Smoke Test: no smoke, but no go...

[SteveMitty79]

Because it is AC the P-P value for 120V is 120 X 1.414 or 169.68V p-p. Then it is good to add some overhead, so they use a 220V cap for a 120V Controller, And that is what you have.

You can measure the current of the start winding to see if it stuck in run.

And measure run current to see is it ever comes up to speed.

Ok on the capacitor values. Makes sense but you'd think they'd simply rate them accordingly.

Otherwise, measuring currents as quoted is to check the centrifugal switch to see if it's working properly?

Either way, I need another capacitor. What should I get?

 

[Reach4]

Either way, I need another capacitor. What should I get?

That is a tough one. You certainly would not want a capacitor that has a plus sign on it. That would indicate it is a polarized (not AC) capacitor.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[DonL]

Ok on the capacitor values. Makes sense but you'd think they'd simply rate them accordingly.

Otherwise, measuring currents as quoted is to check the centrifugal switch to see if it's working properly?

Either way, I need another capacitor. What should I get?

The relay should be in the controller, No centrifugal switch in the motor that I know of, Just a therm o / overload protector.

The relay will not be the same for a 120V and 240V motor controller, so that may be another problem. The relay is different for different HP motors also.

 

[Reach4]

Franklin AIM manual says they use part number 275 464 137 in the 2 HP box.

 

[SteveMitty79]

The relay should be in the controller, No centrifugal switch in the motor that I know of, Just a therm o / overload protector.

The relay will not be the same for a 120V and 240V motor controller, so that may be another problem. The relay is different for different HP motors also.

No relay included. Just the control box. I'm not using this for automatic service, just the control for manual use.

What do you think of the capacitor spec in the link: 45 uF/440v?

 

[DonL]

Franklin AIM manual says they use part number 275 464 137 in the 2 HP box.

I have a feeling that Franklin and Flotec make their motors different.

Just like the wire Color code changes.

 

[DonL]

No relay included. Just the control box. I'm not using this for automatic service, just the control for manual use.

What do you think of the capacitor spec in the link: 45 uF/440v?

Are you really sure, What was in your drawing ?

I guess I am confused. or I can not read a drawing.

 

[SteveMitty79]

I have a feeling that Franklin and Flotec make their motors different.

Just like the wire Color code changes.

This isn't a flotec pump. It's a flotec wire bundle between the pump and controls to make up the elevation difference.

 

[Reach4]

I have a feeling that Franklin and Flotec make their motors different.

Good point. Looking back at the schematic, it does not look like a familiar design. The relay is not nearly where I would expect in a normal circuit. So maybe trying to compare to Franklin is not productive.

Franklin AIM manual shows winding resistances. If your resistances are not similar, your motor is not similar.

If you bought a new pump, I would go with one with a smaller motor to power with that generator.

 

[DonL]

I noticed the info you posted for the pump you bought says 50 cycle. Is that correct ?

Good Luck. You can make it work.

 

[SteveMitty79]

Then it will not work.

Are you really sure, What was in your drawing ?

I guess I am confused. or I can not read a drawing.

All I received was the control box with the pump. The diagram designates neutral which I substituted the second hot. I superimposed the L14-30 plug to show the power into the box in the first diagram. No relay otherwise.

The second diagram, I simply cutout the motor and superimposed the Flotec wire bundle I spliced between the motor and the control box to keep track of the wiring.

The third is a picture of the box and the final is of the capacitor that came with it. Which I still have, but with the motor bogging down and finally tripping, it leaves me to believe that capacitor is not sufficient. Needless to say the replacement at 130uF/220v is not either since it smoked.

That's why I'm wondering if the spec I linked to previously of 45uF/440v is the correct choice in this application.

 

[SteveMitty79]

***UPDATE***

I read the rating on the original capacitor wrong. I thought it said 220v. It's a 450v.

The replacement I smoked was a 130uF/250v.

Maybe I should have gotten a higher uF rating in the 450v range???

So, from the true 65uF/450v, what could I replace it with to boost the startup?

Or is that sufficient and I should proceed with checking current?

 

[Reach4]

I read the rating on the original capacitor wrong. I thought it said 220v. It's a 450v.

Actually it says 450VAC. It says 50/6o Hz.

Did the popped capacitor say anything about AC? Did it have a + sign?

 

[SteveMitty79]

If you bought a new pump, I would go with one with a smaller motor to power with that generator.

You think the genny doesn't have the power? From previous posts I inquired about, installers who have tested similar installs gave me that power range 5krun/8ksurge to work with.

While on the far end it might be a tad short, it should fire and run the 2hp.

Since I need more gpm, I'd have to stay with the 2hp and upsize my genny if that were an issue.

 

[Reach4]

I quoted the Franklin AIM numbers in post #13.
How far down is your water? How much pressure (PSI) do you need at the surface?

 

[SteveMitty79]

Actually it says 450VAC. It says 50/6o Hz.

Did the popped capacitor say anything about AC? Did it have a + sign?

No polarity indicators. Two double spade connectors.

DiversiTech, 250VAC, 108-130uF.

 

[SteveMitty79]

I quoted the Franklin AIM numbers in post #13.
How far down is your water? How much pressure (PSI) do you need at the surface?

Well is 305 feet. Static water at 180 feet. I don't care about pressure as much as flow. I set this pump at 240 feet. I'd like 15gpm. That's why I picked a 2hp. This is not a pressure system. I will be filling cisterns and containers and pumping from there.

 

[Reach4]

The uploaded snip is from a Franklin V-series, 15 GPM pump. Curves for other pumps should be similar. The head is the number of feet from where you are using the water down to the water level. If you develop pressure, add 23 ft to each 10 PSI of pressure that you need at the surface. For just flowing, you would be having much less than 10 PSI.

So you can pump 15 GPM or so with 1/2 HP if the water is close, and it takes more HP as the water is deeper. The pump for each design is different with deeper pumps having more stages. If you can pick a pump where your operating range is in the shaded area, that is best.

1 HP looks like a good size at 200 ft and still pumps well if the water drops 50 ft.

 

[SteveMitty79]

I noticed the info you posted for the pump you bought says 50 cycle. Is that correct ?

The spec sheet/ad I saved says it's 50 hertz.

I'm going to wire back in that original capacitor and check back later.

 

[Reach4]

Can you try starting with commercial power with the pump in water?

I suspect the voltage rating of the popped capacitor was appropriate. I don't know why it failed.