Reference thread: when not to DIY.

[Geniescience]

Reference: when not to DIY.

1.) Sometimes it may be best to decline to comment.

2.) Sometimes it may be best to say that the person asking would be better off using a professional. There are a few good reasons for that.
2.a.) Sometimes it may be best to say that the level of detail they are asking for is what you wish they left to the professional, and that general information about their options is still a subject.

Comments welcome.

 

[lars]

Good points. My wife would agree with you.
It is not always easy to get a pro to take on the small projects. Experience and expertise do cut down on frustration. I do appreciate the input on this site to know when to quit.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[hj]

pros

A real pro will take on a small project. I have had to cut off refill tubes that were into the overflow too deeply, and push the reset button on garbage disposers, and/or remove objects from them. It makes no difference whether the job takes 15 seconds or 55 minutes, the cost to the customer is the same.

 

[lars]

re hj

I am impressed with you diligence but not all pros are the same. I find small projects are not taken on, get up charged to discourage hiring or wait many months. I asked 2 builders who I trust( very important) to remodel my bathroom. No takers. Basically , I read , watch others and take on what I am comfortable with. The down side is time. What would take someone with experience 10min takes me 10 hours, but at least I understand the function and proper maintenance of a piece.
I do appreciate input from this site to guide my decisions. Experience is very important.
That said, I am having custom cabinets made at great expense because I do not have the tools nor time to do that.

 

[Frenchie]

By and large, builders aren't remodelers, and remodelers aren't builders. It might seem like it's all just "construction", but they're actually very different business.

Aside from that, there's a question of scale.

I wouldn't presume to take on a 5-million-dollar renovation; but the guys who're set up for those big projects, would lose their shirt trying to do small bathroom or kitchen jobs.

The margins are different, the general conditions are different. They're used to an empty house, I'm used to working in occupied houses. They're systematized to build the same bathroom 50 times in a row with maximum efficiency, I'm set up to build something different each time, in close consultation with the individual client. They have large admin overhead, I have almost none. And so on...

Similarly, the plumbers who specialize in new construction, don't do service calls; but there are other outfits, who specialize in service calls, that do nothing but smaller jobs, all day long.

You just need to find the outfit that does the sort of work you need done, and not bark up the wrong tree.

 

[GrumpyPlumber]

A real pro will take on a small project. I have had to cut off refill tubes that were into the overflow too deeply, and push the reset button on garbage disposers, and/or remove objects from them. It makes no difference whether the job takes 15 seconds or 55 minutes, the cost to the customer is the same.

Most of my work is small, frankly, thats where the money is.
Things like faucets, toilets, pipe bursts, shower valves and water heaters.
Boilers and remodels are the big end for me..I actually shy away from new GC's (building a repore with the right GC's is time consuming...finding the right one is a gamble)...the small stuff is less headaches, paperwork and I get home without having to worry about stock lists, calling suppliers and most of all, deadlines.(the family life doesn't mix well with 14 hr days)

 

[lars]

re frenchie

You are 100% correct. I live a rural area and I have seen people burned and I have been burned. I am always on the lookout for someone you is into small projects but have not found one.
I have hired plumbers etc plenty when I am not comfortable with something. I am not a pro but I like working on projects. I also look where I can get into trouble and seek advice when necessary. I am always trying to learn and it is more fun doing projects that engage me. There is always a balance. I like this site because people will offer their advice.

 

[Kordts]

The reason DIYer's leave a bad taste in my mouth is that I have to fix stuff done by non-plumbers on almost a daily basis. I am sure there is plumbing installed properly by DIYers, but I don't see it. Probably because it was installed properly.

 

[GrumpyPlumber]

Got a call last night, guy had ripped out his ceiling because there was a bad leak and he wanted to expose the problem.
He'd deduced that it had come from somewhere around the closet drain.
Turns out he was right, the leak had come from the flange...went upstairs and discovered the toilet had been secured without the metal washers..in other words, the toilet was had been secured by the plastic clips for the trim caps.

He'd ripped out a ceiling to learn this.
One of those jobs where you hate to ask for the check.

 

[Geniescience]

example of one response to a DIY from another participating member:
(excerpted from another thread started earlier this month.)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Forgive me, but from the questions you ask, I think you are too much of a novice to take on this project alone. There are several places where you could go astray, leaving you with some real problems. I suggest you contact a licensed plumbing contractor to at least advise you on this job.

 

[GrumpyPlumber]

example of one response to a DIY from another participating member:
(excerpted from another thread started earlier this month.)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Forgive me, but from the questions you ask, I think you are too much of a novice to take on this project alone. There are several places where you could go astray, leaving you with some real problems. I suggest you contact a licensed plumbing contractor to at least advise you on this job.

I think I recall that one and surprisingly it wasn't me (er...I think)...sometimes sugarcoating leads to more trouble down the road.
In my experience you're best to get the "ugly" stuff right out in the open at the start...but then insult doesn't help either....VERY difficult to interpret the subtleties online without verbal inflection or tone.
I.E....hearing a moderator tell me my posts are too leng, and no-one wants to read them, after reading them I realized I coulda written "War and Peace" with all that text...no insult taken.

 

[Geniescience]

Many people do get the big stuff out in front right at the beginning. (Occasionally someone is offended, and I've even seen one or two people pick an issue with the tone of a message.)

Yes sugarcoating is a source of problems too. The impact is too weak to work. As you say the message doesn't have any impact.

An expression in Hungary i think is, "if three people tell you you are drunk, it is time to go lie down." Meaning take a break, call off your plan, stop what you are doing. So whether the message is tactful three times or blunt three times, the clear thing is three. Three. Three. When you've heard something three times, you have heard it three times. Until then, you haven't heard it three times.

So sugarcoating can work, when the core message is restated by another person later. That is the advantage of a forum.

david

 

[GrumpyPlumber]

So sugarcoating can work, when the core message is restated by another person later. That is the advantage of a forum.

david

"Sugarcoating" was in referrence to talking to customers, however -
My secret agenda for coming here revealed...
Maybe there's a parellel to real life there, food for thought...(just don't tell the mrs...three times is mimimal in that case...nyuk nyuk nyuk)
Certainly a good thing.