OldSalt
Member
Yeah, I know, I can do an AI search and get a decent answer, i.e. high mineral content, excessive Calcium and/or Magnesium. When I query Amazon for hardwater test kits, virtually all of them define "hard water" in terms of PPM. I have installed a new water softener, and need to figure out how to test it's efficiency in providing actually softened water. The manufacturer tells me PPM isn't a valid standard.
Here's my situation:
1) My home has hard water, evidenced by the information provided by the water company (estimated 177 PPM), as well as the hard water scale problems we have. After almost a decade of working around the issue, I bit the bullet, found a compact water unit from iSpring (WCS50KG, 50K grain capacity), purchased and installed it.
2) I have a cheap, electronic PPM tester that I baseline tested against distilled water (zero PPM), bottled drinking water (20 PPM), and my tap water (170 PPM).
3) After installation, configuration (i.e. 9.9 GPG, 3 persons in the household), and clearing the home's taps of prior hard water, I tested the outside tap water against the indoor, presumably softened, water faucets. After installation, 145 PPM. To put it mildly, I was ticked that after all the work and expense to install this thing, no soft water? (Soft water on the charts I've seen is 60 PPM or below.)
4) I called iSpring, the manufacturer and asked "what now". Their customer service rep said "You can't test water for hardness with PPM alone. Soft water replaces calcium and magnesium ions with salt ions, softening the water, but the PPM rate may remain the same or be even higher afterwards. I then asked him, how do I test your unit to ensure it's working to spec, i.e. producing soft water below PPM. He backed into another conversation about TDS (total dissolved solids), how it compares to PPM (it doesn't), and so forth. He wasn't answering my question, so I asked him to escalate the ticket to management.
5) The customer service manager called, and essentially repeated the same thing. He noted that there were important configuration settings (which I had set), that make a difference. He also said that as shipped, the units are set for "high salt efficiency" to use the minimum salt necessary. He recommended I set it from salt high efficiency to "standard", to obtain softer water. (Again, no test standard, other than "send it to a lab".) In fact, there's no such "Salt Efficiency" setting on their menu. As referenced in the manual, under "Advanced", a user CAN override their standard settings for the backwash, brine soak, rinse, and etc. to run longer or shorter. However, there's no specs on those figures from the manufacturer, i.e. I'd just be ballparking it.
6) Besides, all that those settings accomplish is to "automatically calculate" how long the regeneration cycle runs, or parts there of, and how frequently. My understanding is that soft water systems haven't changed much since the 1970s, back when my dad had a unit in our home. Water runs across a resin which has "sticky" sodium ions, which attract calcium and magnesium ions, which are exchanged for the sodium ions, thus resulting in softer water, water containing an exceptionally low additional sodium. Which means that no matter how frequently or how long the regeneration cycle runs, if there's salt brine in the brine enclosure, resin in the resin tank, and the brine has been pumped across the resin (in my system, for 90 minutes), after rinsing, for chemical reasons, THE WATER PROCESSED MUST BE SOFTENED.
7) How can this unit NOT soften water? How is it not possible to test to verify the results of ANY water softener? I'm lost here.
8) Fact check: I did run the simple household test of a few drops of soap in equal bottles of water, one hard tap, and one from the indoor softened taps. The indoor water did instantly full with bubbles, to the point where it couldn't be shook. After setting it down, the water below the bubbles cleared within seconds. The exterior hard water also generated bubbles, but not nearly as much, and the water was milky. (Note, after 5-10 minutes, both bottles reacted similarly, but that's likely because the dish detergent I used wasn't pure soap, but also contained additives to prevent streaking that effectively softened the water.) Second, during showers, the water did "feel" more slippery.
9) Bottom line: How do I figure out whether this unit is working properly? Using PPM as an objective standard (correctly or not), there's a heck of difference between 145 PPM and 60 PPM (or maybe 30 PPM, as some users have reported). I want to be able to test for that now, and test the unit's effectiveness over time between regenerations. I have a full spectrum (17 test) kit we'll use tomorrow. However, I don't see calcium or magnesium tests in this kit, just "Hardness" measured in PPM. The test will include minerals like iron, which will be helpful to know.
Thanks for reading through this. I missed the "short and concise writing" course back in school.
Scott
Attached: A picture of my busy water heater closet. The water softener is dead center, the Rinnai condensing tankless hot water heater is to the right, the water main line, inbound spin down filter, irrigation backflow preventer and line to the exterior water taps, run to the left. On the back wall, is a makeshift bypass valve (i.e. three valves), to enable me to separate and remove the water softener without interrupting household water. (The iSpring softener control valve includes it's own bypass valve at the rear, but again, I wanted to be able to detach and remove the unit if I needed to service anything else (e.g. the condensation line filter in back). No comments required about the ridiculous, amateur plumbing job. Trust me, it's better (in appearance and operation) than anything the original pro plumbers did back when they installed the Rinnai unit, when I built this house.
