Upgrading plumbing in 1950’s ranch

[Korndawg]

Hey all. I’ma new poster but long time lurker or this forum. My house is a 1950s ranch home that’s a pretty simple 1.5 bathroom house. Currently, the hot water pressure to the bathroom isn’t that great and using any fixture while taking a shower will scald the person taking the shower. I’m hoping to rectify this situation by upgrading/changing the plumping. Appears the main line is 3/4 coming in and reduces down to 1/2 after the softener over to the runs to everything else. 3/4 pex over to the softener. What would you recommend I do in this situation. I included some pics of the mess I have. It gets really confusing when it starts t-ing off to the W/D, downstairs sink and up to the bathroom. Plumber thinks I should upgrade to 3/4 pex all the way to the bathroom and to new 1/2 to fixtures. Thanks!
https://imgur.com/a/jcw8HLw

 

[Reach4]

Get a garden hose thread pressure gauge. Under $20, and often a lot under. Check the pressure at the drain on the WH and an outside faucet while somebody runs the water to the shower. Note the pressure with no flow. Then run hot, then cold, and see if you notice a difference in pressure drop. If you don't have a helper, you can either run back and forth to the gauge, or you can make a movie of the gauge. It is usually more trouble than its worth to remote the gauge via a garden hose, but that is available also.

A laundry tap can also be a place to hook the gauge if you need more data.

 

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[PlumbNuts]

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[Temp945]

This is my first attempt replying to someone else's problem - I am a DIY enthusiast so take my advice with a grain of salt

I agree with Reach that testing your water pressure is a good idea and you should confirm what your incoming pressure is regardless of what you do next.

However, if your main concern is getting scalded in the shower, another course of action would be to replace your old shower valve with a modern thermostatic valve (a code requirement for new construction in some areas I believe).

A thermostatic valve will automatically adjust the incoming ratio of hot and cold water in the shower to adjust for even very small changes in incoming pressure (volume) of hot and cold water. This will prevent scalding, but also means that you do not need to adjust the water temperature manually as you deplete your hot water tank throughout your shower.

If your existing copper is in good condition, it may be less expensive and less hassle to replace your shower valve and fixtures rather than swap out all that copper for PEX.

Just an idea!

 

[Jeff H Young]

I'd recommend a pressure balancing shower valve at the very least. and a complete repipe at most 3/4 would be minimum water main after softener. but the easy fix to start with would change shower valve . you might be satisfied for some time even years. I'm no proponent of undersized piping but it is what it is and changing shower valve I'm sure will help.

 

[Korndawg]

Thanks for the replies! Will def try to get this system pressure tested to see where I’m at and look into a thermostatic valve.

 

[Jeff H Young]

btw even if you repiped the whole house your valve should be upgraded

 

[Korndawg]

btw even if you repiped the whole house your valve should be upgraded

I feel really dumb….but I’m not even seeing an existing shower valve in my setup.

 

[Temp945]

Not a dumb question to me - the shower valve is behind the wall. It is what your shower valve *handle* attaches to.

 

[Temp945]

This is the valve I just used for my bath remodel (to give you an idea of what it looks like):

https://www.amazon.com/Kohler-K-2972-KS-NA-MasterShower-2-Inch-Thermostatic/dp/B0063OVTKM

 

[Korndawg]

Not a dumb question to me - the shower valve is behind the wall. It is what your shower valve *handle* attaches to.

Well that explains it! Thanks. This shower has an old 2 knob system. Would love to switch to a single handle but of course it’s all tiled in and I’m not ready for that huge project just yet.

 

[Temp945]

What's on the other side of the wall? It may be possible to switch out the valve and handle without disturbing any tile by doing the work from the other side. I'm very partial to 1950s/1960s tile jobs (as long as they've been kept in good condition), so I agree it would be a shame to knock it out!

 

[Jeff H Young]

Well that explains it! Thanks. This shower has an old 2 knob system. Would love to switch to a single handle but of course it’s all tiled in and I’m not ready for that huge project just yet.

Don't know how long you've lived there or when your problem started . I like the old tile work too . changing valve is a big deal but a single handle valve with oversize plate can often be installed and no tile needs replaced. If you decide to repipe and leave old valve in place let us know if problem gets much better or not. but to me that's a little backward.

 

[Korndawg]

Don't know how long you've lived there or when your problem started . I like the old tile work too . changing valve is a big deal but a single handle valve with oversize plate can often be installed and no tile needs replaced. If you decide to repipe and leave old valve in place let us know if problem gets much better or not. but to me that's a little backward.

We have been here since 1996 and the problem has been here since Day 1. Has just been something we've dealt with. The tile is in great shape and yes, not a project I'm willing to tackle at all yet. I'll have to look to see what is out there for a single valve with big cover plate. I guess I've never seen or shopped for one.

The other side of the wall is the laundry shoot to the basement.

 

[Korndawg]

Picture of the current valves. Its 12" from end to end.

 

[Reach4]

I'll have to look to see what is out there for a single valve with big cover plate.

Access panels are pretty commonly available.

The other side of the wall is the laundry shoot to the basement.

Probablyh not exactly, because a valve or pipe would interfere with laundry chute operation. But I could potentially imagine a case where a valve and pipe could be behind the hinge area of the laundry chute. Maybe see if you can pull that and gain access.

Laundry chute doors are not nearly as available as they used to be. I think that is because the chutes are supposed to be constructed with fire blocking in mind, and the door sellers got concerned that they could get blamed.

 

[Temp945]

We have been here since 1996 and the problem has been here since Day 1. Has just been something we've dealt with. The tile is in great shape and yes, not a project I'm willing to tackle at all yet. I'll have to look to see what is out there for a single valve with big cover plate. I guess I've never seen or shopped for one.

The other side of the wall is the laundry shoot to the basement.

Here is a great video that addresses your exact problem:

You could take the same approach as the video, or you could try replacing valves from the rear without disturbing the tile at all. Depending on how much access you have, the laundry shoot area may allow you to open up the drywall and tackle the problem from behind. What's nice about the laundry shoot access is that you wouldn't even need to worry about doing a perfect drywall and paint repair when you're done as you would if the other side of the wall was a finished area like a bedroom etc.

 

[Jeff H Young]

Well at least you know the problem , if you ever decide to fix . I've got an idea to fix with out ever changing valve by tempering the hot water side never tried it before so its just a theory. and that is to install a thermostatic valve in basement near shower, set it a little hot and then leave it on all the time . then when showering you could theoretically leave the cold off and open hot full blast and temp would never rise above set point.
I've never heard of anyone doing this but don't know why it wouldn't work.

 

[Temp945]

Interesting idea, Jeff.

Before I remodeled my bathroom several months ago, I also had a 1960s valve with separate hot and cold handles. I dealt with the scalding problem by just setting my water heater at 120F and then only using the hot lever in the shower without turning on the cold side. The downside is that with the lower water temperature that we would run out of hot water sometimes with back-to-back showers.

 

[Korndawg]

Great video! Great news too, I found an access panel so getting to the old valve is not an issue at all. Guess I'll be be doing some faucet/valve shopping!