Basement bathtub drain + roughin install gone wrong ?

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by georgez, Dec 5, 2010.

  1. georgez

    georgez New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Canada
    Does this make any sense (See pics)

    - The bottom of the tub drain piping spirals in
    a counter clockwise 360 degree sloping upwards turn and goes
    down into the basement cement drainoff.

    Can pex tube talons be legally used for copper pipes?

    Is the copper elbow embedded into stud ok?

    Is abs pipe elbow embedded into stud ok?

    Would like any other feedback.
    Thanks.

    Attached Files:

  2. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    Wow...

    Usually the trap isn't poured over with concrete because you can't align it to the drain then...
  3. cacher_chick

    cacher_chick Test, Don't Guess!

    Messages:
    3,248
    Location:
    Land of Cheese
    I would agree with the title of the thread- install gone wrong.
  4. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,052
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The bottom of the tub drain piping spirals in
    a counter clockwise 360 degree sloping upwards turn and goes
    down into the basement cement drainoff.


    Pretty strange. Is there a p-trap buried in the ground that it goes into?
    Normally there is an boxed out area of the concrete that allows for proper placement of the drain.

    Can pex tube talons be legally used for copper pipes?

    Sure, I use plastic talons for copper all the time. They are the same exteiror dimension.


    Is the copper elbow embedded into stud ok?

    Yes, It's done all the time.

    Is abs pipe elbow embedded into stud ok?

    Yes, it's done all the time.

    The pipe on the drain is a worry though. I don't know how that would ever be snaked for hair removal.
  5. Basement_Lurker

    Basement_Lurker One who lurks

    Messages:
    668
    Location:
    Victoria, BC
    Another handyman attempt at plumbing. Almost all of the pex joints are stressed. The tube talons on the copper piping work..but are not the proper installation method for a reason, the drop elbow for the shower arm isn't even screwed into backing, and the drain is a mess as you know.

    You should have this looked at before you close everything up.
  6. georgez

    georgez New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Canada
    Thanks for the suggestions.


    RE: Pretty strange. Is there a p-trap buried in the ground that it goes into?
    -- P-trap was suppose to be roughed in with toilet and sink venting when
    foundation was poured.

    What is the way to unstress the pipes?


    Is this the proper way to go?

    - Definately break the concrete and align the overflow vertically
    down directly into the p-trap under the cement floor instead of
    the "hacked" spiral piping.

    Is that spiral piping compliant to code or is allowed?

    - Plastic tube talons to be replaced with copper straps + brass screws.
    - Drop ear to be screwed into a stud.

    Hopefully everthing else meets code.


    Thanks.
  7. brownizs

    brownizs In the Trades

    Messages:
    196
    Location:
    Springfield, IL
    Ever tried to push water uphill? That is what the tub drain is trying to do.
  8. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,351
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    My best advice is to hire a plumber to straighten out this mess before you go any further. The last place you want a messed up drain is under finished work. Get it fixed now while tearing out will be as minimal as possible.
  9. georgez

    georgez New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Canada
    The handyman comes from a company with a+ bbb accredited business rating and
    business card says licensed plumber.

    Need help please, besides the drain disaster,
    what is the way to unstress the pipes? Thanks.
  10. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,689
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    1. That drain is the most cobbled up mess I have seen in decades.
    2. Your tub drain had better not EVER get plugged up because it will be IMPOSSIBLE to snake it clear.
    3. The "drop ear" elbows for the shower arm AND the spout MUST be screwed to the wood. Those Talons are completely useless to keep it from swiveling.
    3. Pull-ties are also useless to secure water lines in the wall, especially if they have a piece of pipe between them.
    4. If the installer had had a ruler, or even a good eye, he could have installed those PEX lines a lot neater.
    5. the BBB may give him a A+ rating, (that just means he pays his dues and so far no one has complained, or if they did he went back and did it right), but that has nothing to do with his expertise as a plumber. As a plumber, I give him a D- for this
    installation. My initial reaction would be that the tub has to be taken out and the drain
    connected PROPERLY, then the water lines need major revision. It might be that the revisions will be more "expensive" than if you had a good plumber install it originally, because doing it "twice" always costs more.
    6. This might be the time to contact the BBB and reduce his A+ rating.
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2010
  11. georgez

    georgez New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Canada
    It's nice to know its a worse case scenario and cant get worse than that.
    Will get some action done following all suggestions.

    From the image, is that the fix?
    and #2 : should it be a gradual 90 degrees turn or
    should there be a 90 degree "L" tee put on for that
    studded corner?

    Thanks

    Attached Files:

  12. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    The drain is a much bigger issue than the fact that the pex doesn't look pretty
  13. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,055
    Location:
    New England
    Depending on the type of pex used (-a, -b, or -c) and its diameter will determine the minimum bend radius. Other than that, the whole idea of pex is you need fewer fittings since you can bend it around the corners. As long as you protect it from getting a hole in it or binding or kinking it by getting it into too tight a radius, it works. It may not be pretty, but that's okay...generally, it gets covered up and isn't a problem. I would not have used nearly as many fittings and slept well at night.
  14. Doherty Plumbing

    Doherty Plumbing Journeyman & Gas Fitter

    Messages:
    810
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    That plumbing is honestly just very very bad. And no it's not code compliant.

    You need to jack hammer out the drain and redo everything. It's that simple.
  15. Winslow

    Winslow Plumber

    Messages:
    450
    Location:
    Hawaii
    The tub needs to be removed so the cement floor can be chipped out so the drain can be offset to it's proper location. Looks like the "plumber" didn't know the proper place to locate the drain or the proper way to fix his mistake later when setting the tub. If you don't fix it properly now it will never work correctly.
  16. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,689
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    The "revised" water piping looks better, although BOTH drop ear elbows, (there should also be one at the tub spout), AND the valve should ALL be secured to wood framing and not depend on Talons around the PEX to secure them. I hope that is a toilet to the left of the tub, because he also did NOT install that horizontal vent pipe at the proper 42" above the floor height. The requirement is 6" above the overflow of the fixture OR 42" above the floor, WHICHEVER IS HIGHER.
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