Here's my situation:
1) My home has hard water, evidenced by the information provided by the water company (estimated 177 PPM), as well as the hard water scale problems we have. After almost a decade of working around the issue, I bit the bullet, found a compact water unit from iSpring (WCS50KG, 50K grain capacity), purchased and installed it.
2) I have a cheap, electronic PPM tester that I baseline tested against distilled water (zero PPM), bottled drinking water (20 PPM), and my tap water (170 PPM).
3) After installation, configuration (i.e. 9.9 GPG, 3 persons in the household), and clearing the home's taps of prior hard water, I tested the outside tap water against the indoor, presumably softened, water faucets. After installation, 145 PPM. To put it mildly, I was ticked that after all the work and expense to install this thing, no soft water? (Soft water on the charts I've seen is 60 PPM or below.)
4) I called iSpring, the manufacturer and asked "what now". Their customer service rep said "You can't test water for hardness with PPM alone. Soft water replaces calcium and magnesium ions with salt ions, softening the water, but the PPM rate may remain the same or be even higher afterwards. I then asked him, how do I test your unit to ensure it's working to spec, i.e. producing soft water below PPM. He backed into another conversation about TDS (total dissolved solids), how it compares to PPM (it doesn't), and so forth. He wasn't answering my question, so I asked him to escalate the ticket to management.
5) The customer service manager called, and essentially repeated the same thing. He noted that there were important configuration settings (which I had set), that make a difference. He also said that as shipped, the units are set for "high salt efficiency" to use the minimum salt necessary. He recommended I set it from salt high efficiency to "standard", to obtain softer water. (Again, no test standard, other than "send it to a lab".) In fact, there's no such "Salt Efficiency" setting on their menu. As referenced in the manual, under "Advanced", a user CAN override their standard settings for the backwash, brine soak, rinse, and etc. to run longer or shorter. However, there's no specs on those figures from the manufacturer, i.e. I'd just be ballparking it.
6) Besides, all that those settings accomplish is to "automatically calculate" how long the regeneration cycle runs, or parts there of, and how frequently. My understanding is that soft water systems haven't changed much since the 1970s, back when my dad had a unit in our home. Water runs across a resin which has "sticky" sodium ions, which attract calcium and magnesium ions, which are exchanged for the sodium ions, thus resulting in softer water, water containing an exceptionally low additional sodium. Which means that no matter how frequently or how long the regeneration cycle runs, if there's salt brine in the brine enclosure, resin in the resin tank, and the brine has been pumped across the resin (in my system, for 90 minutes), after rinsing, for chemical reasons, THE WATER PROCESSED MUST BE SOFTENED.
7) How can this unit NOT soften water? How is it not possible to test to verify the results of ANY water softener? I'm lost here.
8) Fact check: I did run the simple household test of a few drops of soap in equal bottles of water, one hard tap, and one from the indoor softened taps. The indoor water did instantly full with bubbles, to the point where it couldn't be shook. After setting it down, the water below the bubbles cleared within seconds. The exterior hard water also generated bubbles, but not nearly as much, and the water was milky. (Note, after 5-10 minutes, both bottles reacted similarly, but that's likely because the dish detergent I used wasn't pure soap, but also contained additives to prevent streaking that effectively softened the water.) Second, during showers, the water did "feel" more slippery.
9) Bottom line: How do I figure out whether this unit is working properly? Using PPM as an objective standard (correctly or not), there's a heck of difference between 145 PPM and 60 PPM (or maybe 30 PPM, as some users have reported). I want to be able to test for that now, and test the unit's effectiveness over time between regenerations. I have a full spectrum (17 test) kit we'll use tomorrow. However, I don't see calcium or magnesium tests in this kit, just "Hardness" measured in PPM. The test will include minerals like iron, which will be helpful to know.
Thanks for reading through this. I missed the "short and concise writing" course back in school.
Scott
Attached: A picture of my busy water heater closet. The water softener is dead center, the Rinnai condensing tankless hot water heater is to the right, the water main line, inbound spin down filter, irrigation backflow preventer and line to the exterior water taps, run to the left. On the back wall, is a makeshift bypass valve (i.e. three valves), to enable me to separate and remove the water softener without interrupting household water. (The iSpring softener control valve includes it's own bypass valve at the rear, but again, I wanted to be able to detach and remove the unit if I needed to service anything else (e.g. the condensation line filter in back). No comments required about the ridiculous, amateur plumbing job. Trust me, it's better (in appearance and operation) than anything the original pro plumbers did back when they installed the Rinnai unit, when I built this house.
