shutoff" meet the NEC requirements?

 

[Reach4]

Already have the subpanel in. It's a 60A subpanel that will be servicing the shop. Will that "shutoff" meet the NEC requirements?

If the shop is in a detached building I would think so, but I cannot be sure. I am not an electrician. 60 A subpanels are usually fed with a 60 amp breaker in the main panel. That breaker would cut off the whole subpanel. There could be a disconnect in the shop, but I think it is usually not needed.

If the shop is in a different building, what I read causes me to think if there are 6 or fewer breakers needed to be flipped off in the subpanel, then you don't need a disconnect switch.

 

[Marcus Waddell]

Here's a pick of the subpanel. 60A breaker in main box feeding the subpanel right next to the main panel. Will run the 2-120v/20a GFCI circuits and 1-240v/20a circuit from subpanel.

 

[Reach4]

I was thinking of a subpanel in the shop fed by #6 from the main panel.

Seems to me that you would be in great shape shutoff-wise. Maybe put a note in the subpanel that the subpanel is fed by breaker #__ in the main panel.

I think your neutral should have been white, and remarking black with white tape to use as a neutral is not allowed now.

Check for GFCI and AFCI requirements.

 

[Marcus Waddell]

I was thinking of a subpanel in the shop fed by #6 from the main panel.

Seems to me that you would be in great shape shutoff-wise. Maybe put a note in the subpanel that the subpanel is fed by breaker #__ in the main panel.

I think your neutral should have been white, and remarking black with white tape to use as a neutral is not allowed now.

Check for GFCI and AFCI requirements.

Why would that not be allowed? (and where does it say that in the code)? It's an identification, really no different than having a white wire.

 

[Reach4]

Why would that not be allowed?

Does that reallymatter? I would guess they thought somebody might tap a white #12 passing through a box in the middle to use as a neutral. Clearly for your run, that would not happen.

There are various code things that don't seem to make sense.

(and where does it say that in the code)?

200.6(A)

 

[Marcus Waddell]

I think 200.6(B)(4) applies in my case. Since it's #4 wire. Besides, the total length including the two or so feet at each in that is in the electrical panel is 8 feet.

 

[Marcus Waddell]

I was thinking of a subpanel in the shop fed by #6 from the main panel.

Seems to me that you would be in great shape shutoff-wise. Maybe put a note in the subpanel that the subpanel is fed by breaker #__ in the main panel.

I think your neutral should have been white, and remarking black with white tape to use as a neutral is not allowed now.

Check for GFCI and AFCI requirements.

GFCI required for unfinished basements for 120V service. Got that covered.

 

[Reach4]

I think 200.6(B)(4) applies in my case. Since it's #4 wire. Besides, the total length including the two or so feet at each in that is in the electrical panel is 8 feet.

Right you are. I presumed #6.

 

[Marcus Waddell]

Right you are. I presumed #6.

I used #6 in my panel to shed, but was able to get black, red, white and green for that. I used #4 here but could only get black and green. The guy at the local electrical supply house said I could mark them, right he was.

 

[Marcus Waddell]

Hi all,
...I'm wiring up a wood shop and I'd like to have 7 3-gang boxes along a cement wall. I'll be using 3/4" EMT to connect and running 12 awg THHN-2 wire. These will not be multi-wire branch circuits, but three separate circuits. The 120v circuits will be GFCI breaker protected. In each box I want to put two separate 120v/20A circuits and one 240v/20A circuit...

Another question for y'all...Since there will be three circuits in the box, do I need a red wire to indicate a separate circuit for the 2nd 120V circuit? What about a red for the 240V circuit? Or can I simply use black, white, green as long as they are groups in each box as per 200.4 (B)?

 

[WorthFlorida]

For the 240v circuit, the two hot wires can be black. To keep your sanity and good workmanship, label the wires or cables at both ends with Ideal Wire Marker Booklet for Residential Panel Boxes. Available at Home Depot.

 

[Marcus Waddell]

Another question for y'all...Since there will be three circuits in the box, do I need a red wire to indicate a separate circuit for the 2nd 120V circuit? What about a red for the 240V circuit? Or can I simply use black, white, green as long as they are groups in each box as per 200.4 (B)?

I was planning on marking with electrical tape and a sharpie, but that might be easier! Do you know if these will survive pulling through conduit?

 

[Marcus Waddell]

Hey All,
I decided to do one box for the two 120V circuits and a separate box for the 240V outlets. Thanks for the info on the above though.