Home owners changing there mind.

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by got_nailed, Oct 1, 2007.

  1. got_nailed

    got_nailed DIY Senior Member

    I have to finish out a house next week and the homeowners had a “plumber†come in and look at the house.

    1- They don’t like that the house has (2) 2†vents in the roof. The plumber is telling them that I should have done it in one vent.
    2- The plumber has talked them in to saving money by getting the cheap big orange water closets, tubs, sinks, and all the futures.

    I had to special order everything they wanted for the house. One of the tubs they got will not fit the hole. The water closets have the wrong off set. The sinks are smaller then the holes in the counter tops.

    I talked to the GC and told him that I will never get rid of the stuff they ordered and that it will be a thousand or two to ship it all back and for the restocking fees. I have told him all of this and I have not gotten a replay back form him yet. I did show him all of the good legal stuff in the contract that they singed. I also told him that if I don’t get it done next week it will be 2 or 3 weeks before I get back out there.

    What would you do?
  2. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Marin Co. Ca.
    Do You have a written contract? Looks' like You've already lost control of this job!
  3. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Cave Creek, Arizona

    1. Special order stuff gets collected for before it is ordered, period.
    2.To avoid #1, the customer furnishes all fixtures, and is responsible for all warranty work on them other than installation problems.
    3. When the proper fixtures are furnished, and the sinks installed, then the plumber will connect them.
  4. got_nailed

    got_nailed DIY Senior Member

    The GC is the one that lost control of the whole house. The home owners now want to save money and its way to late.

    It dose not mater to me about what I install at this point if it’s the stuff I ordered or the stuff they got. If I don’t get paid any more money on this I’ll still be at a profit.

    They are mad about everything trying to get people to fix stuff this is not broken or has nothing wrong with it. There after everyone that worked on the house. On there quest to save money they have hired there own professionals to nit pick the house; apart looking for anything to bitch about. I asked to meat the plumber that they had to look over the job and they will not tell me who it was so I could talk to him. The way it sounds they had a handyman come in and look it all over.

    The granite counters were cut for oval sinks and now they want round. There will be a 1†gap on each side.
    The one tub was going to be a whirlpool but now it is a standard tub that will have a gap of 4†on one side and 6†in length.

    I don’t think stuff like this will even pass the occupancy inspection or will it?
  5. statjunk

    statjunk DIY Senior Member

    Sorry to hear about this. Seems like they should have built the house themselves if this is the route they are going to take.

    Hopefully you won't need a lawyer.

  6. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

    Licensed Grump
    If the inspector passed your work, your free n' clear - it's in writing.
    I got these alot when I was starting out, I'd make the mistake of taking remodels/additions that were run by the homeowner who thought they'd cut out the middleman (the GC).
    I won't do it anymore, for the reasons you're stating.
    I've had situations where a homeowner decides to completely alter locations after the rough is done, then attempt to tell me it's my responsaibility to change my work free of charge.
    From the outside looking in, plumbing seems like it's "just some pipes" to most who've never done the actual work.
  7. got_nailed

    got_nailed DIY Senior Member

    I just got off the phone with the GC and he is faxing me some papers that should say to install as it was contracted. I was looking at his contract that says that any changes would be made in righting through the GC. He hasn’t heard form the home owners and is not going to deal with there s***.

    He has talked to all of his contractors to just do the work as contracted. If they show up and get in the way to call him and to pack up and walk off the job. If needed to call the police. He did say that he has the rest of the money off the bank to pay us all off and not to worry about it.

    I have been doing all of the plumbing for this contractor for 2 years so I don’t think he will try to screw me. The only thing I’m thinking about now is my name.
  8. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Cave Creek, Arizona

    If they are going to badmouth your name there is nothing you can do to stop them, regardless of how many hoops you jump through. My biggest concern, if i were to furnish the fixtures, is that they will have a "problem" with one of them every couple of days, until the one year, (two years here), warranty period is up.
  9. got_nailed

    got_nailed DIY Senior Member

    My name comes off a joke; I got hit by a # 8 in the hip. It was shot out of a bun and it went into the bone. And you know the name stuck…

    If the home owners furnish anything where I’m at you have the right to make them sign away the warranty for the whole job.

    But if I don’t hear anything off the GC by Thursday then I’m using everything I ordered (as contracted) and will not use anything they just bought for the house.
  10. Mort

    Mort New Member

    These people sound like you should be preparing yourself for a lawsuit in the future.....either construction defect or breach of contract (doesn't matter if it's valid or not). I'd make sure all my documentation was in perfect order.

  11. File A Pre- Lien Notice

    I dont know what your state is like but in Indiana

    you must have the "pre-lien notice" written in your
    contract or you are sailing in very rough waters.

    in our state indiana if you dont have the pre-lien notice
    information written in the contract and the house is being
    built for a customer, and it is not a spec home,

    you are basically just trusting the builder to pay you

    but if he dont, and you never filed that pre-lien notice information with the home-owners.....

    you cant file a lien on the home-owners for your money...

    this law sucks pretty bad but it is intended to protect the homewowner from dis-honest builders....

    and it screws the subs who dont do their home-work...

    have been where you are....

    its every man for himself......

    find out what your rights are before the crap
    hits the fan

    dont trust anyone.....
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2007
  12. got_nailed

    got_nailed DIY Senior Member

    I do pre-lien notice on every job.

    I did go back through my contract and the contract that I singed off the GC and I’m good to go. I did fax everything over too my lawyer and he will get back with me in the morning.
  13. Get a video camera

    Or sound recorder

    Or camera phone

    And when the meeting between them and you gets confrontational, talk to them like the ball is in your court, basically "bait" them in admissions verbally that knowingly goes against your signed contract.

    Your state might not allow voice recordings without prior permission but I guarantee you that it is fuel for the fire and there is none of this "he said/she said" nonsense; the voice recorder gets it all. You can voice record in any state......just might not be admissable in court if it leads to that....but still it is a very resourceful tactic.

    I used one a couple years ago on a guy I knew possibly might give me trouble and he did.

    I taped our conversation the day it went to blows trying to say I didn't tell him all the circumstances of the job.

    Well, talk about catching a bear in a bear trap, it worked! :)

    "Sir, I want you to listen to something real quick and you tell me what you think."

    I played our conversation stating exactly the circumstances of the job.....he hung up halfway through the voice recording......never heard from the SOB ever again. ROFL!!!! Gotcha!
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2007
  14. got_nailed

    got_nailed DIY Senior Member

    My lawyer and the GC are saying to just do it by the contract so that’s what I will do. I work for the GC and he works for the homeowners. If it goes to court it will come down on the GC. If I install the crap they want now it will be a breech in my contract which comes back on me.
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