Canature safety float and air check reliability (white with upper "V" shaped guide)

[Eljay]

Anyone have experience with this safety float?

I can't find much info on it other than here (post 36628). The pictures in that thread look identical to the one I received. The system should've included a 2310. But, this is what actually arrived. The vendor says it's a Canature part.

 

[ditttohead]

My mom told me, "if you cant say anything nice..." So I will be quiet.

Another example of the online companies in their desperate search to be $1 cheaper than the next guy.

Throw it in the trash, get a Fleck or Clack Safety float.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Eljay]

My mom told me, "if you cant say anything nice..." So I will be quiet.

Another example of the online companies in their desperate search to be $1 cheaper than the next guy.

Throw it in the trash, get a Fleck or Clack Safety float.

Your restraint is admirable, sir; you definitely could say, "I told you so!" I had seen your warnings to be wary of online companies here.

I'm not going to name the vendor yet. I'm trying to work with them to see if they will honor the advertised system including the 2310 and make things right. They've been quite professional and helpful up to this point. I did just run up against some resistance and a flat out lie (or an untruth based on ignorance at best depending on whom emailed me). So we'll see how things turn out.

 

[Jason J]

Been using that very float in brine tanks we have with the softeners we put in and have not had any issues for the past 5 years or so. Everyone has their preferences I guess. The 2310’s do tend to get debris in them too. Use clean salt. That helps any float perform with fewer issues

 

[ditttohead]

LOL, sorry but I was a rep for them and they were terrible. The checking system in the bottom is easily fouled with even the slightest bit of debris. This causes the air check to not seal well and the system will suck air during the regeneration process. the also tend to fall apart during shipping a lot if the brine tank gets a couple good smacks... which trucking companies and UPS never do. Clack and Fleck both put the main components at the top with a well designed air check screening system in the bottom which almost eliminates this problem.

I take tech calls all day long and when I hear "we have airy water... I ask them to send me a picture of the brine tank, 9 times out of ten it is that problem....

this float design has been around for a long time, and it was bad when it came out, it is still bad today. At about 1/3 the cost of a good assembly, I understand why companies use it but... not worth it.

 

[Jason J]

Al, Interesting view but they have been bulletproof for us. The brinewell actually has a design that prevents debris from getting in there.
I get it, you sell Fleck and Clack and that’s why you push their stuff and ask people to contact you direct to sell to them. Makes total sense. We just have not had any significant problems with these or 2310’s. Just my 2 cents. Not trying to sell anything

 

[ditttohead]

Selling a few vs. tens of thousands gives you a different perspective. Also being the rep... you hear all the problems. We don't sell direct, but we do sell to hundreds of companies that use us for drop shipping. We still have access to the junk brine floats, tanks etc... they have a warehouse 5 minutes from us and we could save a few dollars by using them but we chose to not sell them because of the extremely high rate of problems compared to virtually no problems with the Fleck and Pentair versions. We also prefer to promote USA made products when they are available and reasonable so long as the quality standards are there.

 

[Jason J]

Ah, yes those “Made in the USA” products you sell:

 

[ditttohead]

Yup, what a stupid idea.

Or it could also be my 30 years of field experience or running the largest commercial water treatment dealer in the So Cal area for a decade, or the fact that I was a wholesale distributor of the part mentioned above for 5 years selling container loads, or it could just be my bias. Either way, I am ok with that.

 

[Jason J]

Hey Al, who do you know over there again? I asked and no one seemed to know who your were. You mentioned that you were in with the "top brass" there. Just wondering since you're really experienced in the industry. I've seen other middle men out there like Nelsens, Wood Bros., Charger. I have never heard of Impact Water and I have been in commercial, industrial and residential water treatment for 20+ years myself.

 

[ditttohead]

Do you really think this is the place to be discussing this? You are welcome to call me to discuss anytime on the phone. Since their top people change a s often as most people change underwear... I doubt anyone there would know me. I was bringing in C well before they were being imported by Hydrotech and others. As to IWP, just show up to any of the larger trade shows, we are always at them. We will be at the WQA in Vegas, the NGWA in Vegas, and I will likely be at Aquatech Amsterdam and China, lets meet up there. We are great friends with the companies you mentioned and we all cross supply each other, they all know us, we are simply a quieter company. We focus more on contract manufacturing rather than promoting a dealer specific line.

Don't take such offense that I called the float assembly they make a pile of garbage, it simply is when compared to the Clack or Fleck units. Next time you are in California, please feel free to swing by our small humble facility, check out the link, if you stay on the home page the background will turn into a video of our warehouse. https://www.impactwaterproducts.com/ As a company we have only been around for a little under 10 years but we have quickly become one of the largest distributors in the West. With about a million dollars in inventory, and the fact that the vast majority of orders ship the same or next day and technical support that can only be compared to two other companies in this industry...

Also, in case you didn't see, 51% ownership... LOL, no surprise, https://www.canaturewg.com/media

 

[Jason J]

I don’t have a problem discussing this here. Unless you have an issue with it. But that would be odd.

The same guys are there that were there from the start. As far as the 51%, that’s old news. That will also be a great move for their company.

