Newbie here....Want more water from shower head

[Sunseteco]

Hello to everyone. I am new to the forum. I have been reading on this forum for a while on several obstacles I have encountered in my house, and have conquered most of them, haha. But now I have run into a problem and I am looking for some advice and know how. My house has a shallow well and has a very high iron content. I have 3 water filters in my system (2 before the softener and 1 after the softener). Water pressure is ok but has always struggled in our master bathroom, that has a neo angle shower only. I have been reading up on certain things and I have come to an idea....Is it possible or maybe even logical to buy and install a tub filler valve system and use it for a shower only setup. I have tried finding additional info on this but it just keeps eluding me. I have a found a setup that will flow up to 17 gpm. Now I know my pressure in the house is no where near that but I have decent pressure at other faucets so I am sure this idea would be beneficial. I am not concerned about water usage because I do not take long showers. The setup I currently have is a 1 handle from price Pfister and I have replaced the balance valve several times since I bought my house. I know the internals of the valve and balance valve are clean and free of debris so, this setup just does not produce the pressure I want for a shower. So, what do ya think? Possible to do, or a bad idea? Thanks to all.

 

[LLigetfa]

Before you cut into the wall replacing the valve body, run a couple of flow tests. First measure the GPM with the shower head on the arm and then again with the head off of the arm. That should show what GPM the valve body is capable of.

It is possible that the GPM is limited by the plumbing run and not the valve body but that test won't reveal that. You would need to run some flow tests at other points in the system preferably on as long of a run as the shower.

What is the pressure range on your pump and could you not increase it?

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Sunseteco]

access to the valve and piping is already easy. I have a panel that is held in place with a few screws and is at chest height in my closet. I have not performed an actual flow test. Its just a visual test of watching the water flow when turned on 100 percent between different faucets. I am not sure what my pump is capable of or if it can be turned up or down. I have already drained my system and pressure tank. set the charge in the tank to around 75 psi. I adjusted my switch to accommodate that pressure and pressure readings on my gauge down on the T from the pressure tank indicate around 70 psi. This bathroom has the shortest run in the house from my pressure tank and softener setup. It also gets water from a tankless water heater. I am not sure if that makes any difference or not. Lastly, aside from wanting more pressure, I want to get rid of the price Pfister. I don't care for having to change out the balancing valve every couple years and I have never been a fan of the 1 handle setup. Also I wanted to mention....I have a high pressure shower head that I have removed all of the internals and restrictions of that head and I have also drilled out the stem to 3/16" which has helped but still not enough.

 

[LLigetfa]

...set the charge in the tank to around 75 psi. I adjusted my switch to accommodate that pressure and pressure readings on my gauge down on the T from the pressure tank indicate around 70 psi.

That does not sound right. If you have a traditional cycling pressure switch, they normally have a 20 PSI differential between cut-in and cut-out. The charge on the tank should be set at least 2 PSI below the cut-in.

Given that you have three filters inline, the 70 PSI you see at the tank Tee won't likely sustain that pressure after the filters at higher GPM draw. My guess is the line losses will add up long before it reaches your shower valve body. You might want to consider adding pressure gauges inline after the various filters to monitor how much each filter is contributing to pressure loss.
http://www.sharkbite.com/product/pressure-gauges/

I use a single handle Delta Monitor valve on my shower. The rough-in valve body has two ports on it, a larger tub filler and a smaller shower port. I capped the shower port and plumbed the shower to the larger port. My pressure switch is set to 40/60. I removed the flow restriction in the shower head. My shower is the closest fixture to the hot water tank and cold supply so the only line losses are the iron filter and the 3/4" line from the HP tank to it. I have to blow that line out frequently when it builds up with iron. I plan to replace that section of pipe with 1" so as to limit the constriction.

 

[Reach4]

If you put a garden hose thread pressure gauge on the drain for the water heater, you can see how much pressure you have after your filters and the piping to the the WH.

 

[LLigetfa]

The pressure drop would likely be greater at the end of the long run to the shower than at the water heater but at least the water heater should be after the inline filters so that reading would still be of some value.

 

[Jadnashua]

All new shower heads will have flow restrictors in them. It would be really unusual for a shower valve to not be able to output more water than the (single) shower head can output. Now, it is quite possible that the old shower head has some mineral deposits in it that can further limit the flow.

As was said, unscrew the shower head and measure how much water is coming out. If it's more than 2.5gpm, that will provide a head all that it can use. If it's less, there's likely a problem. Think putting your finger over the end of a garden hose...that restriction causes the water to speed up. If the volume coming into the hose is to small, your flow will go down, or, if the shower head lets more water through, it won't speed up as much. Most shower only valves are really a tub/shower valve. Usually, the shower outlet has a smaller opening than the tub, but often, you can turn the valve 180-degrees and use the larger, tub outlet, but for a single shower head, it's kind of fruitless. They usually just put a plug in the the unused outlet.

 

[Sunseteco]

I guess I am just confused...even though I haven't done actual flow tests on other faucets, You can see and hear a higher pressure from other faucets in the house. Pressure from the other faucets in the house are fine except in the shower. All copper lines are 1/2". Since I have gutted the already high flow shower head and this shower is the closest to the pressure tank, doesn't that leave the valve or the cartridge in the valve? I realize there could be a restriction in the line but I don't think that is relevant because the sink beside the shower has good pressure. Perhaps a flow test is in order. A 5 gallon bucket and a stopwatch sufficient?

 

[Jadnashua]

Yes, a bucket and watch should be fine. You shouldn't have more than half the bucket filled in a minute with the shower head on, and might fill it with it unscrewed. As long as what you get with it unscrewed is more than when the head is in place, you have enough volume to make that head work to its fullest. Not all shower heads are created equal. FWIW, a typical tub/shower valve maxes out at around 6gpm with 1/2" supplies. A 3/4" valve can sometimes flow twice that amount, but any new shower head you buy is limited to a maximum of 2.5gpm by federal regulations. That's out of the tub outlet...likely a bit less from the smaller, shower outlet.

Don't confuse volume and pressure. The pressure will be the same, regardless. But, if you don't have enough volume, you won't get the acceleration out of the jets of the shower head. One reason why a rain shower head only dribbles water out is that there is no restriction internal to it, well, it still is limited to 2.5gpm, but there are lots more holes/jets, so the water doesn't accelerate, just 'flows' through the multiple outlets...to get higher speed, you need restriction and enough volume.

 

[hj]

1. It makes no difference how large the pipes to the faucet are, the shower head will only let a fixed amount of water flow.
2. The internal openings on the valve are ALWAYS much smaller than ANY pipe you would use to supply water to the valve.

 

[Jadnashua]

Note that if you have hard water, mineral deposits can clog the jets in a shower head. The solution is to either replace it, or try soaking it in say vinegar overnight that should dissolve most/all of it, depending on how much. Also make sure if there's an inlet filter that it is not clogged.