F&W Salt water conditioner

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by RJB, Aug 29, 2013.

  1. RJB

    RJB New Member

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    12
    Location:
    34488
    Need help setting and making it run.
  2. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    1,828
    Location:
    Ontario California
    Picture? model number, description?
  3. RJB

    RJB New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    34488
    Cylinder says F&W Flint and Walling. Timer on top of cylinder Seriel Number is 1583579
  4. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    1,828
    Location:
    Ontario California
    They have sold many different systems over the years. They have stuck with generic equipment so a picture would be very helpful.

    Thanks,
  5. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

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    3,135
    Location:
    Maine
    image.jpg image.jpg Is this what it looks like
  6. RJB

    RJB New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    34488
    Here is the model #F7FS24 Date Code 89-02 I'll try to get pictures.
  7. RJB

    RJB New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    34488
    When I plug in and turn water on all I get is steady pour from drain hose and pump keeps kicking on. Setting dial will not turn (Large dial in center)
  8. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,480
    Location:
    Alaska
    We are shooting in the dark hoping to hit some thing with out seeing the unit....

    There is most likely not one of us here that can not id a valve by looking at it...

    Setting dial will not turn kind of sounds like a fleck 5600.... but there are Autotrol valves that have a center dial as well..... then there the Macclean system that had a dial in the front center.... could be an Erie....

    Photo!!!!
  9. RJB

    RJB New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    34488
    I'm trying PICT0074.jpg
  10. RJB

    RJB New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    34488
    one more PICT0080.jpg
  11. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,480
    Location:
    Alaska
  12. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

    Messages:
    1,828
    Location:
    Ontario California
    Jammed valve, the 5600 main gear has a tendency to break from that time frame. Order the main gear, seal and spacer kit, piston assembly, brine valve, and if it is 24 volts, I would recommend a new motor too,
  13. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,480
    Location:
    Alaska
    Would really like to see the main gear break.... break from where and what?

    Now I know that the brine gear can have the shaft that it rides on break as I have seen that, but the main gear? maybe the part that is hanging in space part that on the SE or SXT or the 6600 or 6700 that is all one part.... no cut out.

    Why not just through the whole valve out and start over...
    Start simple and then go from there.
  14. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Location:
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    The main gear pt# 13170 breaks off the first tooth or two. Some minor changes were made to the main gear to prevent this problem. I still stock a large number of main gears for this common repair. Once the tooth is broken, it will no longer key correctly to the brine cam gear and the gears will no longer mesh properly. This causes the system to lock up and can no longer be turned.

    This is a very common problem on older 5600 valves.
  15. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,135
    Location:
    Maine
    Got a half dozen or so hanging in the stock room.
  16. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    I think it's a very common problem due to ham handed local dealers' techs, plumbers and well drillers twisting the knob 'til something breaks so they don't have to learn how to troubleshoot'n fix things... They get to try to sell new stuff that way. Many of those guys (plumbers'n drillers especially) always look for a bigger @#!!^*% hammer (BFH) when the one they usually beat things with doesn't git'er done.
  17. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,135
    Location:
    Maine
    Hmmmmmmmm so all those past service calls, where the valve has been in and working for months and even years before the gear broke are the fault of plumbers and well drillers. Yes indeed they found a way to weaken those gear teeth so that eventually they would break and then they could sell a whole new valve rather than replace the gear. Of course, theres no way a ham handed homeowner would go a twisting on the gear is there LOL Yup, makes a whole lotta sense. Well at least it does in Gary land. Or, is someone fishing again LOL

    Considering your disdain for the plumbing profession, it has always suprised me that Terry has put up with your vitreol. Then again, you do bring a certain amount of the comically surreal to the site :cool:
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2013
  18. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Location:
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    Wow, the valves main gear breaking is the plumbers fault. Amazing how the plumber did it without even being on site, ever.

    My knowledge of this part breaking stems from using this valve in the most difficult of commercial applications, with daily regenerations, lots of water use on chlorinated and chloramine supplies. The main gear breaks sometimes. This is not unheard of or rare. It is less common in residential applications. I am sure if someone were to simply call some of the major distributors, they would get the same answer from all of them. Yes, the main gear breaks sometimes.

    https://www.afwfilters.com/fleck-5600-series/main-gear-and-shaft-for-fleck-5600-part-13170-422.html

    http://www.softenerparts.com/Gear_Main_Gear_And_Shaft_For_5600_p/3413170.htm
    Here is a little blurb from some online sellers of this gear, and they are fairly accurate. This is the only gear that we see break. All other gears on the 5600 are basically bulletproof. The gear was modified many years ago to prevent this problem. The first tooth would snap off causing the valve to jam since it would no longer key in the gear alignment and idler void. The missing tooth was rarely found, but the problem still remains a key part of my 5600 training sessions.

    Tom, I think you may have hit it, he is on a fishing expedition.
  19. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

    Messages:
    1,828
    Location:
    Ontario California

    Obviously, you know this problem well enough to stock the gear. Most of our dealers that service softeners keep a few on their truck. It takes about 2-3 minutes to change the gear out.

    Tom, do you use a flat blade screwdriver to pop a hole in the sticker, or do you remove the sticker and try to replace it with a new one?

    When I was in the field more, I would use an exacto and cut a nice hole out of the manual regeneration knob sticker Pt# 14207. Or I would be lazy and just pop a hole.

    FYI, anyone trying this, be aware, there are two ball bearings and springs behind the main gear that are easy to lose. I prefer to have the head laying face down when I replace the main gear to prevent these items from getting lost.
  20. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,135
    Location:
    Maine
    About 50/50 on the hole in the sticker LOL. The first time I tried replacing the gear I did it in place, dropped bearings and springs in the brine tank. Fished the springs out easily but had to methodically empty the brine tank for those damn balls. You learn from your mistakes LOL. I'd say that most of the gear replacement has been on commercial units but occasionally we get a residential one too. Maybe the ham handed owner cranked the knob, hard to tell because few will admit to doing so. I find the notion that plumbers and well drillers are sneaking around breaking main gears to be absurd at best especially when you'd have to have one pretty dumb owner not to question buying a new valve as opposed to a 25 dollar service call.

    Due to the ever growing problem with illiteracy and the inability of some folks to make the connection or my inability to be more consise I must clarify that the 25 dollars is for the part and does not (at least in my case) include the outrageous and unfounded gouging that we plumbers are notorious for. Labor is of course.........extra LOL
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2013
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