SOLVED: Conduit Configuration

[Martina]

UPDATE: After much consideration, I bit the bullet and removed the wall cabinets providing me with the needed access to drill through the top plates from below. I ended up purchasing a Dewalt Right Angle Drill Adapter for about 20 bucks (That little guy is a beast!) and used it in conjunction with my impact driver and a short spade bit (see attached image # 5). Went through like butter! I have since fished the cables and patched up the holes. Can't even tell they were there. Overall, I think it was the best and most economical solution providing me with the clean look of standard receptacles. Thanks again to everyone's feedback (especially Wayne's). I have learned about so many alternate ways to handle the issue that I'm sure will be useful in the future.


ORIGINAL POST:

Hi, guys!

I'd like to install two receptacles above our workbench as shown in image # 1, however, I have limited access in the attic due to the sloping of the roof (see image # 2). I may be able to squeeze myself into that area, however, there is not enough space to drill through the top plate. I've contemplated the use of conduits but prefer a clean look with standard recessed receptacles. After doing some research, I came across some pull elbows (image # 3) that I thought might work to make the connection from the attic to the wall cavities. In order to attach it to the ceiling, I would add a pipe extender (picture # 4) that would extend into the attic and could then be clamped to an adjacent rafter. Not the most elegant solution I realize, but I thought it may work. Would like to get some input as to whether or not this would be an acceptable/proper way of routing the 12/2s? Or perhaps there is an altogether different solution for this issue?

Thanks in advance for your time and all forthcoming responses.

Martina

 

[AlfredeNeuman]

The pull elbow is meant for individual wires and won't provide the proper radius for NM cable.
5 times the width (taken at the maximum diameter) of the NM

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Martina]

The pull elbow is meant for individual wires and won't provide the proper radius for NM cable.
5 times the width (taken at the maximum diameter) of the NM

Thank you so much for that information. I appreciate it.

 

[wwhitney]

If the wall cabinets are easy to dismount, you could take them down, cut a large enough access in the drywall (from center of stud to center of stud) behind where they hang to allow you to use a long bit to drill the double top plate. And then feed in a snake through the hole into the attic and out towards where the attic headroom is enough to work. You could probably reach back far enough to staple the cable to the middle of the side of a joist not too far from the top plate.

Then the drywall patch gets secured back to the studs. If this is a garage with living space on the other side, you'd need to at least tape the joints, but otherwise you could just rehang the uppers.

If the lowers weren't there, you could probably do the above from the single gang hole (or maybe a double gang hole for better access) for the final receptacles, using a long flexible bit with a centering attachment so you don't get the edge of the top plate. But with the lowers in place, I don't think you'd have enough access to get the flex bit into the stud bay.

Depending on what's going on in the side walls, you could consider running plug mold the full length of the back wall, up against the underside of the uppers. Even supplied by a new circuit from your panel, or pigtailed to the existing circuit.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Martina]

If the wall cabinets are easy to dismount, you could take them down, cut a large enough access in the drywall (from center of stud to center of stud) behind where they hang to allow you to use a long bit to drill the double top plate. And then feed in a snake through the hole into the attic and out towards where the attic headroom is enough to work. You could probably reach back far enough to staple the cable to the middle of the side of a joist not too far from the top plate.

Then the drywall patch gets secured back to the studs. If this is a garage with living space on the other side, you'd need to at least tape the joints, but otherwise you could just rehang the uppers.

If the lowers weren't there, you could probably do the above from the single gang hole (or maybe a double gang hole for better access) for the final receptacles, using a long flexible bit with a centering attachment so you don't get the edge of the top plate. But with the lowers in place, I don't think you'd have enough access to get the flex bit into the stud bay.

Depending on what's going on in the side walls, you could consider running plug mold the full length of the back wall, up against the underside of the uppers. Even supplied by a new circuit from your panel, or pigtailed to the existing circuit.

Cheers, Wayne

Wayne,

Once again thank you for your time and valuable feedback. I've never heard of plugmold and actually had to research it. Brilliant idea and one that I am now seriously considering.

