Can a WM EVG 110 be transported horizontally in the original packaging?

[Alternety]

I have purchased a boiler, and the vendor says it will be delivered by a tractor trailer. No way will a tractor trailer get here and drop it a useful place. And then have to back up for 1/2 a mile. They suggest I meet the truck somewhere.

If I can get it into a Honda CRV, it will work. My concern is if there is a chance of damage if I transport it horizontally. Looking at the documentation, it would appear that the packaging is robust and should not put undue stress on anything.

Anyone have experience with this or simply an opinion?

 

[NY_Rob]

I would call the manufacturer and see what they have to say about it...

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Dana]

EVG 110?? Before you take delivery on it (or pick it up) are you dead-sure you're getting the right size?

EVG 70 can manage 19 out of 20 existing houses in the US. The EVG 110 would usually only be appropriate for ~5000' or larger houses, or very leaky uninsulated houses of more conventional size.

Most houses have nowhere near the heat load to need an EVG110, or enough radition to run it in condensing mode without excessive cycling. The EVG 70 & EVG 110 only have a 5:1 turn down ratio, so it matters more than with 10:1 turn down boilers. The minimum output of the -110 in condensing mode is 19,000 BTU/hr, which is fully half my ~2400' 2x4 framed antique home's heat load @ 0F outdoors. The -70's minimum output is a more reasonable 13,000 BTU/hr which is about 1/3 the load at 0F. Even the 13K number needs at least 65' of typical fin-tube baseboard (per zone) to run at condensing temperatures without cycling on/off.

 

[Alternety]

I contacted the manufacturer asking if the boiler could be transported in the horizontal position in the original packaging. Response: look at the packaging to see if it says it is OK. Significant disconnect. I sent a follow up, but probably not a response until Monday. I have the boiler put on hold.

I actually had not looked at turn down ratio. For whatever reason I thought it was a wider range. Maybe the Ultra.

This is a project to replace a failed boiler, some piping issues, and upgrading pumps. I have also had one valve in a manifold go bad. It is constantly on. The manufacturer no longer supplies parts; and, of course, they are proprietary. I may decide to replace 2 10 valve manifolds. I do not want to deal with this again. I particularly don't want my wife to be left with it. I have seen an interesting manifold from CrossManifold. They are quite expensive and require more space than a "normal" manifold. I don't really support their delta cost for each new valve. Basically no connection to cost of goods. Just higher price for little incremental manufacturing cost. They will not fit my space if used horizontally, but mounted vertically it could work. But much messing with converting the existing pex connections from the normal vertical manifold connections to curve nicely into the new horizontal piping connections. Still looking at that. They could be the ultimate manifold. I need to get the pex guy to take a look and see how he feels about the change.

The boiler replacement makes it necessary to pull out a bunch of piping around the old boiler. The new boiler has pipes in distinctly different places.

The building is 6500 ft sq, with heating requirements for other external items. All heating is via pex embedded in concrete. There is a largish buffer tank between the primary and secondary loop. DHW and some other dormant loops are on the primary loop. The boiler I am replacing is an Ultra 105.

I am also moving to smart pumps. They were not ready in time for the original design. One for the path to the buffer tank and one for the secondary loop. The boiler comes with a variable speed Taco. The boiler is much smarter than the previous one. We will need to integrate the boiler, the old Tekmar control system, and the intelligence in the pumps.

My thoughts on the design. Critique/suggestions happily accepted. DHW probably does not need significant modulation from the boiler. The buffer tank also probably does not need modulation from the boiler. Both of those loads can consume a large BTU input, and then stop. This could casue more stop and start actions in the boiler. I really don't know. The smart pump from buffer to the secondary loop will, to a large extent, isolate things from the boiler. Which may not have a whole lot of use for significant modulation. The buffer tank is, in my mind, the resource most likely to want the boiler to modulate. I will see what happens.

 

[Dana]

This is ringing a bell- you've posted before about a failing heat exchanger on the Ultra(?), and have a snowmelt system on the driveway, in a house located in the northern Puget Sound region?

With a massive hydraulic separator or buffer tank between the boiler and heating zones it's much less prone to short cycling issues. At 6500' your house is also one of the, " ... ~5000' or larger houses..." that a ~100K boiler is likely to be appropriate for. At about the same modulation range and turn down ratio, if the Ultra 105 isn't short cycling, the EVG 110 won't either.

 

[Alternety]

Thanks Dana. I am trying hard not to do something wrong.

Design is for the entire site, but less than half in use. I am trying for a balance.

 

[Dana]

Even if you're only using half of, it having the capacity to use all of it is worthwhile. With the pre-existing buffering thermal mass to suppress short-cycling the efficiency penalty for oversizing is miniscule. The up-charge for the larger boiler isn't very much either.

There will be some tuning to do on the reset curve to do, and it may have to be re-tweaked if later you decide to use the whole space, but you should be OK. Observing the cycling behavior in the shoulder seasons while tuning in the reset curve would be useful. If it short-cycles at low output temps you may have to settle for a higher minimum temperature than is absolutely needed for heating the place when the loads are low, but you'd most likely still be deep in the condensing zone.

 

[Alternety]

I really would like to know if it is safe to move an EVG 110 horizontally in the original packing. WM just will not tell me. Neither I nor my contractor has a way to accept a tractor trailer delivery.

A few days remain. It is on the way. The clock is running.

 

[NY_Rob]

Post your question over here to get some more opinions...
https://forum.heatinghelp.com/categories/the-main-wall

 

[Alternety]

I got the boiler. It was supposed to be delivered in a box truck. It was a tractor trailer. The driver had to back out a very long and annoying way. He was wonderful about the situation. We put the boiler into my wife's Honda CRV for a ride to the garage.

Dana, you have spurred another thought. And I appreciate your previous input. It makes sense; and it matches what the system was designed for. I now have a WM ECO 110 in the garage waiting with bated breath to be installed. I got to thinking about the relative boiler capacity vs what I am likely to use. As you note, with the configuration I have, it may not matter.

The ECO 70 and ECO 11o have some different parts. With the mechanical differences (and probably different firmware in the computer) it probably would not work. But I was contemplating just changing an orifice to bring the boiler output down to the 70 version. But that does not seem feasible. Does anyone have an idea if there is a way that I might reduce the output range of the ECO 110 to be closer to the ECO 70 output for the time being. It seems excessive to run the 110 at the full capacity for less than half the total load. But the 110 should still be reasonable to service the house when I eventually have to sell it. Like when I die; my wife will have to sell it. Old engineers eventually wear out. I do understand I will not really care at that point; but I like to be honest about things.

Maybe there is a way with the computer to do something to reduce output. I have not been through all of that in detail at this point. And the computer is rather a black box. But it feels like a good idea.

Anyone experienced with this boiler that can provide some ideas would be appreciated.

A side note of no significance, but a sense of how much fun I have been having. The house I built is about 12 years old. I am now at my 4th boiler, 3rd well pump, 3rd refrigeration unit for the refrigerator, and the 2nd refrigeration unit for the freezer. Arrrgh. I should have put in a bucket on a rope for water (550 ft depth), made a coal fired boiler with a shovel for heating, and bought no more than one day's food. And warm beer. Or our manufacturers could kick out all of the bean counters that shave equipment designs down to whatever will last until you actually try to use them. Maybe for a week or two.

 

[Alternety]

It does not appear that that sort of thing is feasible for the Series 2.