electrical plan for Kitchen remodel

Users who are viewing this thread

Rockycmt

Member
Messages
166
Reaction score
1
Points
18
Location
New York Metro Area
Doing a kitchen remodel. I am going to rewire the room with new circuits from my main 200 amp panel. Currently the kitchen is on some shared circuits that I would like to clean up. I am looking for some advise on the layout.

Here is what I will have in the kitchen as far as electrical….
Appliances
Fridge 15 OR 20 Ampere, 115 Volts, 60 Hertz (1/second).
Full Gas range 15 Ampere, 120 Volts, 60 Hertz (1/second).
Dishwasher 15 OR 20 Ampere, 120 Volts, 60 Hertz (1/second).
Small Microwave Small countertop microwave

Counter outlets 6 – 8
5 recessed lights
Under the counter lights
Garbage disposal

I have the ability to run homeruns from the main box. What would be the ideal configuration? I am more concerned about the appliances.

Here is what I think. Feel free to rip it apart..

New circuit for the Fridge
New circuit from the Dishwasher and Stove
New Circuit for counter receptacles and garbage disposal GFCI
New Circuit for all lights.

If you think this is overkill or underkill I would love to hear your comments.
 

Chris75

Electrician
Messages
607
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Litchfield, CT
Here is what I think. Feel free to rip it apart..

New circuit for the Fridge
New circuit from the Dishwasher and Stove
New Circuit for counter receptacles and garbage disposal GFCI
New Circuit for all lights.

If you think this is overkill or underkill I would love to hear your comments.



This is what I tend to do,

fridge, 15amp dedicated
Dishwasher & garbage disposal, 20a dedicated receptacle under sink
TWO- 20amp circuits for the kitchen counter receptacles (per code)
15 amp circuit for lighting.
 

JWelectric

Electrical Contractor/Instructor
Messages
2,608
Reaction score
21
Points
38
Location
North Carolina
Here is what I think. Feel free to rip it apart..

New circuit for the Fridge
New circuit from the Dishwasher and Stove
New Circuit for counter receptacles and garbage disposal GFCI
New Circuit for all lights.

If you think this is overkill or underkill I would love to hear your comments.
This is what I tend to do,

fridge, 15amp dedicated
Dishwasher & garbage disposal, 20a dedicated receptacle under sink
TWO- 20amp circuits for the kitchen counter receptacles (per code)
15 amp circuit for lighting.

Why would you install a 20 amp circuit to the disposal and dishwasher?
Most that I have installed call for a max 15 amp circuit in the installation book.
 

Livin4Real

New Member
Messages
188
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Indianapolis, IN
I just finished up a complete gut and remodel and figured while it was all apart I may as well rewire everything. I went ahead and ran 20a circuits to everything since cost is not a huge difference and who knows what the future may bring eh? I ran seperate circuits for my fridge, dishwasher, microwave. Then two more circuits for outlets and another for lights. Overkill? Maybe but I won't have to worry about future upgrades. Btw, 12-2 is a pain in the ass :)
 

Billy_Bob

In the Trades
Messages
419
Reaction score
0
Points
0
There are a lot of energy "hogs" in a kitchen!

Might want to think about counter-top appliances as well. Things like a convection oven, deep fryer, hot plate, etc.

Look at the wattage on all these things and you will see how they can quickly add up! Then plug in a vacuum while these are on and pop goes the breaker!

It seems to me there are NEVER enough outlets in the kitchen for all the counter-top appliances.

Whenever I get around to remodeling my kitchen, I'm going to to install a subpanel nearby and plenty of fourplex outlets along the countertop, each on its own 20 amp breaker. Then of course the dedicated circuits for refrigerator, dishwasher, microwave, etc.

To find the amperage used for an appliance, go to the following link and enter the voltage and wattage, then it will give you the amperage. (Don't forget that vacuum!)

Use the "Convert Watts to Amps" calculator under "Single Phase"...
http://www.jobsite-generators.com/power_calculators.html
 

Rockycmt

Member
Messages
166
Reaction score
1
Points
18
Location
New York Metro Area
Countertop outlets. I was just reading something that states that kitchen counter outlets have to be on 2 circuits. Is this true? and if so Why?

I know that they have to be GFCIed if near water.
 

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,771
Reaction score
1,191
Points
113
Location
New England
Yes, you need at least 2 circuits for recepticles dedicated in a kitchen...a single item like a toaster or microwave could nearly tap one out, and how often do you have more than one thing working? The code also specifies how far apart (max) they can be. I think it's 4', but don't quote me. If you notice, most things like toasters, electric frying pans, etc., only have short cords, so you don't want to have the outlets too far apart or you may not be able to use it where you want.

Then, most major appliances specify a dedicated circuit, or at least recommend it.
 

Rockycmt

Member
Messages
166
Reaction score
1
Points
18
Location
New York Metro Area
So I am going to have 4 outlets total. 2 on one counter (Sink side) and 2 on the other. Can I set it up so each counter is its own circuit? or Should I mix it? I would not expect to use 2 plug in appliances on the same side at the same time.

Which is more correct?
 

