Harden Shower Diverter Stem

[xehumph]

Our Harden diverter does not divert. The handle just unloosens the splined stem when turned counter-clockwise and the handle and splined inner shaft screws all the way out of the valve. I found a previous post here from 2012 about how to remove the entire cartridge. In that post, there is a mention that the stem is stuck in place and will not turn. There's a mention that this splined shaft is normally epoxied into it's threaded location in the cartridge. That post notes that it's probably red epoxy.

My problem is different in that the splined shaft DOES turn but it isn't turning the cartridge to change the diverter position from tub to shower. Instead, I assume the epoxy must have broken loose and the shaft just unscrews when turned counter-clockwise. My question is:

Before doing anything else like trying to remove the entire valve/cartridge, should I first try to re-epoxy the splined shaft back into its mating threads? I can do this without removing anything else. I'm thinking of using red thread locker like maybe red JB weld. I think I'd just coat the threaded part of the shaft with the epoxy and screw it back in and then wait a day before trying to turn it counter clockwise. I'm hoping that even if the valve is stiff, with the epoxy replaced, maybe the valve will turn to divert from tub to shower.

I think the worst that could happen is that the epoxy might again break loose because the valve may be too tightly stuck. In that case, I'll have to do plan B and try to remove the entire cartridge using the 2012 post as a guide. The best would be that I get the valve to operate and maybe I can free it up enough that it won't re-break the epoxy bond when turning it.

My guess is that what occurred is that when our kids lived here they always used the shower, never the tub. Years ago they moved out. Maybe sometime later someone, maybe my wife, tried to move the diverter from shower to tub (counter-clockwise) and the epoxy bond broke because the valve had not been used for years. We have now just recently discovered that it doesn't work because no one has used that tub/shower for years.

Any comments? Should I try re-epoxying?

 

[Breplum]

Epoxy tends to not stick to old, hardened epoxy. So, remove as much residue as possible, first.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[xehumph]

Thanks for your comment. I cleaned the threads up and am going to use red Locktite.

Before I epoxied it, I wanted to make sure the handle could be removed from the stem so I tried to loosen the setscrew and ended up just kludging up the hex and now the correct allen wrench just turns without loosening. I had used solvent, heat/cool cycling, tapping, etc. but nothing worked. I may get some left-hand drills and easy-out to try again to get setscrew out

Or, I could just redo the epoxy right now and if it holds and turns the diverter from tub to shower, it would be ok and if it doesn't hold and unscrews again I haven't lost anything. I don't want to mess up this handle/stem beyond use because that particular model is not available anywhere used. We have 16 of these handles in 2 bathrooms so I'd like to know a way to get the frozen setscrews out since I think it's just a matter of time until this will happen again. Any comments?

 

[Jeff H Young]

red loctite I suppose follow directions but I havent used them much but cant hurt to read instructions

 

[xehumph]

I used Loctite Red tread locker and just re-screwed in the threaded shaft, waited over 24 hours, and tried to unfreeze the stuck valve by turning the handle. It just broke loose again when I applied very significant torque to the handle. The valve was very tightly stuck. So then I tried to remove the valve and of course it would not pull out.

That's when I tried Plan B, the instructions from Hackney P in 2012 to the previous guy yagophil. Once again, Hackney's method worked. The valve was really stuck and I could feel the very tight vise-grip slipping so I trued it with a back-up 2nd vise-grip but still stuck. I didn't use heat but then squirted some Liquid Wrench around the valve and let it set. I tried the double vise-grips again with a socket as a spacer and again turned the packing nut out against my washer-spacer-vise-grips and it began to move. I unloosened a couple of turns and re-, replaced the 3 #12 o-rings, greased it up good, and reassembled. It now works with no leaks.

One concern I have is that it's still considerably stiffer (very tight when tuning the handle) than another Harden diverter valve we have. The bore feels pretty smooth but I think there must be a build up of sediment so I think I should disassemble it and try to clean up the inside of the bore of the valve chamber with emery cloth or something else.

I'd appreciate any comment about the best way to remove sediment and crud from the bore of the valve so it will turn more freely.

 

[Jeff H Young]

copper fitting brush with vinegar

 

[xehumph]

Thanks. Yes, I am concerned about not increasing the actual brass bore size by honing/sanding. I was thinking of vinegar or some diluted pool (muriatic) acid that I use on other plumbing fixtures and even on calcium deposits on tile. I'll post back on how some kind of diluted acid works

 

[Jeff H Young]

if you can just pour something on it and wash it off clean as whistle OK pool acid pournig down my pipes im not doing that but pour it on and get it off safely ok Just be safe I dont even want to know how