What causes brass piping to disintegrate like this?

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Lordoftheflies

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Went to replace a faucet....and the angle valve flew off after loosening the nut on the faucet side. Damn maid was there doing laundry so she asked not to shut off the water and stupid me listened. Luckily was able to run down and shut the water and minimize the damage.........

But what causes this to happen? 3/8" brass just totally corroded on the hot water side...and the pipe diameter greatly reduced. It looked like the previous plumber replaced the cold water side but did not replace the hot. I wish I could slap him.

When I unscrewed the remainder of the pipe half of the threads were completely rotted away inside as well and I had to carefully scrape it clean.

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hj

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The combination of the brass valve, the steel pipe, AND water caused the deterioration, which is why GOOD plumbers use brass nipples, NOT steel ones, even though they are more expensive.
 

Lordoftheflies

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Which part is steel in my pic? The hard line that goes to the faucet? The pipe coming out to the wall was brass I thought. And the angle stop is brass I too no?
 

Jadnashua

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It looks like the threaded piece in the bottom picture like it is steel. Scrape it a bit and see if it is, or use a magnet on it.
 

Lordoftheflies

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Oh ok. Why would someone put steel instead of brass? Do you really save that much $$$ on a 5" piece of pipe?? Thanks for clarifying.
 

Jadnashua

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Plumbers warranty is typically one year...it generally will last much longer than that...quick and cheap, especially on track homes is more the norm than the exception...a $ here is a $ in their pocket...do it enough, and it adds up!
 
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When different metals contact with water, this is what happens. The same reason why we have to use copper straps and copper nails to fasten copper pipes.

Steel nipples like that were common in a lot of older homes. It was just an available material at the times, especially if you wanted something that was threaded.
 

Lordoftheflies

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That's sad. What people will do for a buck is just shameful. Do it right the first time!
 

Lordoftheflies

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When different metals contact with water, this is what happens. The same reason why we have to use copper straps and copper nails to fasten copper pipes.

Steel nipples like that were common in a lot of older homes. It was just an available material at the times, especially if you wanted something that was threaded.

So they didn't have brass nipples back in the day? And steel would rust from the inside out, right? Which looks like what happened here.....

In my house...I have copper coming into the house....and then the plumber transitioned to PEX....and then transitioned again to copper at the tankless water heater...and then transitioned back to PEX....which then transitions one more time to brass to go upstairs and connects to the existing piping.

My electrical panel is grounded to the water main and there is a jumper cable before and after the meter.

My question is - do I need to jump from the copper at the main to the copper at the tankless heater and then again to the brass before it goes upstairs?

I asked an electrician friend of mine and he could not give me an answer.
 
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So they didn't have brass nipples back in the day?
It wasn't a cost saving measure. It was just available. Pre-tapped pipe pieces made this job easier. Maybe it was all the builder had in their truck. You'd need to contact them personally to ask.

do I need to jump from the copper at the main to the copper at the tankless heater and then again to the brass before it goes upstairs?
No.
 

Asktom

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If the house is piped in galvanized, that is how it is/was done. If the house is piped in copper the steel nipple is a bad thing.
 

hj

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It was less expensive to have a bunch of different sized steel nipples on the truck than brass ones, because you did not know what sizes you would need until you did the job.
 

Lordoftheflies

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It was less expensive to have a bunch of different sized steel nipples on the truck than brass ones, because you did not know what sizes you would need until you did the job.

So even if it was the wrong thing to put in, because it was cheaper to buy, it's ok to install it? Is that what you're saying? What happened to going to the job site to figure out what you needed and then heading over to the supply house to pick it up? I don't get why someone would put the wrong thing in knowing it was wrong and would corrode...and just leave it to the next guy to deal with.

Btw I put a magnet to the piece and it is indeed galvanized steel.
 

Jadnashua

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Much of this depends on your long-term objectives...for a plumber on a new house, it's to make the contractor happy, and speed/cost is often the bottom line. For a home owner, or a good professional you called in to do something for you...building a happy client base is more important.

On new construction today, a galvanized pipe nipple is just the cheap way out...on potable water, it WILL fail eventually. Now, that could be signs of rust when you open the faucet after a month or more, or rust particles clogging the valve or screen or cartridge down the road, or literally breaking (it usually leaks first unless you're trying to remove it!) is hard to say. Galvanized works fine in certain situations, but few related to potable water supplies...there's just too much dissolved oxygen, and the plating is never perfect especially where it's threaded, and iron and oxygen just means rust.
 

hj

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quote;; What happened to going to the job site to figure out what you needed and then heading over to the supply house to pick it up?

You are thinking like a "service" person, NOT one doing a "tract" house where there is NO "heading over to the supply house". You use what you brought with you to finish the job. Almost EVERYTHING is done with the intention that it last at least one year, or maybe two, depending on what the warranty requirements are in the area.
 

Lordoftheflies

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At least one year or two? Is that the mindset of the typical plumber? Really? I understand giving a one or two year warranty...but you shouldn't expect a nipple to last one or two years. It should last a lifetime, no?

It seems to me that knowingly putting the wrong piece in because you didn't have the right piece or because you didn't want to spend a few extra $$$ to have the right piece in your truck....is the wrong way to "service" a client - whether you are doing a bunch of houses in a row or not. If you are doing a tract job and you're the plumber I would think you'd have the knowledge that the house plumbed in copper or brass or whatever it is and bring the appropriate hardware. And even if you weren't the original plumber you should still install the right part.
 

Asktom

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If the house was piped in galvanized steel then the steel nipple was correct. My experience was in the burbs of Los Angeles in an area built at a time where, except for very high end, everything was done in galvanized. In my years of repair plumbing I never saw a brass nipple used to stub out of the wall. How the system held up was mostly due to the quality of the pipe and the chemical characteristics of the water. Of course lousy installation can also be a factor. Some places fail fairly soon, others keep on ticking. The home my parents built in 1948 is still going strong. Mixing metals, even brass, can cause problems - that is what happened to your nipple.
 
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