Please recommend a proximity sensor, some lighting and video

Discussion in 'Bob & Don's Electronics Forum' started by leejosepho, Nov 30, 2013.

  1. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    I recently had a theft from my carport, and I want to add some lights and surveillance since I have no way to lock-and-key everything as a police officer has suggested. So, I need a simple security sensor that can toggle some lights (needed also), a few minutes of video (also needed) and maybe even some audio letting an intruder know s/he is being taped.

    Any suggestions? The sensor, lights and camera can all be mounted at the carport ceiling without being visible from the street, and I will need a switch that can disable everything from inside the house as well as a momentary button to trigger a delay whenever we go out.
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2013
  2. BobL43

    BobL43 DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,786
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Lee, years ago, I used to use some X10 stuff, like their outdoors Infrared motion detectors that will transmit a radio signal, and an indoor thing they called a VCR Commander, which was triggered by that signal and gave out infra red signals like the normal remote to start the VCR recording, which would have a video camera connected to it. It worked great. I still have, but no longer use those items. The X10 radio signal motion detector signal could also be used to do whatever you need, by switching on lights, appliances, whatever. They may still sell that stuff, but there is much newer, higher tech stuff available now, but for mucho money. You can find the X10 stuff on E*B*y* .Check it out. I still use some of the X10 lighting controls for automatic controls.
  3. DonL

    DonL Jack of all trades

    Messages:
    3,815
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    I guess I missed this post, Until Bob got it up.:eek:

    I think the X10 wireless sensors work fine, But the batteries are subject to freeze.

    If you can run a wire to your house then Network IP may be the way to go. Network it for email alert.


    I have cameras that work in the dark, so extra lighting is not required.


    I like Silent alarms they give me time to grab the Shotgun.


    Racking a 12 Ga. Pump gets their attention.
  4. BobL43

    BobL43 DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,786
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    I like the shotgun idea too Don.

    I see the X10 stuff is still available brand new from Home Automation products. The stuff is really cheap to buy and easy to set up, and you don't have to be a network engineer to set it up. If you are good at networking then you don't need this X10 stuff. http://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/?gclid=COyK-OHNmbsCFRBnOgodb2IAGA .
    My batteries wore out when I used those motion detectors after several months or so, but they worked all Winter long on Long Island, NY for me years ago. Colder here than what I see for Little Rock:
    http://www.climate-zone.com/climate/united-states/arkansas/little-rock/ .

    http://www.climate-zone.com/climate/united-states/new-york/new-york-(jfk-airport)/

    Or you can just set up a trip wire to fire the shotgun, like the Swamp people do.:eek::p
  5. DonL

    DonL Jack of all trades

    Messages:
    3,815
    Location:
    Houston, TX

    I do not recommend that Setup but it can be very effective, It should be used for experimental use only.


    Booby traps can only be used if you get a Permit, and Pay your Fees.
  6. BobL43

    BobL43 DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,786
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Booby traps is what that lady in my post under couponing has. Dangerous. I hope she has a permit for them beauties, and they are to code.
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2013
  7. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    Right now I am waiting for packages to arrive, but I have purchased a GE Simon XT security panel that will accept two hard-wired zones along with 38 wireless ones including smoke detectors and such as well as being able to do some automation like controlling the power for a separate surveillance (video) system. And for that, Swann cameras seemed to be the way to go...and I purchased wired cameras (3 for now) rather than trying to sort all the frequencies and possible interference between cameras and my existing wi-fi. A small recorder with a removable memory card comes along with one camera, a 7" monitor comes with the other two and then I found a used Swann DVR4-Net recorder (in need of an internal hard drive) I think could be tied to the Simon. I have spent only about $200 so far, and I was quite surprised to discover a land-line monitoring service that only charges $10 per month. After checking to see how well the cameras do at night, I might add a light with a motion sensor...but giving a thief any kind of lighting to assist either during theft or while trying to get away without tripping over something makes no sense to me! One thing I really like is the Ion sensor that installs in a door jamb, and the Simon panel will have line-of-sight out to my workshop that might help one of those work at about 80 feet.
    SimonXT.jpg IonSensor.jpg Swann01.jpg
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2013
  8. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    Question: Can I parallel my DSL modem with the Simon XT at the RJ31X and include a DSL filter for the Simon (using a separate jack, if necessary) so my internet connection will not be interrupted during a line seizure and the Simon can still perform?
  9. BobL43

    BobL43 DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,786
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Good luck with that setup Lee. Let us know how it all works out for you. And I have no experience with DSL modems, so I cannot comment on that.

    Bob
  10. Reach4

    Reach4 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,926
    Location:
    IL
    If you have line share DSL, only the phone output of the DSL filter will go to the RJ-31X. The modem will parallel the incoming pair and the DSL filter input. So line seizure will not interrupt your modem.
  11. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    I recently found a comparison of cameras that leads me to believe I might need better ones, and we should find out in a few days!

    Yes, my modem and phone connect to the same pair of wires, and with a filter between that pair and the regular phone.

    Yes, that makes sense, and this helped me sort that out:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vr9ZZTCCuY8

    If I bring the TelCo pair to a regular jack near the Simon, I can then connect the modem and a filter for the RJ-31X and Simon, then run from the RJ-31X to the house phones (with their own filters just as before or only with that single filter already in place?*) and still have my "Line 2" VOIP line unaffected by any of that. *Not sure about one filter covering more than one phone, but logic suggests that should work.