Billy_Bob

In the Trades
Messages
419
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Why not splurge and have 4 separate 20 amp circuits?

And each outlet a 4-plex!
 

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,771
Reaction score
1,191
Points
113
Location
New England
That may not be enough outlets...the code is fairly specific about how far apart they can be.
 

Jar546

In the Trades
Messages
424
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
USA
Website
www.inspectpa.com
Why would you install a 20 amp circuit to the disposal and dishwasher?
Most that I have installed call for a max 15 amp circuit in the installation book.

It all depends on what the size and rating is of each appliance. That is what determines what you need to run.

There are a lot of appliances out there to choose from.
 

Rockycmt

Member
Messages
166
Reaction score
1
Points
18
Location
New York Metro Area
This is an extreemly small kitchen. No outlet will be more than 4 feet apart. I only have 6 open slots in my pannel. So I can not run 4 circuits for the counter outlets. So I guess I will run one 20A circuit per side.
 

Billy_Bob

In the Trades
Messages
419
Reaction score
0
Points
0
If it is a small kitchen, then you are less likely to have a lot of counter top power hog appliances sitting around (and using them all at the same time) like bread maker, deep fryer, hot plate, toaster oven, etc.

So two circuits should be plenty.
 

Rockycmt

Member
Messages
166
Reaction score
1
Points
18
Location
New York Metro Area
I am surprised the Dishwasher does not need to be GFCI. Here are the reqs
------
Electrical Requirements
• This appliance must be supplied with 120V, 60 Hz., and
connected to an individual properly grounded branch
circuit, protected by a 15 or 20 ampere circuit breaker
or time delay fuse.
• Wiring must be 2-wire with ground and rated for
75°C (176°F).


Grounding Instructions—Cable Direct
This appliance must be connected to a grounded metal,
permanent wiring system, or an equipment grounding
conductor must be run with the circuit conductors and
be connected to the equipment grounding terminal or
lead on the appliance.

_______

I figured since it involves water this should be on a GFCI circuit?
 

BurleyMike

New Member
Messages
118
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
SE Idaho
When I did my kitchen I ran 4 20 amp circuits with 3 recepticles on each. Not all of them are near water so I did not have to use GFCIs on all of them. I decided to use GFCIs on them all because water gets all over a kitchen espically when my wife goes nuts cleaning the coutners.

I ran a dedicated 20 amp line to the gas range and fridge. I also ran 14/3 to under the sink, one circuit for the disposal and one for the DW. Both manuals said 15 amp circuit MAX.

I put the lights and vent hood on a 15 amp circuit.

Now when my wife is making a holiday meal she can crank up the fryer, hot plates, blender, and mixer all at once and no tripped breakers. The best part is the fridge no longer dims the lights when it kicks on. This house was quite under wired.
 

Beekerc

IT Consultant / Network Engineer
Messages
94
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Seattle
working with wire

Btw, 12-2 is a pain in the ass :)

tell me about it, not my favorite either. but for real fun, i ran 30A, 10-2 wire for my server closet (because the UPS I want has an L5-30P plug). oy vey!
 

GabeS

Remodel Contractor
Messages
293
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Brooklyn NY
Quick question?

If a circuit only needs 12/2 wire, is it okay to run 12/3 and leave the red disconnected and wire nutted at the outlet and in the panel.

The reasoning is to have more options in the future or if one wire is bad after everything is done, you have a spare wire to work with. Is there any code violation against this?
 

Jar546

In the Trades
Messages
424
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
USA
Website
www.inspectpa.com
Quick question?

If a circuit only needs 12/2 wire, is it okay to run 12/3 and leave the red disconnected and wire nutted at the outlet and in the panel.

The reasoning is to have more options in the future or if one wire is bad after everything is done, you have a spare wire to work with. Is there any code violation against this?


No, as long as the wires are marked for future use and terminated properly.
 

GabeS

Remodel Contractor
Messages
293
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Brooklyn NY
I ask the question because if someone is rewiring their entire house, it probably makes sense to run all 12/3 instead of 12/2 because it is the same amount of work and only costs a little more money. If there ever is a problem in the future with one of the wires(drywaller screws through one by accident or whatever) you have a spare without the need to fish through. Or if someone swaps a ceiling fan for a light fixture and they want to control the fan and light with 2 different switches, the wires are there.
 

Jar546

In the Trades
Messages
424
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
USA
Website
www.inspectpa.com
For an entire house, the cost would be much higher than you think. In addition, you will have to preplan the box sizes in order to stay compliant with conductor fill for the additional wires.

Also, if the jacket of NM cable is puncture severely enough to cause one of the wires to break then the whole thing needs to be replaced or a junction box if it is an accessible area.

I am all for running 14/3 to fixtures from switches as long as you also preplan by installing ceiling fan rated boxes just in case.
 
Top
Hey, wait a minute.

This is awkward, but...

It looks like you're using an ad blocker. We get it, but (1) terrylove.com can't live without ads, and (2) ad blockers can cause issues with videos and comments. If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads.

If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. We might be able to do something about it. Thanks.
I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks