Pressure valve flooding house

Discussion in 'Water Heater Forum, Tanks' started by Melissa2007B, Jan 17, 2012.

  1. Hackney plumbing

    Hackney plumbing Homeowner

    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Alabama
    I personally would never insert a relief line INTO a floor drain. The floor drain could back up and clogg the relief pipe. Not likely to clogg it but possible depending on what backed up from the drain.

    If a hack from sears or lowes installed the heater she would be golden as far as liability coverage......wouldn't you think MASTER Mark? Those guys are licensed and bonded,they are just plumbers subcontracting through the store.
  2. here is a Typical SEARS installation in town


    anything you can do to keep a flood from happenning is very wise.....

    if you can insert the t+p down slightly into a floor drain,
    I would suggest you do it.. I am not talking about cramming it down into
    the bottom of the trap here....

    the odds of a floor drain backing up and stopping up the t+p pipe is
    close to impossible, or you can always give it an air gap of an inch above
    the drain .
    ...... whatever you feel is best....

    this is a common practice and it should be done over just putting the t+p
    into the water heater pan and pipeing it over to a drain... the pan can be
    over-whelmed by the sheer volume from the t+p ...
    I know this from one I was involved in just last week
    My own personal experience with a flooded pan
    :mad:

    I dont know when or whom did the work, or how long ago it was done either
    so everyone will be heading for the hills looking for a rock to hide under if
    she trys to turn it into her insurance.....that you can depend on....

    here is one we tore out from Sears just on tuesday...this unit is about two weeks old...basically brand new..

    there is no pan, no floor drain, no thermal expansion tank, the shut off valve cannot be gotten to behind the heater... this Sears unit also had the crapppy honeywell valve on it.

    this was installed by a SEARS sub-contractor....
    so would Sears have to pay the bill if the t+p valve
    flooded this home ??? yes or no??

    do you think would it have been wiser to pipe the t+p
    over to the laundry drain about 5 feet over ?????

    so what would you do to think
    would make this a better install.????.

    click to enlarge.
    ..[​IMG] aint this something to be proud of??



    Last edited: Jan 18, 2012
  3. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,359
    Location:
    New England
    From what I hear, the rules on terminating the T&P valve's outlet have changed in the recent code books, so check carefully when installing a new WH. I gather from comments here that people don't think much of the Taco WAGS valve, but personally, I think it is a good idea - if water builds up to about 1/2" in the drain pan, it shuts both the WH and the water supply off...unless the tank has a catastrophic split, no floods. It's totally mechanical, no power (except the built-in switch to control the WH firing), and uses the same tech as the autoinflaters on a lifevest used in airplanes - a disk disolves when wet and a SS spring closes the water valve.
  4. wags and taco


    the Wags is a one shot wonder,
    once it gets wet, its over and you have to intsall a new one
    I dont even know what they are worth, but they are not too popular

    the t+p valve could barely weep a small stream and
    trip this mechanism to go off.....

    as far as the code goes, pipeing the t+p to the floor drain
    is ok as long as their is an air gap...or it is laying on top the drain..

    at least a dozen times we have gone out to homes where the water
    heater was on the second floor and the t+p pipe was hanging in
    mid air 5 inches above a 3 inch pvc cup that was used as a floor drain.
    Normally, they are sunk and flush at the floor level so the pan could go into it also...
    ..
    the t+p blew and half the water hit the drain
    and the other half sprayed everywhere and flooded the home.
    I feel its best to err on the side of caution and have that pipe
    inserted into the drain and zipped tied off so it cant move.

    I do whatever I think is best for the situation
    that is presented to me to protect the property
    from serious damage.
    ..

  5. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,359
    Location:
    New England
    It takes about 1/2" of standing water to trigger a WAGS, but as far as I know, yes, once triggered, it must be replaced. In theory, it could be reset, but I've not looked into it. A little weeping into a pan should not be enough to trigger it unless the drain is plugged and it accumulates. What's worse, replacing it or maybe thousands of dollars of damage if it leaks all over. Plus, if the tank leaks faster than the fill, the burner could create other problems...but, if it is disabled, all's better. Think of it as an insurance policy.
  6. Hackney plumbing

    Hackney plumbing Homeowner

    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Alabama
    I use 1.5" sch 40 pvc for my pan drains with a combination wye&1/8 bend near the outlet of the pan with a 2' stub of pipe vertical. I pipe the relief line indirect no more than 6" into this vertical riser off the pan drain.

    The thermocouple adapter that the wags valve uses is useful for trouble shooting water heaters under load.
  7. ST1300Rider

    ST1300Rider New Member

    Messages:
    23
    Location:
    South Carolina
    How to prevent massive H20 leaks...FloodStop Valves.

    I am very sorry to hear of your flood.

    I had one w/a washer that kept filling.

    The thing going forward is how to prevent these super unknowns.

    I use FloodStop valves(electric ball solenoid) on all my critical interior needs(fridge; eBidet and whole whouse water filter in my closet) and I don't worry about those...

    FWIW...here is the link.


    http://www.safehomeproducts.com/shp...&f=N&tp=120740&frompg=99&topg=99&menupage=975


    It uses a sensor plate and when a drop of H20 hits it...it closes the water supply to "x"...ending the flood.

    Hope it helps and again; sorry to hear about your dilemma.
  8. that is a nice alarm valve

    those look pretty nice.... for 150 bucks that is not too bad
    just put the sensor plate down in the bottom of the pan.
    and it has an alarm and shut off...

    this is much, much better than a wags valve...:cool:

  9. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,359
    Location:
    New England
    And what happens if this occurs while the power is off? Nothing...the water still flows. WAGS, it stops. Do you have any personal experience with a WAGS valve that jaded your thought? I've not used either, so am only looking at the 'features'. I'd really like to know.
  10. Hackney plumbing

    Hackney plumbing Homeowner

    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Alabama

    I agree the wags valve is the most reliable way to stop the water flowing to a water heater incase of a leak.

  11. I have not read the specs on either,
    but it would seem that not having to plumb the wags valve into the water system in the bottom of the pan gives the flood safe valve a distinct advantage...

    I have not looked at the specs, but I thought the flood safe valve also had a battery back up to it... but maybe not ,???

    I also like the other feature that it can be a whole house shut off and it can also be incorporated into the alarm system for the home...... that also seems like a good feature...

    I have not installed either one but if I had to choose one over another I would gamble on the flood safe,

    the oddds that a power outage and a water heater failure at the same time seems rare
    and i would be willing to take that chance...

    perhaps someone ought to buy a wags and see how difficult it is to plumb and install into place.... I have NEVER EVER even stumbled across one in 40 years... that is how un-popular they are in this area..


    thats all I got to say about that



    [​IMG]


    Last edited: Jan 31, 2012
  12. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,359
    Location:
    New England
    Plumbing it is pretty simple...run your supply down into the pan where you've located the valve, then back up to the WH inlet. It's your choice if you want to then use the internal switch to disable the burner if it trips. You're done. If it does get enough water in the pan, it trips (about 1/2" if I remember).

    You could use that switch to trigger your alarm system as well, if you wanted.
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2012
  13. I am good with either system... but I dont think that
    there is gonna be a run on either one any time soon.....


    I could certainly see more applications for
    the flood safe system in high rise condos ect.


    If someone wanted the extra safety and security
    I would probably show them both and let them choose
    ...

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