Brass lavatory drain conundrum

[dujour]

Hello,

I am replacing the sink in my 1940s vintage bathroom. Previously the PVC P-trap was connected to the drain pipe with a no-hub coupler. This was partially hidden behind the sink pedestal, but it was still pretty ugly. The new sink is a wall-hung unit which will expose the plumbing entirely, so I want to replace everything with chrome plated brass.

My question is, how can I connect the tail piece from the trap to the existing brass drain pipe in a reasonably aesthetic way? Can I use a die to add threads to the 1 1/2 nominal pipe (1.9" actual outside diameter) to take a slip fitting ring? Is there an easier way?

Here's a picture. The whole area will be tiled. The iron pipe and caps are just temporary.



As you may be able to see the pipe was cut off fairly roughly. I don't think the sink I just took out is original.

Thanks!

 

[Jadnashua]

This might work for you http://plumbing.hardwarestore.com/51-284-drain-metal-couplings/double-slip-coupling-642704.aspx . It appears that they sell a washer to adapt to 1-1/4" that you could substitute at one end, or just buy a 1-1/2" trap assembly.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[dujour]

This might work for you http://plumbing.hardwarestore.com/51-284-drain-metal-couplings/double-slip-coupling-642704.aspx . It appears that they sell a washer to adapt to 1-1/4" that you could substitute at one end, or just buy a 1-1/2" trap assembly.

Yes, thanks, I was actually looking at that part or something very similar in the store yesterday. The problem is that while the body of the part is chrome plated brass, the nuts are rough galvanized steel. Though I suppose I could find chrome nuts somewhere...

I'm still curious to know if there's another way to do it.

 

[Jimbo]

Rather than extend out from the wall with a coupling, see if you can find a sweat adapter to solder to the pipe. That keeps the coupling nut close to the wall, and the whole thing can be covererd up with a bell escutcheon. Any yes, you can also find bright chrome coupling nuts. Main thing here...you can't do your shopping at blue or orange. They don't have what you need.

 

[hj]

That 1.9 dimension is troubling, since that would be "iron pipe size" brass pipe, but your picture implies that it is copper tubing which should be 1.625 o.d. If it is copper then there are solder adapters, and other means, to convert to the 1 1/4" chrome tubing. If it IS a piece of brass pipe, and the installer did not solder the threads into whatever is in the wall, it should unscrew so you can insert a new piece with threads on both ends.

 

[dujour]

Rather than extend out from the wall with a coupling, see if you can find a sweat adapter to solder to the pipe. That keeps the coupling nut close to the wall, and the whole thing can be covererd up with a bell escutcheon.

That sounds promising. Something like this?

Any yes, you can also find bright chrome coupling nuts. Main thing here...you can't do your shopping at blue or orange. They don't have what you need.

You can say that again! The black iron nipples and caps in the picture above are a testament to that... The "orange" I was at yesterday had no 4" nipples in anything but iron.

 

[dujour]

That 1.9 dimension is troubling, since that would be "iron pipe size" brass pipe, but your picture implies that it is copper tubing which should be 1.625 o.d. If it is copper then there are solder adapters, and other means, to convert to the 1 1/4" chrome tubing. If it IS a piece of brass pipe, and the installer did not solder the threads into whatever is in the wall, it should unscrew so you can insert a new piece with threads on both ends.

Interesting. I assumed it was brass but I guess it could be copper. The O.D. is 1.9" and the I.D. is 1.6". So the pipe walls are quite thick. I know there are other brass (or copper?) drains in the house.

Here is another picture. You can see where I scratched it a few times, and it does behave like copper, but then again I've never tried to scratch a 60 year old piece of brass so maybe it looks like brass too...



Am I correct in assuming that the sweat-on copper fittings I liked to above would not fit this pipe?

 

[dujour]

Ok, so I can see where the drain pipe screws into the vertical pipe behind the wall, and it is a threaded pipe connection. It's hard to tell whether it is soldered or not but I am assuming it isn't. So I think that gives me the following options:

1) Unscrew existing brass/copper pipe. Use new 1 1/2" brass nipple to a female Desanco fitting like this Watts 1903:

The problem with this is the protrusion from the wall is determined by standard nipple lengths, and it's possible the fitting will protrude out too far to be covered by an escutcheon.

2) Unscrew existing brass/copper pipe. Use a length of 1 1/2" copper pipe with a sweat-on pipe thread adapter like this on one end

and this on the other

and then a male Desanco fitting like this Watts 1902:

The advantage of this is I can make the length exactly what is required to put the Desanco fitting flush with the finished wall.
(I could also do something similar with the supply fittings and use a compression angle stop, rather than using 4" chrome nipples and IPS angle stops.)

3) Buy/rent a die head and 1 1/2 NPT die, and put threads on the existing drain pipe, and attach the female Desanco fitting above flush with the finished wall.

Opinions?

 

[dujour]

Oh, I guess I also have the option of doing something like #2 above with PVC.

 

[Plumber Jim]

Yes, you could remove the nipple and use a pvc male adaptor and a short piece of pvc and a trap adaptor or a trap adaptor that glues inside a hub.

 

[Cacher_Chick]

3) Buy/rent a die head and 1 1/2 NPT die, and put threads on the existing drain pipe, and attach the female Desanco fitting above flush with the finished wall.

Opinions?

Given your dimensions and the fact that it is copper or brass, threading it to IPS is not gonna work. I would take a look in the wall to see if it is threaded at the other end.

 

[dujour]

Given your dimensions and the fact that it is copper or brass, threading it to IPS is not gonna work.

Why do you say that? The dimensions match 1 1/2" schedule 40 pipe exactly...

(Maybe I should remove that brass piece and sell it -- brass schedule 40 pipe is >$100 a foot new!)

 

[Cacher_Chick]

Why do you say that? The dimensions match 1 1/2" schedule 40 pipe exactly...

(Maybe I should remove that brass piece and sell it -- brass schedule 40 pipe is >$100 a foot new!)

Oops, I misread my chart. Your entire DVW system is probably copper. You could recycle the whole works!! <grin>

 

[hj]

The second picture is clearer and it is a brass pipe. Unscrew it from the fitting in the wall, get a new steel nipple which will extend to within a 1/2" of the wall's surface. THen screw on the trap adapter so it is actually partially in the wall. Then the flange will cover it easily. The brass nipples at HD are with the copper flare and compression fittings on a wall rack, not with the steel fittings.