Toilets Plugging Up

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by Still_Waters_43, Dec 1, 2005.

  1. Still_Waters_43

    Still_Waters_43 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    I have replaced three toilets this year with new Kohler models. Each of them has gotten plugged up several times. I have even removed two of them to verify that they were installed ok and that there was no blockage.

    Is this happening because of the new low-flow design? and if so any suggestions on a fix. I think I rember seeing some internal product that supposedly improves the pumping action, do these work?

    Any help here would be appreciated.
     
  2. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2004
    Occupation:
    Plumber
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    Some toilets work better than others.

    Check the link below for information on toilets.
    As far as I know, there is no aftermarket internal product for improving a flush.

    The better toilets are just designed that much better.
     
  3. Sponsor

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  4. Still_Waters_43

    Still_Waters_43 New Member

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    Dec 1, 2005
    Oh crap!... and I mean that no pun intended :mad:

    Any possibility that Flushmate might develop a retrofit kit? as it seems to be what I am looking for.
     
  5. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2004
    Occupation:
    Plumber
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    So you're looking for something that isn't made yet to help with your inexpensive toilets with the poor MaP ratings.

    Even if you were to bolt on something to throw the water down faster, you would still have the bad bowls.

    Everyone knows what happens when water is poured down a bad bowl.
     
  6. SteveW

    SteveW DIY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2005
    Location:
    Omaha, NE
    One (of many) things I've learned from this site is that toilets are essentially made of clay. When they are formed, sometimes the clay "slumps" or partially collapses in the trapway (the curved path that carries water from the bowl to the drain). In turn, the diameter of the trapway is reduced. Toto toilets don't seem to do this as much as other brands.

    Also, Toto uses a 3" flush valve (the flapper that allows water to go from the tank to the bowl). You probably have a 2" valve (the standard size).

    As Terry says, there is no work-around for this. Bite the bullet and buy yourself some Toto Drakes and be done with it once and for all. You can then put the plunger away!
     
  7. Still_Waters_43

    Still_Waters_43 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Thanks for the really good feedback, I really appreciated the quick and informative responses. :)


    However, as to the snide comments tucked into the relies (my take below):

    Quote: "inexpensive"
    If I was looking for an inexpensive toilet I wouldn't have bought a Kohler

    Quote: "everyone knows..."
    This my be surprising to you guys but where I come from we dont have frequent indepth discussions on the merits of one toilet design vs another.

    Quote: "bite the bullet and buy new ones"
    Give me a break!, so let me see if you bought a car and some features of it were not to your liking, you would just go out and buy a new one (really? I think not).
    :mad:
     
  8. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

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    Occupation:
    Retired Systems engineer for defense industry.
    Location:
    New England
    Me thinks you are missing the point - some toilets are not designed or built as well as others causing differences in performance. Price does not necessarily indicate quality, either (although sometimes it does). You may have the style you like and payed for it, but they left something out - performance. Testing indicates that you need to look elsewhere for both quality and performance.
     
  9. Cass

    Cass Plumber

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Location:
    Ohio
    It is much easier on the pocketbook to go out and buy a new toilet than a new car.
     
  10. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2004
    Location:
    Yakima, WA
    I think the problem here is that Kohler is living on past reputation. At one time Kohler was top of the line, but they didn't keep up. The average non-plumber doesn't know this, so still think Kohler is #1, buys it. This has occured in other product lines too, Craftsman was once about the best supplier of tools there was, but no more. Today, it's Crapsman.
     
  11. SteveW

    SteveW DIY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2005
    Location:
    Omaha, NE
    Don't shoot the messenger...

    Still_Waters_43,

    No snideness intended -- just following up on your original post, informing us you were frustrated by the flushing performance of the 3 Kohlers you installed. You further told us you had checked for an outflow obstruction, so you've covered all the remediable possibilities I can think of.

    The reality of the situation, from the info you've given us, is that the only solution to the problem is replacement of the poorly-performing units. The alternative is to learn to live with the situation and keep a plunger by each toilet.

    In the overall scheme of conditions around the world, there are worse situations one could find him- or herself in...
     
  12. Still_Waters_43

    Still_Waters_43 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Thanks Gary_Swart you hit the nail right on the head.

    Also, I would add the non-professional gets even more frustrated when we are disapointed by the failure of a single use device!
     
  13. Still_Waters_43

    Still_Waters_43 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Double Whammy Today

    My saga continues with these dang toilets and I would like your opinion on this situation.

    Friday morning I tried to flush a small dump and the toilet filled up and wouldn't go down. So I got the plunger and started pumping, but it just wouldn't go down. I decided to leave it for later when I got home from work. When I got home the water had drained out so I got the plunger again, flushed and started pumping, but again it wouldn't go down.

    I then went into the bathroom next door (I have two bathrooms side by side on the second floor). And just for something to do, I flushed it, and it backed up too!, and wouldn't go down (even though there was nothing to flush just water)?

    So, I left them both for about 15 minutes and when I went back they where still full to the brim. I started plunging the second toilet and suddenly it went down and I ran into the first bathromm and that toilet had gone down too!

    Any idea what may be going on here, both toilets are working fine since? :confused: :confused: :confused:
     
  14. Cass

    Cass Plumber

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Location:
    Ohio
    They are connected with a double T / cross. It is a fitting that allows 2 toilets to use the same drain and vent when they are back to back.

    The drain clogged backing up both toilets. With the the water pressure of both being full and your plunging it just suddenly let go.
     
  15. RRW

    RRW New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2005
    Location:
    Illinois
    I am guessing that you may need to get another plunger and wedge it into one toilet while you plunge the other one in the future or you may risk overflowing the one that you are not plunging plus losing the plunge pressure.
     
  16. plumber1

    plumber1 Plumber

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2005
    Location:
    Florida
    toilets

    Right on Gary.
    I have avoided Kohler for 30 years because they have no quality control. Poor cast iron products and poor performance with toilets, and they still charge an arm and a leg.
    I'm old enough to remember when Kohler was top notch.
    I'd like to blame the toilets, but may be look somewhere else.
    I'd start checking for a sewer problem.
     
  17. Still_Waters_43

    Still_Waters_43 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    What to do next?

    What would you recommend at this time given that the toilets appear to be working now. I guess I am asking if there is antthing a plumber can do today, to prevent this from happening again. :confused:
     
  18. Cass

    Cass Plumber

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Location:
    Ohio
    If roof access is possible and you can look straight down the vent to the T you will be able verify that the drain and vent are wide open. If they are you know for sure it is the toilet if there is something catching paper Ect. you will see it. It might be worth a look.
     
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