Old tank, new bowl? Will it work?

[old_car_eddie]

Hello, Everyone,

A question, please:

Can a modern toilet bowl -- the china part you sit on -- be outfitted with an older, larger gallon-wise, tank?

In other words, will a 3.5 gallon tank bolt up to a modern bowl?

Please read more background:

I live in an old family home that was built in the early 1930s. My bathroom is all original other than the toilet. The sink is original, so is the tub and the white and green tile floor. The toilet is a modern (early 2000s) Crane toilet with a water-saving tank. The toilet looks "out of place" in the old bathroom.

My house is in an old neighborhood. All of the houses around me are old. So is the municipal sewerage system. And as practically everyone knows, it takes a fair bit of water to move the waste down the pipes. The toilet cleans so-so with the lower-water flush but often it takes two flushes to clean the bowl. In addition to this, the old sewer system works better when there is the extra water to keep things moving, so to say.

More of my thoughts:

I have looked at the big box stores as well as online and I've seen there are many new, but vintage-looking bowls, on the market. Some have a nice, large rectangular-shaped base where they sit on the floor. The look of an old-style bowl appeals to my style desires in my bathroom.

I have wondered if a pre-1990s, 3.5-gallon tank will successfully mate up to, and work with, a current-production bowl. (I have a 3.5-gallon tank that is in storage.)

I do understand it is important to conserve water. I live in an area with an ample water supply. As a matter of fact, we have many flowing (artesian) wells in my neighborhood in which the water is simply goes into a pipe and then into a nearby creek. I understand, too, that water conservation will save me a few dollars each year. I'm all for saving money, but improved performance, to me, would outweigh the monitary cost. I also know water-saving-toilets were mandated by law in the 1990s, but hey, I often speed when I drive, too. And lawmakers need to stay out of my bathroom. Duh!

And further, I like the elongated bowl and additional height of a "handicap" height bowl and the convenience of a modern toilet seat lid.

Can anyone tell me if I can make an old, large capacity tank work on a modern bowl? (Or does anyone have a nice-looking, complete old toilet -- "rebuildable" is fine -- they'd would sell and ship???)

Thanks for any and all information!

Best wishes from Eddie

 

[WJcandee]

Eddie, I think you would be better off getting a modern-acting but older-looking tank-bowl combination that appeals to you.

Your sewer system will be fine. It gets lots of water from sources other than the toilet (shower, washer, dishwasher, etc.) to move the waste along. I highly doubt you or it will be aware of the difference in water usage per flush. Yes, there is some research on "drain line carry" and the like, but the fact is that the systems are surviving and it's not your obligation to take care of them, short of only putting the right stuff down the drain.

Moreover, a new bowl won't know what to do with the extra water. It isn't going to give it a larger water-spot in the bowl, because that is determined by the bowl shape and design, not what comes through the tank at the flush. Also, any extra water in the refill part of the cycle in an old tank is just going to quietly spill down the bowl's trapway, gone forever and for no use whatsoever. The refill water is a significant part (20-40%) of the total water used in a cycle. If you're wasting it by overfilling the bowl which then settles to the level dictated by the china, you're not gaining anything.

And the extra water really won't help the flush, either. We have a Toto Drake 1.6 gallon per flush toilet. Excellent toilet. Flushes great with just a little water. Never clogs. The toilet fills up the tank to about 3 gallons of water, but only uses about 5 quarts of that actually to do the flush, because the flapper opens and closes quickly, using the weight of the water in the tank to move the water quickly through the flush valve. However, one family member insisted on holding the lever down to dump the whole tank into the bowl, believing it made it flush better. (This makes it about a 3.5 gallon per flush toilet.) It doesn't make it flush better. In fact, it makes it have to try to swallow a bunch of extra water at once, which really doesn't help it move the solid waste was it was designed to do. And then it runs unnecessarily-long, pouring water after waste that is already running out my main drain pipe in the basement by the time the water stops running. We did some experiments that proved this. Turns out the "slurp, gurgle, gurgle, DONE" flush as designed is every bit as effective as the "sluuuuuuuuuuurp, gurglegurglegurglegurglegurglegurgle" that it does with the lever held down for a full drain of the tank. Nothing gained.

The modern bowl and trapway is designed to work with a particular amount of water and the extra in most cases does absolutely nothing but get wasted.

Also, the better 1.6 and 1.28 gallon per flush toilets these days rush the water out of the tank and into the bowl quickly through a 3" flush valve, which moves a lot of water much faster than the old tanks' 2" flush valve. Try to use an old 2" flush valve tank on a well-designed modern bowl (not all are), and it won't punch enough water in there fast enough to make the new bowl operate properly, even if it ultimately dumps a swimming pool of water in there slowly.

So...the real answer is to find something that you like in a Toto line (all work well), or another line known for its quality. Something like the Toto Original Drake with the new traditional-looking tank CST744EN. (Or CST744ELN with the ADA-height bowl.) Or the Toto Soiree (which may have a base you like better). Or a similar-performing toilet from another manufacturer that also works well.

Hope this helps.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Wycnyc]

I have a related question: I have an old house with some original bath fixtures (about 1925) and some fixtures from late 1940's / early 1950's.

I need a new toilet, but all the new models I have seen have such low profile tanks that they look completely out of place with the old sinks & tubs.

Is there any way to attach a new (or at least not as old) standard height (not A.D.A.) bowl with the old wall mounted tank ?

 

[Terry]

I installed this Kohler Tresham toilet in an older 20's home in West Seattle.
The homeowners thought it was amazing. This one does have the taller bowl though, which would work for the original question at the top.

As far as wall mount tanks working with a new bowl? I don't know of any that are set up for that. Toilets tend to be designed as a matching unit, bowl and tank. The old 1920's bowls were designed for a spud at the back to take the pipe from the tank.

They do make some commercial bowls that work with Flushometers, though I have not tried them with a wall tank.

This one had a wall tank and a 14" rough-in sort of.