What are some dangerous things you pros have seen homeowners do?

[Erico]

I've been thinking about this topic for some time and really got to thinking about it when I saw some really dangerous set-ups in my mother-in-law's new house.

What are the TOP things homeowners or jack-legs do to burn their houses down and/or or cause an injury?

I sometimes question myself when I'm doing minor electrical upgrades or repairs. Am I doing the right thing or am I going to burn my house down.

Then I see my mother-in-law's house:

• Open junction boxes in cellulose insulation
• Two ceiling fans wired in the attic with extension cord
• Central air tied in to the main because the box was full
• A shared nutral on the same phase tied to a receptacle without the tabs broken
• Buried boxes with chared wires

And then I think - well maybe THAT'S the kind of things that get done and burns houses down. And then I think maybe I'm doing ok.

But what am I missing?

What are the common no-nos?

(RE: The mother-in-laws house. We got her squared away. We were doing a kitchen remodel for her and planned on having the electrician run the 220 line while we did some minor stuff (gfcis etc.). Thankfully he was on scene to take care of the dangerous items and walk us through some switch-leg adds etc.. The kitchen remodel ended up re-wiring half the house. A new upgraded service will be installed in the spring.)

 

[Drick]

Every time I think I have seen it all I see something new. There are too many to list. But what I do see otherwise competent HOs screw up on is wire nuts. They need to be tightened. Just because you put three turns on it does not mean you are done tightening it. Loose connections = heat = fire. I've been on more than one call where the HO replaced a switch with a dimmer and weeks later an arc developed from poorly tightened wire nuts melting everything in the box. One HO called the fire dept and and was lucky to still have a house afterward.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[JWelectric]

plug strips plugged into plug strips

portable electric heaters used with drop cords

installing ceiling fans in a mobile home

I keep coming back editing the list

cheap drop cords under rugs

opening panels that are energized and trying to add circuits. My next door neighboro shoved a steel tape into the bus bars resulting in a very costly repair

Is this enough or do you want more?

 

[Erico]

Sure!! The more the merrier. The life you save might be ..... mine!

BTW, I found your comments on multi-meters to be quite eye-opening. So I did a bunch of research. I own one of the darn things I bought to test my floor heater OHMs before I installed it. Other than the floor, I think I tested a receptacle and diagnosed my furnace. It's a CAT II so I know not to go poking around in the box. And I even read the directions for the darn thing!

 

[Dlarrivee]

The most dangerous thing I've come across are the people working on their own panels when they shouldn't even be repairing lamps.

Some folks don't know enough to know when they're doing something wrong.

 

[DonL]

I would like to add,

Buying Cheap switches, outlets, extension cords, Heaters, light sockets...etc...

A electrical appliance should never be left untended. Dryers, dishwashers are common leave home while running appliances, big NO NO. Even Crock Pots.

Smoke detectors should be places near all electrical devices. In every room.


Good insurance is nice, but may not pay unless every rule is followed.

 

[Erico]

Some folks don't know enough to know when they're doing something wrong.

That's what I fear. I'm not worried about not knowing the answer. I worry about not knowing the question.

I feel I'm fairly competent to at least ask the right questions. I hope.

 

[Erico]

A electrical appliance should never be left untended. Dryers, dishwashers are common leave home while running appliances, big NO NO. Even Crock Pots.

That question came up last year between my wife and I. We were on our way out the door and she asked me if I left the dishwasher on. I said yes what's the problem. She said she never leaves it running. Or the dryer.

Usually it's me who is the worry wart about fire. I took her point and don't leave anything running when out of the house.

Imagine what went through my, as my wife calls it, "Catholic guilt brain" when I walked in to my kitchen last year to find it filing with smoke. My first thought was "Dear God, I've finally done it. DIY electrical work has come back to bite me"... My next thought was "where the heck is my cell phone so I can call 911"...... as I headed down the back stairs to use my downstairs neighbor's phone, she was on her way up screaming "MY KITCHEN'S ON FIRE."

The poor slob who was doing her a favor finishing some drywall in her kitchen (the original scope was sound-proofing the bedroom. Her father and I hung the drywall and installed six cans) for an additional $300 dollars bumped the knob on her stove and ignited the moving blanket she covered it with.

Lesons:

• Liability insurance is good (he had it).
• Never let your client cover their stove with flamable items (that's what the drywaller said he will never do again)
• Fire and smoke travels in unprotected areas - a LOT ( the celing corners weren't yet mudded. That's why I was getting smoke).
• Check your smoke alarms (my hard wired brinks alarm never went off. The house is now peppered with detectors).
• When you smell smoke. Chick it out asap. I sat there for a few minutes saying hmmm to myself.
• Old fashioned wall mounted land-line phones are nice. Digging in couch cushions when you think your house is on fire is no fun.
• It is possible to lght an LG stove with your a$$. I replicated the manuever. Those knobs are too big.
• It's the little things that hurt. Like a $300 dollar change order that burns a kitchen.

The guy managed to throw the burning blanket on the back porch and stomp it out. Fried the stove, micro and a little counter-top and the carpet on the porch. I shoulda billed them for my undies that got soiled.

 

[Runs with Bison]

That question came up last year between my wife and I. We were on our way out the door and she asked me if I left the dishwasher on. I said yes what's the problem. She said she never leaves it running. Or the dryer.

She's a keeper. I've had this rule all of my adult life. Add the washer, the oven, etc. to the list. With washers one must always consider the chance of a hose connection coming loose. (I worry about this less now with my frontloader...the old top loader had a tendency to "walk" when it became unbalanced.)

The poor slob who was doing her a favor finishing some drywall in her kitchen (the original scope was sound-proofing the bedroom. Her father and I hung the drywall and installed six cans) for an additional $300 dollars bumped the knob on her stove and ignited the moving blanket she covered it with.