    Many thanks.
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2013
  12. DonL

    DonL Jack of all trades

    Messages:
    3,815
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Sounds like a nice project.

    The Swann DVR4-Net recorder is a nice PCI card and has alarm inputs. To bad they stopped making them.

    They are a lot better / faster than the new USB stuff. The server software is nice for remote viewing.


    The off the China Boat cmos camera pickups are a lot alike with different lenses for the Field of view that you want.

    It takes a bunch of IR leds to really work, and the cameras with just a few leds are a joke over 5-10 feet or so.


    Good Luck, I hope you catch a Rat.
  13. Reach4

    Reach4 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,926
    Location:
    IL
    There are two ways of doing this. In the method I suggested, you will only use one DSL filter. It would go between the TelCo line and the RJ-31X.

    Ideally for this method you would use a whole-house DSL filter. The whole house filter will normally be sized to minimize losses if you several phones off-hook at the same time. However many people successfully use a filter designed for a single phone to filter for a whole house. huge_dsl1.jpg

    The other method is to use a DSL filter for each device other than the ADSL modem. huge_dsl2.jpg

    A DSL filter is just a low pass filter that keeps non-DSL loads from loading down the DSL signals and also keeps the high-frequency DSL signals from possibly causing problems in electronic phones etc.
  14. DonL

    DonL Jack of all trades

    Messages:
    3,815
    Location:
    Houston, TX

    I don't think your #2 setup will work, Because the RJ-31X will not handle the wiring that DSL uses.

    Or did I miss something ?


    You sell DSL filters ? lol
  15. Reach4

    Reach4 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,926
    Location:
    IL
    I would agree that #1 is much better. However ADSL is fairly robust, and #2 would work too.There is usually a lot of margin in the ADSL system. Yet I would (and did) suggest the #1 for anybody installing an RJ-31x. Those who don't have 12 dB or better of signal to noise margin would be better off switching to a whole-house filter system. It is cheap and easy for those who have accessible wiring. Anybody putting in an RJ-31x in certainly has the access.

    Since there are two pairs in the RJ-11 cable, you would have to do special wiring to use a common ADSL filter, or you could use a special alarm system inline RJ-31x filter. That should also eliminate the need for the per-phone filters too. We can agree that method 1 is usually going to be the best choice.


    Note the modem signal does not go through the RJ-31x. While you could argue that the contacts in that jack are a potential cause of inter-modulation, the same could be said for other RJ-* connectors if they were to go bad.

    Leejosepho had mentioned the use of multiple filters. The two diagrams show the simplicity of the whole house system, but your point about better ADSL performance margin with the whole-house filter is a good one.

    The install kits for DSL normally included I think 4 filters (one of which had an extra jack in parallel with the input that could be used to feed the modem). People were encouraged to buy more if they needed them. There are many people who have moved to systems that use VDSL without the multiple filters, or cable modems. They will have filters in their junk box unless they have tossed them.
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2013
  16. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    I have quite an accumulation of filters, and I had forgotten about the one with the extra jack for the modem even though I am likely using it at the moment! I will likely try that one as a "whole house" filter and then get a real one if it does not do well. We only have three phones to connect along with the security panel, but one is two-line wireless with an answering machine and the other is a two-line hard-wire system with an extension phone that can somehow access two lines while only being connected to the primary (red & green) pair. So overall, I like the idea of using just one filter so everything downstream can do whatever it does without having to be concerned about the modem signal.
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2013
  17. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    The DVR4-Net I purchased is a self-contained unit with a hard drive, but I did see one of those PCI cards on FleaBad. I have no need to review anything remotely, and I bought this particular unit so nothing would be dependent upon a separate computer. In fact, I think it originally came with its own mouse in the box!
  18. DonL

    DonL Jack of all trades

    Messages:
    3,815
    Location:
    Houston, TX

    Never used the one with the hard drive built in. Is it EIDE or PATA ? You could Yank a drive from a old TiVo.

    The nice thing about the Video Server is that it can upload to the internet. And send your cellphone pictures.

    If someone takes or disables your security system components (First thing robbers go for) you have the video on the www.


    Have Fun.
  19. BobL43

    BobL43 DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,786
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Hi Don, I have an older Swann DVR 8, and I have replaced the hard drive once or twice. It uses an PATA drive with perpendicular technology, designed specifically for (continuous) audio/video recording. It can be replaced with a plain old PATA drive, I guess, but it will be less robust. Last time I needed to replace the drive again, I decided to buy a brand new DVR system which has a 2TB SATA drive, much easier nowadays to find.
  20. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    I read something somewhere saying it could use either PATA or SATA, but the tray that came with this one is PATA on the inside at the back of the drive and then has a different connector of whatever kind at the business end of the tray. I have a stack of used 7200rpm PATAs, so I grabbed a WD-80GB for now...but I might later pull that drive back out and use one of the smaller ones I know I will never use anywhere else after finding out how much of the drive actually gets used for a few hours of recording.

    The video-out on the back of this recorder is the same as a camera connecter, so now I need some kind of converter to get the output into a regular monitor. Also, I called AT&T and asked about an ADSL/POTS splitter for my NIC where the phone line comes to the house, and the enthusiastic young man on the phone says he is sending one without charge. I find it difficult to believe AT&T sends out the stuff their tecnicians install inside the NIC, but we will see what arrives in a couple of days!
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2013
Similar Threads: Please recommend
Forum Title Date
Bob & Don's Electronics Forum Please do not tune this channel... Nov 1, 2013

Share This Page