The cabinets are located on an exterior wall, so there is no living space behind it. Although possible, I could remove the upper cabinets, but prefer not to mess with them unless I absolutely have to. There is also a space of about 5 inches on both sides of the cabinets, so they are not fully running from wall to wall.

With regards to running the wire from the attic to the plugmold- is the pull elbow an option again, since I would only be routing a single 12/2 through it or are there any other ways to configure a conduit?

Thanks again for all your help. Much appreciated!

Martina

 

[wwhitney]

Your diagram makes it look like the panel is not far away on the left hand wall, so would you even need to have a cable go into the attic to get to the plugmold? Could you just run through the wall from panel to plugmold?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Martina]

Your diagram makes it look like the panel is not far away on the left hand wall, so would you even need to have a cable go into the attic to get to the plugmold? Could you just run through the wall from panel to plugmold?

Cheers, Wayne

Unfortunately, my diagram did not reflect the proper location of the panel. In actuality, it is much further down to the left (see attachment # 1). I also attached an exterior shot of that same wall to give you a better idea. Introducing a new circuit would be ideal, but I'm afraid I'd have to open the entire wall to run the wire through all the studs in order to route it to the cabinets. I guess I could also run it along the very bottom of that wall. I remember seeing a YouTube video on that.

I also thought of one other option- the wall located to the right of the cabinets (see attachment # 3). It actually encloses our gas water heater and has fairly easy access from above. Not sure though if that would be a violation of NEC, since it's in such close proximity to our water heater. If all fails, I may just end up going with your other idea of removing a single wall cabinet, cutting a hole in the drywall and try to access the top plate from below.

Thanks a lot, Wayne!

 

[wwhitney]

Does the water heater closet have open stud bays? Then it would be easy to come into that wall and through the studs to the outside wall. If drywalled, and the closet were bigger, that would be a decent place to open up a couple stud bays of drywall for the horizontal transit. But with the water heater in there, I imagine you don't want to do any drywall work in there.

BTW, the pulling elbow is not an option as previously commented. Exposed NM above the uppers would be better, and whether that is allowed is a judgement call by the local jurisdiction (is it "exposed to damage"?). You could install a frieze board above the cabinets, running to the ceiling, ideally on 3 sides, and then just use the space behind it for your NM cable. That assumes that lying flat on the ceiling joists and reaching the exterior wall top plate with a right angle drill is not feasible. An alternative to boxing in the soffit and using a pulling elbow would be to use an actual electrical box, say a 4x4x4, tight to the wall and ceiling, to make the transit.

There's also wiremold, which is an exposed surface mounted raceway, and is compatible with plugmold. Both of them are a real pain to work with though, if you can install recessed boxes and pull cables in the framing cavities, that's definitely easier.

Anyway, I'm about out of ideas. This is definitely a situation where an experienced electrician is likely to have better ideas.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Martina]

Does the water heater closet have open stud bays? Then it would be easy to come into that wall and through the studs to the outside wall. If drywalled, and the closet were bigger, that would be a decent place to open up a couple stud bays of drywall for the horizontal transit. But with the water heater in there, I imagine you don't want to do any drywall work in there.

BTW, the pulling elbow is not an option as previously commented. Exposed NM above the uppers would be better, and whether that is allowed is a judgement call by the local jurisdiction (is it "exposed to damage"?). You could install a frieze board above the cabinets, running to the ceiling, ideally on 3 sides, and then just use the space behind it for your NM cable. That assumes that lying flat on the ceiling joists and reaching the exterior wall top plate with a right angle drill is not feasible. An alternative to boxing in the soffit and using a pulling elbow would be to use an actual electrical box, say a 4x4x4, tight to the wall and ceiling, to make the transit.

There's also wiremold, which is an exposed surface mounted raceway, and is compatible with plugmold. Both of them are a real pain to work with though, if you can install recessed boxes and pull cables in the framing cavities, that's definitely easier.

Anyway, I'm about out of ideas. This is definitely a situation where an experienced electrician is likely to have better ideas.

Cheers, Wayne

Wayne, thank you so much for your time and valuable input. You've gone above and beyond to help me and I've learned a lot from you in the process. I'm now down to evaluating all of the different ideas and then make a decision as to which way to proceed.

Thanks again and have a good evening! Martina