Add "flipping the breaker off" to the list of lessons. The knobs don't do anything if the breaker is off.

A fellow engineer/mentor of mine lost a colleague while in grad school. The story he related was that she had bought a house that she was fixing up and didn't show up to work in the lab on Monday. Since she was very reliable and wasn't answering the phone they contacted the police and went to her place. They found her sitting on the range. She had been working on a vent hood. Apparently there was some sort of problem with the grounding of one of the two appliances and she inadvertently made a new circuit. It was rather grisly as she supposedly had been cooking since Friday evening.

 

[Jimbo]

Buying Cheap switches, outlets, extension cords, Heaters, light sockets...etc...

This brings up a good question. We know there are 39 cent receptacles, and $4 receptacles, and one is better than the other. BUT, the cheapo is apparently code approved, and electrical contractors all over the country install them every day in new houses. If they were really such crap...shouldn't we have houses burning down left and right??

 

[Jadnashua]

This brings up a good question. We know there are 39 cent receptacles, and $4 receptacles, and one is better than the other. BUT, the cheapo is apparently code approved, and electrical contractors all over the country install them every day in new houses. If they were really such crap...shouldn't we have houses burning down left and right??

My personal opinion on this is, it depends. The more you use a cheap receptacle or the higher the load, the contacts tend to get weaker and lose their tension, creating more heat and problems. Now, take one that only has a light plugged into it for years, and never removed - it may outlast several generations in the home. Take one that gets used to plug the vacuum cleaner into several times a week, then gets pulled out by the cord at an angle, and it may be shot in a year or less.

My personal biggest whoops is after shutting the gas off at the meter, I needed a fitting I didn't have to complete things. Didn't think I needed to cap the open end as I'd not smelled any gas from the shutoff line...closed the door, went to the store, and when I came back...room full of gas, or at least a significant amount...lucky I didn't blow the whole place up. Luckily there were no sparks when I opened the door, the phone didn't ring, nobody rang the doorbell, and static didn't spark things. My take on this: even if the main is shut off, cap an open line just in case and don't leave and close things up unless you do! Shutoffs are supposed to do just that, shutoff, but that's not always the case, especially when they get old.

 

[Erico]

Add "flipping the breaker off" to the list of lessons. The knobs don't do anything if the breaker is off.

That's a very good point. Or un-plug the thing. But there is always the gas.

That's interesting you mentioned that person being electrocuted in that way. I was quizing the sparky on my mother-in-law's job and asked how it is people end up buying the farm. His first statement was 110 kills more people than anything *gulp*.... and often times it involves being in a position where one can't "fall away" from danger.

He told me about a local guy laying on top of the dryer (like your friend's friend) trying to plug it in when he became part of the circuit..... He also talked about people in bare feet in the basement getting zapped. Or people working with un-safe un-insulated older steele cased drills etc. while laying on their backs on ground or concrete.

 

[Erico]

But what I do see otherwise competent HOs screw up on is wire nuts. They need to be tightened. Just because you put three turns on it does not mean you are done tightening it. Loose connections = heat = fire.

That's a good point.

I was helping a friend change out some lights and watched him wrap the hots with electrical tape and loosely twist on a wire nut. I was like "hold on" and he said "that's the way I always do it"

A couple days later I ran across an article in some DIY magazine and an electrician discussing that very point. He said he refers to tape like that as "kindling"..... I clipped the article for my friend.

The sparky on my mother-in-law's job had a custom made tool attached to his drill for twisting wires. I've seen the cheap plastic ones in the stores but he notched a nut driver. He said he has carpal tunnel so he needs it. It was cool to watch a pro work. I turned around to drink a cup of coffee and he had 5 outlets buttoned up - I would have still been wrestling with that 12 gague wire on the first outlet. 12 gaue wire - I call it coat hanger....LOL

 

[Erico]

Yikes, Jim!

I've done that - left an open "shut off" line. That's a good point about capping them off just in case.

I just watched the Bourne Supremecy - he busts the gas line off the wall and puts a magazine in the toaster for a make-shift time bomb. Boom! Scary thought.

 

[plummen]

Ive seen type L copper water line chopped off and used in place of cartridge fuses in 200a disconnects,jumper cables run from one panel to feed another.......................................
Seen lots of stuff in last 30 plus years

 

[hj]

quote; I just watched the Bourne Supremecy - he busts the gas line off the wall and puts a magazine in the toaster for a make-shift time bomb.

And I believe the "Mythbusters" proved that was pure "Hollywood hype", at least for it to happen as fast as his did.

 

[hj]

quote; A electrical appliance should never be left untended. Dryers, dishwashers are common leave home while running appliances, big NO NO. Even Crock Pots.

Dang! And here I always thought the "delayed start" on ovens, dryers, washers, and dishwashers was such a convenience. Now I also have to worry about the water heater because I never know when it will start, even during the night when we are asleep.

 

[DonL]

quote; A electrical appliance should never be left untended. Dryers, dishwashers are common leave home while running appliances, big NO NO. Even Crock Pots.

Dang! And here I always thought the "delayed start" on ovens, dryers, washers, and dishwashers was such a convenience. Now I also have to worry about the water heater because I never know when it will start, even during the night when we are asleep.

Yea they are convenient when they work properly, and very inconvenient when they do not.

There have been many recalls on appliances that catch fire. Even when many times it is operator error.

I have no choice of babysitting my hot water heater, But I don't trust something, just because it is convenient. Including the babysitter Next door.

 

[JWelectric]

Gentlemen this is getting pretty close to being a deleted thread.

At any rate I think it is far enough off topic to close. If you feel I am doing this without justification please send me a PM

I deleted a few posts here,
Terry