What I find interesting is that Pentair thinks salt free water softeners are worth investing in. I won’t deal with a company that thinks salt free water softeners are a good idea. Or a company that tells their customers they make their systems in the USA when that’s just not completely true. It’s actually misleading. Just like salt free Softeners. Maybe when Pentair sells the Fleck stuff off the new company will improve their presence and designs.

As for being offended about a float assembly. It’s not about that at all. It’s about your approach to this board. You respond to anything you don’t sell as garbage or a cheap knockoff. You don’t even know their product since you don’t sell it and haven’t since some of their newer designs have been out. . None of what we sell is a knockoff of anything. It’s piston driven. That’s the only similarity. You also knock Upflow as marketing hype. Since you have been doing this 30 years you know that’s not true. Upflow does offer legit efficiency advantages. You just aren’t selling Fleck or Clack in Upflow versions so it does not work to your advantage.

You also use this site as a platform to sell your products through your dealers. That should be against board policy. Total hidden agenda. I hope that does not offend you. I have no issue with discussing here. No reason you should have an issue with that either.

 

[ditttohead]

You seem to know my business better than I do . Why would I not sell Upflow? Of course I sell Upflow, I also train on the advantages of Upflow, or downflow, or whatever the companies I am working with prefer I train on. I started in this industry selling the Schurz valve, one of the original automatic softener valves which was an Upflow design. I then witched to the Erie 541 valve, also an Upflow design. My experience in Upflow started in the 80's and I can train either way but I also know the real advantages and disadvantages to both. As to selling through my dealers on this board, again you seem to know much more about me than I do. I know hundreds of companies all over the country, many of which don't buy from us. I recommend many companies that don't buy from me. If a company has a great staff, knowledge etc, and they don't sell junk then I have no problem recommending them. Most of the PM's I get are simply asking if XYZ company is a good company to buy from. If they buy from the companies you mentioned then I basically say yes since the companies you mentioned promote high end quality equipment for the most part, obviously not 100%. We are all beholden to certain limitations.

As to discussing it here, this is a DIY forum, not a political debate forum. While I enjoy debate, it is fairly boring for most people to read and serves little purpose on a forum with this type of format.

As to the "new products" do you really think I don't have every new component that they make in my test facility? Why do you think that I don't have access to all of their newest. latest, greatest? I have my friends in the industry that give me all the new stuff...

As to Pentair investing in salt free... this is internal politics that has been going on in this industry for decades. And when a multi-billion dollar company buys a tiny little company, looking at the numbers, it is insignificant. There is no new water technology that was acquired, it is much deeper than that. Just like when Kinetico bought Nimbus, or Culligan bought US carbon Block recently. No new technologies were acquired, it was far more complex than that.

As to you buying the systems you do, it is all good. Purchasing systems from C is your prerogative. If you feel their ultra low price provides you with higher profitability then kudos to you. We prefer to focus on product lines that are different as you will see in our catalog. We source items from all over the world but when possible we source from the USA, Italy, Canada, Germany, Israel, Australia, etc.. These obviously cost more as labor costs are much higher. Many of our items are manufactured in Mexico, Taiwan, China etc. Labor costs, environmental controls etc. are far more lax if they exist at all in these countries.

If you wish to continue this conversation, please feel free to email, PM or call me anytime.

 

[Jason J]

Al, I appreciate you touting all of what you know and what you have accomplished and how much inventory you stock. This is more about the products. So your "Friends" give you all the new stuff but yet you still call them knockoffs. I think if you were viewing the actual products you would see they are quite different in design. Do multiple companies copy the 5600? Yes, but thats not everything. Maybe years ago that was all they had but they don't anymore and their products are far more advanced than the "USA" companies selling products made in China. In fact most of the issues we have had with Fleck meter assemblies have come from parts made overseas. For that reason we stopped using them. Bad design from Fleck. If any companies are trying to go cheap its Fleck making products in China that fail due to poor QC and Clack making tanks in the past that had horrible tank flange leaks. We still see those today. Complete nightmare from Clack. I'm not saying all of Clack and Fleck stuff is garbage but be fair when "helping" people on here. Fleck and Clack are not what you make them to be. They are NOT totally made in the USA.Not even close. Many parts are made in China. They have issues no more or less than other company designs. Take the Fleck 7000 for example. You had one. I have worked on them. Total junk! And it only got worse when they tried to manufacture it in Mexico.
Not sure why you keep wanting to take this conversation offline. You have not issues with telling everyone what you feel is what is the right product and what is the wrong product. I am just asking you to provide the info to back it up. The Fleck and Clack valves are not made with parts made in the USA and the Canature product line is not a total cheap Chinese knockoff like you have said many times in the past. Its misleading and proves the hidden agenda. Hope I haven't offended you.

 

[ditttohead]

no offense taken just a circular discussion, kind of boring for a DIY forum and more of something that should be discussed at one of my training seminars or speeches. Speaking of, we are having a huge training seminar again in a few months, no date set in stone yet but you should consider attending. It is sponsored by us and a few of our suppliers. Great food, great networking, and topics include commercial, industrial, application and much more. We also have it catered by a good friend of mine, one of the best BBQ's in California. https://www.facebook.com/BerkleysBurgersWingsNQue/