Global Warming, now Water Shortage

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by Dunbar Plumbing, Oct 27, 2007.

  1. things are changeing....

    Things are defientley changeing before our eyes....

    wether we like them or not.....

    glaciers melting,
    binary messages found in crop circles, ect ect.....

    I suggest that if we all

    just keep stareing into those headlights..

    it will all go away.........
  2. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

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    Figuratively, we can't seem to discern convenience from necessity.
    Did you drive there in an SUV?
    We rationalize indifference with distorted fact, misinformation or political objective.
    I'm not saying driving around in an electric powered tin can will save the world, I'm saying I don't know enough to say it won't.
    I'm saying I can't just turn away from the fact that we spew more CO into the atmosphere now than at any point in Earths history, and many of us are rationalizing it as normal, that it can't have anything to do with global warming, therefore no guilt need be felt driving to the mall in an SUV instead of a slower, less convenient hybrid.
    I'm not educated enough to know, apparently neither are those who are educated, but erring on the side of caution doesn't seem like a bad idea.

  3. Here's mine! Are we going to stop that carbon footprint? I don't think the entertainment industry will hold still though.


    I can see it now; all the green followers are going to stop this, stop all the nascar racing (do you realize how hard it would be stop them?)


    Buying a light bulb, driving a battery won't stop the out of control train. Argue it till the cows come home but I believe the cows got blamed for that as well, something about cow manure and flatuence was contributing to ozone depletion........!


    Gubbament! Stop Him!
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2007
  4. cwhyu2

    cwhyu2 Consultant

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    That was riged deisl too
  5. leejosepho

    leejosepho DIY scratch-pad engineer

    Once experienced, a convenience seemingly becomes a necessity!

    I have read and heard that the energy thus saved and pollution reduced actually get spent and released elsewhere in order to make that savings possible. In other words, it takes what it takes to do whatever we do and we do not run on perpetual motion.
  6. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

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    Slower? Al Gore Jr was stopped for speeding at 100mph in a Prius in California recently.

    Less convenient? It's very much like a Camry in terms of performance and passenger-carrying capability, except it gets about 49mpg (my 3-year average). I can carry 10-foot lengths of pipe and 8-foot 2x4s in it, more conveniently than with a short-bed pickup. I must admit, though, it's a real bitch getting a sheet of drywall in it :D.
  7. Cookie

    Cookie .

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    Grumpy, no SUV here. And, it was an absolute necessity to go. Big sales, lol.
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2007
  8. BrooklynJon

    BrooklynJon New Member

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    Prius

    Funny, I can't get a sheet of drywall in my Prius, either. But it does accelerate like a M.F. from a dead stop, which works for me in my urban environment. On a road trip to South Carolina, I got 48 mpg for the trip while cruising at 90 mph (with my three ladies and all their stuff in the car). Not bad, IMHO.

    As to the comments about the batteries, those are potentially legitimate criticisms. I don't know enough about the manufacturing and recycling processes to know if they offset the reduced pollution, etc. It may be that I'd be better off in a garden variety Honda Civic.
  9. Cookie

    Cookie .

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    Mikey, B. Jon,

    I carry drywall on TOP of my car. Works well, acts like a sail, too, and saves on gas.
  10. Toyota's Green Problem


    Prius gets 48 mpg < > Tundra gets 14 mpg

    This equates to the same strategy as the tobacco companies

    They will help you get hooked on smoking

    AND

    They will help you to quit now as well.

    Either way, they got you right where they want you, spending money no matter what your personal choices are.

    So...wouldn't this mean that if you buy a toyota, you are also supporting a company that defies the regulations of gas conservation?

    Seems to me that would be true.
  11. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

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    Yeah, didn't I see you at Home Depot yesterday?

    Attached Files:

  12. Cookie

    Cookie .

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    Yeah, but imagine what I saved on gas.:p
  13. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

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    Mikey, B-Jon,
    Thats it, I'm getting a freakin' Prius.
    One third the gas and I could still drive like a nut.
  14. Cookie

    Cookie .

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    What do they go for?
  15. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

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    I think the MSRP starts at just under $20K, but the usually load 'em up with options, and some dealers tack on a "dealer premium" or "availability surcharge", so the bottom line could be anywhere up to slightly over $30K, I imagine. When I bought mine the dealer ripoff surcharge was $2K, but because they screwed up when they wrote the contract, I wasn't obligated to pay it. I got the 2nd-from-the-top options package, plus leather seats (which in 2005 weren't available from Toyota), and the out-the-door price was about $27K. I traded in my pickup, which further confused the real price, I suppose.
  16. BrooklynJon

    BrooklynJon New Member

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    My Prius

    IIRC, I paid around 23-24K in December '04 for my 2005 Prius. It had a couple of options which added around $1000 to the price, and I didn't have to pay a markup (I did have to wait 11 months, tho'). Then, of course, there were tax incentives which probably came to around 3000-4000 total, which was sweet. So I ended up paying right around 20k or slightly less.

    You should give one a test drive sometime. It's really surprisingly roomy inside (even though it looks like a stub outside), handles nicely at the 85 mph I routinely drive (just kidding, officers!), and accelerates like all hell up to around 45 mph (electric motors are torque machines). The first 10-15 minutes its on, the engine runs continuously to warm up, and the mileage suffers (25-30 mpg). Once it's warm, it zips along at 40-50 mpg no matter how you drive it.

    Global warming or no global warming, it's a great car, so long as you don't routinely carry drywall around.
  17. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

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    Thread creep alert!

    Jon, I heard something on one of the Prius forums that sounds booogus, but with these techie-gimmick-rich cars, who knows? We all know that most of the wear on an engine occurs during initial startup, when the oil is thick and the engine is cold so clearances are all screwed up. Someone claimed that the Prius has a thermos-bottle-like container in the engine compartment, and when you shut the thing down the hot oil is pumped into the thermos. When you restart, the engine won't run until the hot oil has been pumped back into it. Admittedly, there is a brief, whiny, small-pump-like noise you hear when you shut it off, but this seems a bit far out... I keep meaning to buy the service manual, but times are tough right now.

    I do know that when "the engine runs continuously to warm up", what it's warming up is the catalytic converter. I suspect that as battery technology gets better, they might use 'tricity to keep the converter hot if the engine isn't needed.
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2007
  18. Bob NH

    Bob NH In the Trades

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    Hybrids are particularly good where you do a lot of stop-and-go driving. I think every taxicab and mail-carrier vehicle should be a hybrid.

    They don't provide as much benefit on the highway. I read a report of a test comparing a hybrid with a diesel Jetta for a round trip from Detroit to Washington, DC. The Jetta had better fuel economy than the hybrid.

    I like the idea of the electric cars like the GM Volt (not yet available). It has a range of about 40 miles on battery alone which covers many local stop-and-go trips that use a lot of fuel. However, they might not be attractive in areas where you need a heater to keep the windshield defrosted and to keep yourself warm.

    I continue to believe that global warming will not be all that bad if we adapt to it, as we inevitably will.
  19. Cookie

    Cookie .

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    History channel

    On the History channel tonite it is about Global warming. I am not watching it going to watch something funny, instead. :)
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2007
  20. patrick88

    patrick88 Plumber

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    Thats is what they are good for.


    They use gas for speeds over something like 35 I think. I know Im wrong about the speed but they only use elec. for in city driving and highway is all gas. They need to make something better sooner.
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